Reds 2018

[Linebreaker]

Slipper has been playing for the Reds since 2010. He's never played for any other clubs, I don't think he has even contemplated playing for any other club be it in Australia or overseas. Slipper is 28, still a baby in porp years; I almost expect another 8 years of service to Queensland! While I was very disappointed to see him not retained as captain, and am sure he was too, this is the only slight he would have against the Reds.
I don't expect him to be going anywhere!

Having said all of that, if he was to leave I don't think we'd be in too much trouble, Fa'agasi is a beast -- he could easily start on another Super Rugby team, I'm sure he'd be more than capable of stepping up to fill the hole.
I'd also point out we would still have the 900 year old George Smith and Higgers, the two Smith boys, Lucas and while he's young Samu has had a tone of experience. Also worst case if we need / want we have Karmichael Hunt and Quade Cooper who could be considered leaders and have a wealth of experience.

While these are the baby Reds, they are young not inexperienced.

Yes "baby" reds.. at 20/21 you haven't had must experience at all, some of these kids hadn't even played prem grade... and it shows.

 

[Zero_Cool]

You are crazy. Folau is an elite rugby player. Tries are king and he scores them at a elite level

Folau is now what 28, in 2019 he'd be 29/30. He'd be on a 3 year contract minimum, at the end of his contract he'd be say 33. Plus he'd be on at least 750k likely close to 1 million. Mix in that Quade and KHunt might still be contracted -- we would be looking at say 2 million of our 5 million salary cap going to only 3 players. This is how guys like Hamish Stewart, Liam Wright and Caleb Timu go overseas.

We spend too much money on old players who may or may not be that good. Then we look around and Matt To'omua and a host of other quality young Aussie players are playing in France.

Yes Folau is a good player right now, but for an aging star he relies too much on his physical abilities, and he's one tackle away from not having those, if it was say Beale we were looking at I'd be more in favour of it (not that I like Beale more, I don't but,) because he doesn't depend on his athletic ability, if you take that away from him (or reduce it somewhat) he's still a good player.

 

[Zero_Cool]

Folau's wife thinking out loud via instagram he'll be in NZ before we know it.View attachment 9841

He's so going to the Blues!

 

[liquor box]

Folau is now what 28, in 2019 he'd be 29/30. He'd be on a 3 year contract minimum, at the end of his contract he'd be say 33. Plus he'd be on at least 750k likely close to 1 million. Mix in that Quade and KHunt might still be contracted -- we would be looking at say 2 million of our 5 million salary cap going to only 3 players. This is how guys like Hamish Stewart, Liam Wright and Caleb Timu go overseas.

We spend too much money on old players who may or may not be that good. Then we look around and Matt To'omua and a host of other quality young Aussie players are playing in France.

Yes Folau is a good player right now, but for an aging star he relies too much on his physical abilities, and he's one tackle away from not having those, if it was say Beale we were looking at I'd be more in favour of it (not that I like Beale more, I don't but,) because he doesn't depend on his athletic ability, if you take that away from him (or reduce it somewhat) he's still a good player.

I have a hatred for Beale after the incident with Link but would prefer him over Israel any day.

An injury that affects Israel's ability to run and swerve (think QC (Quade Cooper)'s knee injury) and he would become an average player. Same injury to Beale and he can still kick and pass both ways at a high level.

I think it is a case of we are building a champion team and not a team of champions

 

[TOCC]

Folau is now what 28, in 2019 he'd be 29/30. He'd be on a 3 year contract minimum, at the end of his contract he'd be say 33. Plus he'd be on at least 750k likely close to 1 million. Mix in that Quade and KHunt might still be contracted -- we would be looking at say 2 million of our 5 million salary cap going to only 3 players. This is how guys like Hamish Stewart, Liam Wright and Caleb Timu go overseas.

We spend too much money on old players who may or may not be that good. Then we look around and Matt To'omua and a host of other quality young Aussie players are playing in France.
.

