Reds vs Bulls 2011R09

[RugbyReg]

I don't really buy into state based faux-hatred. It's a bit silly.

that may be, but as Link pointed out, the conference system kind of encourages stronger state parochialism. For instance last night, every Tah supporter should have been death-riding the Reds because of the impact it has on the conference system. As it stands now, the Tahs are out of the finals (if played now). The only guaranteed chance they have of making it is to finish first, so the Reds losing last night (particularly after the loss to the Blues) was critical to them.

 

[tranquility]

Speak for yourself. You're not talking about the Tahs playing the Reds, you're talking about the Tahs in isolation. If you want to see the Tahs falling further and further behind the Reds, it implies you would prefer to see the Tahs lose to, say, the Blues and / or any other non-Aus team. This is the bit I don't get. You can keep your hate theory - it doesn't wash with me mate. You seem to hate the Tahs, not all opposition. Why not just say that?
I would rather see all the Aus teams going well, and obviously my team to win matches against them.

I don't agree, I hate the Tahs. I also love that many 'myths' are proving unfounded.

1. TC is the perfect 12 for the way the Tahs play the game, blah blah.
2. The Waratahs pack is an unmovable force.
3. The Tahs only play dour football, because they understand 'winning' rugby
4. Kane Douglas is an all-star lock who was robbed by not getting selected over Rob Simmonds

 

[Victorian Reds Fan]

That's never been my experience with rugby. It has always been a collegiate kind of sport, barbecues after the game, hail fellow well met, that kind of thing.

'Hating' other Australian teams sounds suspiciously like State of Origin to me.

I don't follow league. I think it comes from my following of footy. God I hate Carlton.

 

[Victorian Reds Fan]

I don't agree, I hate the Tahs. I also love that many 'myths' are proving unfounded.

1. TC is the perfect 12 for the way the Tahs play the game, blah blah.
2. The Waratahs pack is an unmovable force.
3. The Tahs only play dour football, because they understand 'winning' rugby
4. Kane Douglas is an all-star lock who was robbed by not getting selected over Rob Simmonds

Agree on all points.

 

[Grandmaster Flash]

Moving away from the state v state shitfight...

Thought Benny Lucas was great when he came on - so much vigour for a little bloke, and that tackle on Kirchner? in goal was a ripper.

 

[James Buchanan]

that may be, but as Link pointed out, the conference system kind of encourages stronger state parochialism. For instance last night, every Tah supporter should have been death-riding the Reds because of the impact it has on the conference system. As it stands now, the Tahs are out of the finals (if played now). The only guaranteed chance they have of making it is to finish first, so the Reds losing last night (particularly after the loss to the Blues) was critical to them.

I disagree. If both teams had beaten their respective opponents last night, then they would both be in contention for a finals space. The above way of thinking is negative and achieves very little. It presupposes that we will only get 1 team into the finals. Instead, if every Australian team defeated every foreign team they played (which is unlikely, but go with me for a moment) each team would have at least 36 points by the end of the season, and every foreign team would be struggling for points as they would have dropped 16-20 points.

The reason why we are suddenly looking at 3 potential NZ finalists is because they have beaten the foreign teams that they have faced. The reason we are looking at only having 1 Australian finalist is because aside from the Reds, they have failed to beat foreign sides (by and large).

The conclusion is simple. The best possible outcome for Australian rugby is for every Australian side to beat every foreign side they play and then have hard fought tussles against each other to determine the internal order. The worst possible outcome for Australian rugby is for teams to lose to foreign teams, no matter what. Because in doing that they promote more foreign teams into the wildcard positions, and reduce our chances of getting teams in there.

 

[The_Brown_Hornet]

that may be, but as Link pointed out, the conference system kind of encourages stronger state parochialism. For instance last night, every Tah supporter should have been death-riding the Reds because of the impact it has on the conference system. As it stands now, the Tahs are out of the finals (if played now). The only guaranteed chance they have of making it is to finish first, so the Reds losing last night (particularly after the loss to the Blues) was critical to them.

Fair call and let me also point out that I love the conference system and the local derbies. I just don't buy into hating other teams because of which state they are from. The rivalries between particular teams are good value though.

With respect to who plays in finals, well that's pretty much every man for himself and completely understandable.

 

[DPK]

On the other hand, the other Aussie fans should have been siding with the Reds defense, willing them on to prevent the Bulls from securing a bonus point. The Reds have probably sewn up the AusCon- time to start thinking about the combined table.

