Reds 2015
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TheBigDog
Nev Cottrell (35)
I'll probably get blasted by some sports medicine 'experts' on this forum but seriously how hard is to be an S&C and get guys in shape? As in, if a player is above his playing weight, make the prick do more running and conditioning. If a player looks malnourished (as Genia did for a while) get him on a bulking program. I know there is a 'science' to it but seriously there have been very visible issues with players looking unfit over the last few seasons.
hammertimethere
Trevor Allan (34)
Sorry BigDog, but it's approximately 16 000 times more complex than that.
Your suggestion is akin to claiming that tinkering on an old junker and tuning a Ferrari are similarly difficult.
Injury prevention is the primary goal. Keep your best players on the park every game and you will win more than you lose. Getting that part right requires a bit more than knowing whether a player is too fat, too skinny, too weak or too slow
Your suggestion is akin to claiming that tinkering on an old junker and tuning a Ferrari are similarly difficult.
Injury prevention is the primary goal. Keep your best players on the park every game and you will win more than you lose. Getting that part right requires a bit more than knowing whether a player is too fat, too skinny, too weak or too slow
Thinker
Darby Loudon (17)
I highly doubt Ollie would move on, I'd love it, but doubt it.
The injury issue is a killer and he and his team of undergrad interns need to be held accountable.
Last year the Reds were clearly unfit and injuries were occurring at such a rate that Graham blamed them solely for the poor start. Ollie always jumps on social media a criticises the commentators for not knowing etc. This makes me think he is a data chaser. Collecting data and pursuing improvements in data simply to cover ones own backside. The only data that matters at that level is the final score. Maybe from his point of view games missed through injury.
At the top of any sport keeping players on the field is number 1 for a S&C staff. Doesn't matter how fast or strong you are if you are sitting in the stands. The academy boys might have slightly different priorities but not the top 30.
Obviously contact injuries are unavoidable, but non-contact injuries shouldn't occur at all.
The things that bugs me most about the S&C department is that it is filled with undergrads/ just graduated 20 year olds rather than the best available staff. I guess it makes them less likely to challenge him. But the overall philosophy is a big step down from when Marsh was in charge. FWIW in the last 18 months there have been a number of world class S&C coaches become available, even in Brisbane, but obviously kids with no experience are better.
I always think back to how the Force operate.
They had one of the countries top S&C coaches as their 2IC. The head of S&C left and the 2IC was a certainty to take over. Except they went and got a guy from England. The 2IC was shattered but stayed, creating a very strong team. Then they brought in David Joyce on top of these two. So they had 3 world class coaches, all capable of heading up a department of their own. I'm not sure we even have one guy capable of that.
The injury issue is a killer and he and his team of undergrad interns need to be held accountable.
Last year the Reds were clearly unfit and injuries were occurring at such a rate that Graham blamed them solely for the poor start. Ollie always jumps on social media a criticises the commentators for not knowing etc. This makes me think he is a data chaser. Collecting data and pursuing improvements in data simply to cover ones own backside. The only data that matters at that level is the final score. Maybe from his point of view games missed through injury.
At the top of any sport keeping players on the field is number 1 for a S&C staff. Doesn't matter how fast or strong you are if you are sitting in the stands. The academy boys might have slightly different priorities but not the top 30.
Obviously contact injuries are unavoidable, but non-contact injuries shouldn't occur at all.
The things that bugs me most about the S&C department is that it is filled with undergrads/ just graduated 20 year olds rather than the best available staff. I guess it makes them less likely to challenge him. But the overall philosophy is a big step down from when Marsh was in charge. FWIW in the last 18 months there have been a number of world class S&C coaches become available, even in Brisbane, but obviously kids with no experience are better.
I always think back to how the Force operate.
They had one of the countries top S&C coaches as their 2IC. The head of S&C left and the 2IC was a certainty to take over. Except they went and got a guy from England. The 2IC was shattered but stayed, creating a very strong team. Then they brought in David Joyce on top of these two. So they had 3 world class coaches, all capable of heading up a department of their own. I'm not sure we even have one guy capable of that.
Ash
Michael Lynagh (62)
Dean Benton and Damian Marsh were both very good for the Reds, Benton in particular in 2011. Benton also has had a great track record for the Brumbies. I wish we never lost Benton, but Marsh was a good replacement. The loss of Marsh was huge I think, and unfortunately it seems, from the outside at least, that Ollie has not been a suitable replacement at all.
