Round 4 : Rebels v Reds. Friday Night (Melbourne)

[Strewthcobber]

I will bow down to those who have greater knowledge at this than me. It does sound like World Rugby/RA need to review some of this latest research or at least review how it's being applied by All Blacks and others.

In elite rugby, major loads include preparing for, and participating in, matches. Over recent years, evidence has been growing to support load management as an injury prevention strategy

(And I acknowledge load management may not = resting for games)

Player load | World Rugby

Information from World Rugby and players' body IRP about measuring and managing player load in rugby.

www.world.rugby

Was it Cheika who was big on his players not playing more than 4 weeks in a row?

 

[Strewthcobber]

Anyway, Doran at the Roar reporting Lynagh will be rested (HMP in), Petaia and Paisami back via the bench, and Blake in for Fa’agase.

 

[liquor box]

It is hard to compare rugby to other sports, but pre load management there were cricketers who never missed matches for years on end, Pete Rose played 745 games in succession without a rest in MLB.

A lot depends on the player, for me unless a player is injured, I would have concerns if they were requesting a game off as I want all of my players to fight to play.

 

[KevinO]

If you earned the jersey, why would you give someone a opportunity to take it off you. I would never volunteer to give up my spot and risk somebody having a blinder and taking it from me. They want it, come and get it, but you bloody well in for a fight to get it.

 

[RugbyReg]

Anyway, Doran at the Roar reporting Lynagh will be rested (HMP in), Petaia and Paisami back via the bench, and Blake in for Fa’agase.

I assume Ravai starts at 1 with Blake on the bench. Ravai v Tupou at the scrum is a good battle.

 

[Red Twist]

I wouldn't call it a rest, but you still want to manage game time minutes / load on a player to ensure that they're able to perform across the season rather than load them up and wonder why they start breaking down.

Uru cramped up big time at the tail end of that game and it wasn't that warm on Saturday. I'd suggest he either needs to come off earlier or have Cormac start with Uru coming off the bench.

Then there's the theory that we aren't playing enough games compared to other competitions in other parts of the world and is a huge factor in Wallaby woes.
Super Rugby is a sprint. If you're fit and in form, you play.

 

[Strewthcobber]

Are the All Blacks getting this wrong? Or just shows the different emphasis of the two countries?

In recent seasons, All Blacks have been limited to playing no more than five games in a row and the uncertainty of player availability was highlighted as a sticking point among fans in last year’s New Zealand rugby governance review.

Under Robertson’s model, players will still have to observe rest weeks, but there will be flexibility around when those rest weeks are observed, based on the player’s workload and the team’s draw. The Herald understands there will be a requirement for two rest weeks, but there is the opportunity for players to feature in more than the previous threshold of five games in a row before observing one.

 

[KevinO]

Then there's the theory that we aren't playing enough games compared to other competitions in other parts of the world and is a huge factor in Wallaby woes.
Super Rugby is a sprint. If you're fit and in form, you play.

The theory is easy, Super Rugby is not enough games. Was thinking of players to compare, both with similar level of tests caps and similar style careers.

James Slipper v Cian Healy (funnily enough, both 1.85m and 117kg)
134 test v 128 test, both missed games due to injury over time but when fit remained in the best 23.
171 Super Rugby games v 271 Leinster games, now Healy started for Leinster in 2007 compared to Slipper 2010, but no way is it possible for Slipper to play 100 games in 3 seasons. Also take into account the IRFU rest policy with Internationals pretty much missing the first couple of games every year and then a few more throughout the season.

 

[Strewthcobber]

The theory is easy, Super Rugby is not enough games. Was thinking of players to compare, both with similar level of tests caps and similar style careers.

James Slipper v Cian Healy (funnily enough, both 1.85m and 117kg)
134 test v 128 test, both missed games due to injury over time but when fit remained in the best 23.
171 Super Rugby games v 271 Leinster games, now Healy started for Leinster in 2007 compared to Slipper 2010, but no way is it possible for Slipper to play 100 games in 3 seasons. Also take into account the IRFU rest policy with Internationals pretty much missing the first couple of games every year and then a few more throughout the season.