Karmichael won’t be contracted for 2019..

Folau barely cost the Tahs $150,000 under the salary cap due to a few allowances allowed for cross-code converts and third party agreements.

Mat To'omua is the same age as Folau.

 

[Zero_Cool]

Karmichael won’t be contracted for 2019..

Folau barely cost the Tahs $150,000 under the salary cap due to a few allowances allowed for cross-code converts and third party agreements.

Mat To'omua is the same age as Folau.

That's kind of insane given he earns about 2 million dollars a year, if that's the case we have some seriously messed up financial systems in Rugby Union. I know a few people at the QRU are constantly bitching about the 'Waratahs Centric Focus' of Rugby Australia but if that's true -- that is beyond unacceptable! (Particularly when you consider Quade get around a third of his pay through 'ARU Top Up', not sure about Hunt but I doubt he's too similar.)

Shouldn't we be rewarding players who play our game the whole way through?

Regarding To'omua he's a bad example, I couldn't be bothered to go find a young guy with potential who has gone to Japan or France recently (although France tends to take them when they are a little older), but I think the point I am driving at is clear.

 

[Braveheart81]

The marquee player only contributes $150k to the Super Rugby cap.

Every team can sign one. Most teams sign an foreign player. The Reds signed Hunt and the Tahs signed Folau.

Folau's $2m a year included money from Japan which so far hasn't come because he opted not to play there.

Shouldn't we be rewarding players who play our game the whole way through?


Regarding To'omua he's a bad example, I couldn't be bothered to go find a young guy with potential who has gone to Japan or France recently (although France tends to take them when they are a little older), but I think the point I am driving at is clear.

Why? It's a global market and a lot of players switch codes at some point.

Why should we pay an inferior player more and risk losing one of our best players and certainly our most marketable?

It is regrettable that we lose the players just outside our key Wallabies because the discrepancy in what they can earn and what we can pay them is the greatest but I don't really see a good way around it.

 

[TOCC]

Not just because he is a marquee player, but excuse there are allowances for cross code converts which don’t fall under the salary cap. Reds currently use theirs on Karmichael. Rebels on Koroibete.

That's kind of insane given he earns about 2 million dollars a year, if that's the case we have some seriously messed up financial systems in Rugby Union. I know a few people at the QRU are constantly bitching about the 'Waratahs Centric Focus' of Rugby Australia but if that's true -- that is beyond unacceptable! (Particularly when you consider Quade get around a third of his pay through 'ARU Top Up', not sure about Hunt but I doubt he's too similar.)

Shouldn't we be rewarding players who play our game the whole way through?
.

I disagree, these allowances and third party contracts are the only reason rugby can retain guys like Folau and Pocock and not lose him to NRL or Europe.

 

[Zero_Cool]

I disagree, these allowances and third party contracts are the only reason rugby can retain guys like Folau and Pocock and not lose him to NRL or Europe.

Ultimately there is a pool of money that largely is unchanged. Ultimately that pool is used to sign players to the 4 teams Aussie Teams, some of that money comes from the Clubs, some of that money comes from the ARU/RA.

I do agree that we need to pay players like Folau and Pocock otherwise they'll go overseas or to NRL. Frankly the obfuscation of these systems is exactly the kind of thing we shouldn't be doing. What's the point of having a salary cap if there are all sorts of silly exceptions and allowances.

Ultimately the pool of money for players is largely fixed, why do we need to obfuscate that. (I'm not knocking ARU top ups or things like that -- that just makes sense given a Super Rugby player can be selected to play for the Wallabies. It's common sense that the ARU would wear some of that cost to initially contract the player.)

 

[TOCC]

Salary cap applies talent equalisation measures to 95% of the player pool, marquee allowances apply to the top 5% of the player pool. Retention of guys like Folau and Pocock are an example of that top 5% and those allowances working.