 

[The_Brown_Hornet]

Yep

 

[tranquility]

Moving away from the state v state shitfight...

Thought Benny Lucas was great when he came on - so much vigour for a little bloke, and that tackle on Kirchner? in goal was a ripper.

Benny is almost the perfect bench player, and I don't mean that as criticism. He adds real value to a Reds 22.

 

[Sully]

presupposes

Can we get some kind of Goat penalty system in here for using big words!

 

[James Buchanan]

Can we get some kind of Goat penalty system in here for using big words!

Eh, everyone has the internet. Its not that hard to find out what words mean.

 

[cyclopath]

I don't agree, I hate the Tahs. I also love that many 'myths' are proving unfounded.

1. TC is the perfect 12 for the way the Tahs play the game, blah blah.
2. The Waratahs pack is an unmovable force.
3. The Tahs only play dour football, because they understand 'winning' rugby
4. Kane Douglas is an all-star lock who was robbed by not getting selected over Rob Simmonds

At least you actually state a position, you hate the Tahs. However...
1. At a rough guess, I would say the number of Tahs fans on this site who really think TC is a perfect 12 would be much lower than you suggest - especially after Bruce and WJ are excluded from the sample group! You must have missed a lot of posts on the subject, methinks.
2. Ditto the often discussed shortcomings of the Tahs pack around the park, with the perhaps minor exception that they usually scrum pretty well. "Soft, didn't show up, passive..." and those are usually the comments of most Tahs fans.
3. No, they play that way (old style Connolly rugby) because they are only sporadically capable of entertaining "Link Reds style" rugby in short, fruitless bursts when they are ahead by 30, or so far behind it doesn't matter.
4. Again, you ought to read a bit more closely - Kane has been roundly slated this year for his poor play, which has been nowhere near the level of 2010, when he deservedly was mentioned for possible higher honours.

You are helping to propagate myths by half-creating a few of your own.

 

[tranquility]

At least you actually state a position, you hate the Tahs. However...
1. At a rough guess, I would say the number of Tahs fans on this site who really think TC is a perfect 12 would be much lower than you suggest - especially after Bruce and WJ are excluded from the sample group! You must have missed a lot of posts on the subject, methinks.
2. Ditto the often discussed shortcomings of the Tahs pack around the park, with the perhaps minor exception that they usually scrum pretty well. "Soft, didn't show up, passive..." and those are usually the comments of most Tahs fans.
3. No, they play that way (old style Connolly rugby) because they are only sporadically capable of entertaining "Link Reds style" rugby in short, fruitless bursts when they are ahead by 30, or so far behind it doesn't matter.
4. Again, you ought to read a bit more closely - Kane has been roundly slated this year for his poor play, which has been nowhere near the level of 2010, when he deservedly was mentioned for possible higher honours.

You are helping to propagate myths by half-creating a few of your own.

Oh please, it is fantastic that these recent loses have ingrained a little humility into the Tah faithful. However it doesn't take a overly long memory to remember a different story.

 

[cyclopath]

I would disagree - there have been many Tahs fans who have been quite critical of Tahs play and their under-performance for a few years on this site. You make the mistake of taking the position of some Tahs fans as being that of the majority, just as some of us have done for Reds' fans in the past ( I am as guilty as any). I would be careful before adopting the moral high ground on humility - we all have long memories, and no group of fans has a mortgage on "Winning well".
Anyway, apologies to Reds fans for helping derail the thread.

 

[daz]

=Groucho;227417'Hating' other Australian teams sounds suspiciously like State of Origin to me.

Or a comment made by a member of an AFL cheer squad.

 

[Victorian Reds Fan]

Or a comment made by a member of an AFL cheer squad.

I am an Essendon member, but no member of any cheer squad. Also, there is no State of Origin in footy anymore. You think I am bad; try going to an a-league game.

 

[Groucho]

This might be a controversial opinion, but I'll put it out there. Everyone on here who 'hates' other Australian teams seems to be a Reds fan. Maybe it's just a statistical fluke, or maybe I've only seen the Reds posts, but that's how it's coming over to me.

 

[qwerty51]

It's quite amazing how arrogant some Reds fans have become with a tiny bit of success so far. It wasn't long ago we beat them 30-6. Don't remember any of the Tahs fans going on like they have.

 

[TOCC]

It's quite amazing how arrogant some Reds fans have become with a tiny bit of success so far. It wasn't long ago we beat them 30-6. Don't remember any of the Tahs fans going on like they have.

Yep, lucky NSW fans are completely immune to arrogance and gloating