Healy is being rested from plenty of URC games over the last few years though right? And coming off the bench?

Edit - just checked, Healy has played 40 times, and started 9 games for Leinster in the last 3 seasons

 

[KevinO]

Healy is being rested from plenty of URC games over the last few years though right? And coming off the bench?

Edit - just checked, Healy has played 40 times, and started 9 games for Leinster in the last 3 seasons

Yep, still would have him at 230 in a season less if you minus those 3 years from the total. Super Rugby is too short, I have no doubts about that.

 

[Strewthcobber]

Yep, still would have him at 230 in a season less if you minus those 3 years from the total. Super Rugby is too short, I have no doubts about that.

I don't disagree. But I don't think it's too short a season for the test players, it's the guys who don't make the Wallabies who aren't playing enough

Ireland recognise this too - look at how few games Sexton was playing for Leinster. He only started 68 games over 8 seasons

 

[Dctarget]

REBELS (1-15): Matt Gibbon, Jordan Uelese, Taniela Tupou, Josh Canham, Lukhan Salakaia-Loto, Josh Kemeny, Vaiolini Ekuasi, Rob Leota (c), Ryan Louwrens, Carter Gordon, Glen Vaihu, David Feliuai, Filipo Daugunu, Lachie Anderson, Andrew Kellaway

RESERVES: Ethan Dobbins, Isaac Kailea, Sam Talakai, Tuaina Taii Tualima, Maciu Nabolakasi, Angelo Smith, Jake Strachan, James Tuttle

6/2 bench...

 

[Dctarget]

REDS (1-15): Peni Ravai, Matt Faessler, Zane Nonggorr, Seru Uru, Ryan Smith, Liam Wright (co-c), Fraser McReight, Harry Wilson, Tate McDermott (co-c), Harry McLaughlin-Phillips, Mac Grealy, Isaac Henry, Josh Flook, Suliasi Vunivalu, Jock Campbell

RESERVES: Josh Nasser, George Blake, Jeffery Toomaga-Allen, Cormac Daly, John Bryant, Kalani Thomas, Tom Lynagh, Jordan Petaia

 

[Wilson]

What's the word on Maciu Nabolakasi? Looks like he's a local product.

Will be interesting to see how the Rebels approach the breakdown here, the last few games they've avoided contesting the vast majority of them giving their opponents a lot of quick ball. I have a feeling the Reds might eviscerate them if they do it again, particularly with McLaughlin-Phillips pulling the strings.

 

[TSR]

Two good teams. And 4 weeks in so should be expecting things to be starting to click. Winner should at least be in the top 3. Should be a cracking game.

 

[Dctarget]

What's the word on Maciu Nabolakasi? Looks like he's a local product.

Fijian who was playing for the Rising in 2017, been in and around the Rebels, came on the tour to Japan end of last year as an add on.

 

[Wilson]

Fijian who was playing for the Rising in 2017, been in and around the Rebels, came on the tour to Japan end of last year as an add on.

Another lock/backrow or more of a straight backrow/potential openside? I can never tell with Foote's bench numbering

 

[Dctarget]

Another lock/backrow or more of a straight backrow/potential openside? I can never tell with Foote's bench numbering

Definitely more a backrower, seems decent over the ball. Can't say I know too much about him, some of our footscray fans might be able to help

 

[KevinO]

Happy enough with the Rebels starting lineup, and forward depth on the bench is a concern.

 

[emuarse]

REDS (1-15): Peni Ravai, Matt Faessler, Zane Nonggorr, Seru Uru, Ryan Smith, Liam Wright (co-c), Fraser McReight, Harry Wilson, Tate McDermott (co-c), Harry McLaughlin-Phillips, Mac Grealy, Isaac Henry, Josh Flook, Suliasi Vunivalu, Jock Campbell

RESERVES: Josh Nasser, George Blake, Jeffery Toomaga-Allen, Cormac Daly, John Bryant, Kalani Thomas, Tom Lynagh, Jordan Petaia

No Hunter Paisami this week then.
Probably a good decision to rest him for the next game.