 

[Scoey]

Folau's wife thinking out loud via instagram he'll be in NZ before we know it.View attachment 9841

Steve Hansen has gotten hold of Maria's unlocked phone.

 

[TOCC]

Few Reds and WTS running around in Round 1 of the QPR this weekend:

UQ vs Easts, Richie Asiata at tight head prop for Easts is probably the one of interest here, he has loads of potential

Brothers vs GPS, Harry Hoopert at LHP for Brothers

Sunnybank vs Norths, Jake Strachan and Isaac Lucas at 10 & 12 for Sunnybank... Reece Hewat at 8 and Nick Jooste at 10 for Norths.

Bond vs Wests, Angus Blyth at lock for Bond.. Effie Ma'afu, Sorovi, Maranta and Petaia playing for North

 

[Wilson]

That Strachan v Lucas clash is an interesting one, reds are probably going to want to lock one of them down next year, particularly if Lance does go to Worcester.

Probably a shootout between them and jooste for the city flyhalf spot too.

 

[Zero_Cool]

That Strachan v Lucas clash is an interesting one, reds are probably going to want to lock one of them down next year, particularly if Lance does go to Worcester.

Probably a shootout between them and jooste for the city flyhalf spot too.

I'm a big fan of Jooste, I'm not sure he's quite up to Super Rugby level just yet, but IMO can't be worse than Debrazeni and Maddox; and so far as a flyhalf goes he's probably ahead of both of them so far as my list goes anyway. Plus he's got that flexibility to play 10, 12, 15 and you could throw him on the wing as that JOC (James O'Connor) - Toulon type high skill winger. I'd much rather Jooste in the Maranta in the Reds Squad.

 

[dru]

Courier Mail article: http://www.couriermail.com.au/sport...s/news-story/737d3ec921eb073a58365668ee8f4502

Senior assistant Tony McGahan is the team’s defensive coach and his answer was simple when asked if the Reds would leak 61 tries as they did last year.

“No,” he said. No room for misunderstanding there.

The point was about the Reds defence. Have to say that I am coming around even after the wonky clumsy preseason antics. I've been wondering if perhaps the Reds were pulling together a game plan that either intentionally or simply by similarity, was like the gritty but irritating Chiefs. But as the season progresses I'm starting to suspect that there is a "Reds flavour" overlaying the Thorny core. The Chiefs have not been winning much against Kiwi opposition. Too early this year perhaps, but perhaps the Reds may avoid that problem. <fingers crossed>

Thorn's "they're starting to remember what it means to be a Queenslander" is as corny as hell, but it's going to strike a vein with the Qld public and some Mungo fans that used to also dabble in rugby.

Too many seasons of false hope for me to change this season, but if this keeps up I may well again take up membership in 2019 and start flying to Brisbane for a couple of of rugby games as days long ago. I guess I also need to see a more respectful attitude from HQ to ex Reds as they are moved on.

In the mean time, I'm sure I'll find an excuse to be in Brisbane during a Souths home game some time this winter.

On another note, those that were thinking that the Reds could force/encourage Quade to leave in order to help Reds finance seem to be sadly mistaken. All press from the bloke is of staying in Brisbane looking to break back in to the squad - even though Thorn has not said this is possible. I see reports as well that Cheika has said he would (could?) select Quade from clubland. Does anyone have a reference to this? How bloody odd that would be, and probably not very satisfactory on any number of levels.

Anyhoo - keep it up Reds. Well done Thorn, looking good bloke. (Hell, am I going to actually say this?) Tony - we are liking what we see from you, bloke. Thanks for the effort!

 

[liquor box]

Thorn's "they're starting to remember what it means to be a Queenslander" is as corny as hell, but it's going to strike a vein with the Qld public and some Mungo fans that used to also dabble in rugby.

