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Rod McQueen couldn't coach

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spooony

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Brisbok said:
You obviously come from the school of thought that rugby works in four year cycles and you are only judged on your success by your results at the RWC. The results inbetween those 4 years are meaningless as they can be attributed to "building for the World Cup".
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Well if he did not win the WC he would have been forgotten. Everyone remembers Kristie, Macqueen, Woodward, White and Henry but no one really cares about Maines, Dubroca, Jones and Lievremont.
 
Brisbok

Brisbok

Cyril Towers (30)
spooony said:
Well if he did not win the WC he would have been forgotten. Everyone remembers Kristie, Macqueen, Woodward, White and Henry but no one really cares about Maines, Dubroca, Jones and Lievremont.
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Does "everyone" remember Nick Mallett for the Boks? He didn't win a world cup, so you might not remember him. I certainly do. I seem to remember him having a world record (at that stage) of 17 consecutive test wins.

I guess it depends who the "everyone's" are that you are referring to? The rugby "fans" who watch rugby when the world cup is on because of the publicity it receives, or the rugby fans who follow the game on a week to week basis.
 
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spooony

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Brisbok said:
Does "everyone" remember Nick Mallett for the Boks? He didn't win a world cup, so you might not remember him. I certainly do. I seem to remember him having a world record (at that stage) of 17 consecutive test wins.

I guess it depends who the "everyone's" are that you are referring to? The rugby "fans" who watch rugby when the world cup is on because of the publicity it receives, or the rugby fans who follow the game on a week to week basis.
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Yes because he won 17 games in a row. But do they see him in the same lime light as as WC coach no. None of those coaches did some remarkable like a world record equaling winning streak. If they did not won the WC they would have been forgotten. Look at White's 2006 record it was awful.

Just ask anyone you see who was the French 99 WC coach. Then ask them who coached Australia and see what I mean. White's idea was to build for the WC and that was his mission. He lost got plundered won some up and down rollercoaster ride he enjoyed then he won the WC. I think if you ask any coach what they will choose, a WC trophy or a tri nations trophy they won on BP cause he lost within 7 he would say WC.
 
The_Brown_Hornet

The_Brown_Hornet

John Eales (66)
As much I hate the "four year cycle" mentality of international rugby today, it is the reality. If Graham Henry had not won the RWC last year, there would always be that asterisk next to his name. He'd be considered a great coach, but not good enough to win a RWC. Jake, MacQueen and Lord Bald are considered great coaches of the pro era because they won a lot of matches, but mostly because they won the RWC. I don't like it, but what can you do.
 
Brisbok

Brisbok

Cyril Towers (30)
The_Brown_Hornet said:
As much I hate the "four year cycle" mentality of international rugby today, it is the reality. If Graham Henry had not won the RWC last year, there would always be that asterisk next to his name. He'd be considered a great coach, but not good enough to win a RWC. Jake, MacQueen and Lord Bald are considered great coaches of the pro era because they won a lot of matches, but mostly because they won the RWC. I don't like it, but what can you do.
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I agree, the ultimate success of a coach will be determined by whether or not he has won a world cup. However, I don't think it should be the sole measure of success and I don't think any coach should be allowed to essentially write off the results in the 3 years between world cups as a "building" period for the next world cup.

The most successful coach should be the one that wins the world cup, but also has a very high success rate between world cups. Graham Henry and his team probably fall into this category as they had a very successful team over a long period of time. Although the fact that they were given 8 years in the role might detract from their success slightly as there are not many International coaches who get the same opportunity.
 
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spooony

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Me agree as well. Unfortunately the rugby public are not a very patient lot. They do not like losing no matter for what purpose
 
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