1. James Slipper - Gold Coast
2. Alex Mafi – Brisbane
3. Taniela Tupou -Tonga
4. Izack Rodda - Lismore
5. Kane Douglas -- Maclean
6. Angus Scott-Young- Brisbane
7. Adam Korczyk - Auckland
8. Caleb Timu- Auckland
9. Ben Lucas- Ipswich
10. Jono Lance- Canberra
11. Chris Feauai-Sautia- Auckland
12. Duncan Paia’aua - Wellington
13. Samu Kerevi - - Fiji
14. Filipo Daugunu - Fiji
15. Aidan Toua - PNG

16. Brandon Paenga-Amosa -- Auckland
17. JP Smith -South Africa
18. Sef Fa’agase –Auckland
19. Harry Hockings –- Proserpine
20. Scott Higginbotham - Perth
21. Tate McDermott – Bundaberg
22. Hamish Stewart – Toowoomba
23. Eto Nabuli - Fiji

qld-7
nsw-2
ACT-1
wa-1

fiji-3
tonga-1
south africa-1
new zealand-6
png-1

I wonder if birthplace affects if you are a Queenslander?


anyway, good to see some types of culture in the squad

 

[dru]

I wonder if birthplace affects if you are a Queenslander?

Ask Brad. Hell I was born in Perth, but am Qld to the core.

 

[Zero_Cool]

1. James Slipper - Gold Coast
2. Alex Mafi – Brisbane
3. Taniela Tupou -Tonga
4. Izack Rodda - Lismore
5. Kane Douglas -- Maclean
6. Angus Scott-Young- Brisbane
7. Adam Korczyk - Auckland
8. Caleb Timu- Auckland
9. Ben Lucas- Ipswich
10. Jono Lance- Canberra
11. Chris Feauai-Sautia- Auckland
12. Duncan Paia’aua - Wellington
13. Samu Kerevi - - Fiji
14. Filipo Daugunu - Fiji
15. Aidan Toua - PNG

16. Brandon Paenga-Amosa -- Auckland
17. JP Smith -South Africa
18. Sef Fa’agase –Auckland
19. Harry Hockings –- Proserpine
20. Scott Higginbotham - Perth
21. Tate McDermott – Bundaberg
22. Hamish Stewart – Toowoomba
23. Eto Nabuli - Fiji

qld-7
nsw-2
ACT-1
wa-1

fiji-3
tonga-1
south africa-1
new zealand-6
png-1

I wonder if birthplace affects if you are a Queenslander?


anyway, good to see some types of culture in the squad

Not disputing the list, but Korczyk is Polish!
He actually played soccer in New Zealand.

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk

 

[waiopehu oldboy]

 

[TOCC]

1. James Slipper - Gold Coast
2. Alex Mafi – Brisbane
3. Taniela Tupou -Tonga
4. Izack Rodda - Lismore
5. Kane Douglas -- Maclean
6. Angus Scott-Young- Brisbane
7. Adam Korczyk - Auckland
8. Caleb Timu- Auckland
9. Ben Lucas- Ipswich
10. Jono Lance- Canberra
11. Chris Feauai-Sautia- Auckland
12. Duncan Paia’aua - Wellington
13. Samu Kerevi - - Fiji
14. Filipo Daugunu - Fiji
15. Aidan Toua - PNG

16. Brandon Paenga-Amosa -- Auckland
17. JP Smith -South Africa
18. Sef Fa’agase –Auckland
19. Harry Hockings –- Proserpine
20. Scott Higginbotham - Perth
21. Tate McDermott – Bundaberg
22. Hamish Stewart – Toowoomba
23. Eto Nabuli - Fiji

qld-7
nsw-2
ACT-1
wa-1

fiji-3
tonga-1
south africa-1
new zealand-6
png-1

I wonder if birthplace affects if you are a Queenslander?


anyway, good to see some types of culture in the squad

sure, we’re a multicultural country though, 1 in 4 Australians were born overseas.
The true stat is that 18 of these guys went to school in QLD, some for only a few years, some for their whole lives.