Thinker
Darby Loudon (17)
FWIW Benton was just a consultant at the Reds, Marsh was in charge his whole time he was here. Which speaks volumes that Marsh wasn't a know-it-all and prepared to consult others. Benton mainly would thrown two cents in with regards to the programming and mainly done a lot of work on injury prevention and running mechanics. But his CV is pretty darn good in terms of successful outcomes. His time at the Broncos was probably the first time S&C made mainstream news, but even last year getting Japan qualified as a core team on the 7s circuit.
hammertimethere
Trevor Allan (34)
Unsure when and if Benton worked for the Reds. I'm pretty certain Marsh was boss with Ollie kind of the 2nd in charge with more of a focus on the rehab side of things, working one on one with the injured boys in consultation with the physios etc. That arrangement seemed to work well. It was a shame the Brumbies took Marsh back.
If Ollie is moving on, hopefully it is the catalyst for a bit of an overhaul of the high performance department. Getting a head of Strength and Conditioning, a person to work with the injured squad, a small team of physios and a bloke like Joyce to head up the department overall
If Ollie is moving on, hopefully it is the catalyst for a bit of an overhaul of the high performance department. Getting a head of Strength and Conditioning, a person to work with the injured squad, a small team of physios and a bloke like Joyce to head up the department overall
Hugh Jarse
Rocky Elsom (76)
Dean Benton has just been announced as the Wallabies S&C Coach. Must be OK at his job.
http://www.rugby.com.au/wallabies/N...AN-GREY-TO-JOIN-QANTAS-WALLABIES-IN-2015.aspx
http://www.rugby.com.au/wallabies/N...AN-GREY-TO-JOIN-QANTAS-WALLABIES-IN-2015.aspx
B
Bobby Sands
Guest
I didn't know Dean had worked with us? If he has it was in a limited capacity.
Glad he is tied up with the Wallabies, as he gets results wherever he goes. However he never stays around for too long.
The Broncos S&C coach, Alex Corvo, who they poached from the Storm is also very highly regarded. Let's get him to add a little extra to his plate.
Glad he is tied up with the Wallabies, as he gets results wherever he goes. However he never stays around for too long.
The Broncos S&C coach, Alex Corvo, who they poached from the Storm is also very highly regarded. Let's get him to add a little extra to his plate.
FilthRugby
Nicholas Shehadie (39)
Well season 2015 is getting tougher. I think there's this belief in serendipity - that somehow tries will come when chucking the pill around willy-nilly. No real game plan is evident at the moment and I believe it's costing the Reds dearly.
On a side note I thought James O'Connor showed a lot of promise in Red tonight. A solid recruit.
On a side note I thought James O'Connor showed a lot of promise in Red tonight. A solid recruit.
Thinker
Darby Loudon (17)
As I said last week, the Force were awful and made us look better than we were.
It seems like we almost didn't have an off-season as the same problems plague us:
- No ability to attack
- Poor discipline
- High injury count
- Outside backs who are clueless in defence
We have scored 3 tries in 3 games. One was a penalty try from a scrum, another was a mix up at back of scrum and Schatz walking over and the third was counter-attack which was good but probably should have been stopped if Morahan could tackle.
Can we get Steve Meehan a raise? It would be impossible to be this bad if you actually set out to be. He must be a magician and these previous 20 games are clearly a smoke screen for the attacking master class to come.
It seems like we almost didn't have an off-season as the same problems plague us:
- No ability to attack
- Poor discipline
- High injury count
- Outside backs who are clueless in defence
We have scored 3 tries in 3 games. One was a penalty try from a scrum, another was a mix up at back of scrum and Schatz walking over and the third was counter-attack which was good but probably should have been stopped if Morahan could tackle.
Can we get Steve Meehan a raise? It would be impossible to be this bad if you actually set out to be. He must be a magician and these previous 20 games are clearly a smoke screen for the attacking master class to come.
I agree that JOC (James O'Connor) will be good for the Reds, just not at 10. It's a real issue for the team while Quade's out. Anyone from QPR ready to step up?
We are looking a bit lost in attack. I can't recall a set backline move from the last two weeks, I missed the Brumbies game. Had to do with no one running the show though.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
We are looking a bit lost in attack. I can't recall a set backline move from the last two weeks, I missed the Brumbies game. Had to do with no one running the show though.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Strewthcobber
Simon Poidevin (60)
I think that's a bit harsh Ash, there's been a new five- eighth playing every game.
We've had our fifth choice out there
It would be almost more surprising if they did have any shape.
We've had our fifth choice out there
It would be almost more surprising if they did have any shape.
diomac
Frank Nicholson (4)
We should leave Frisby at 10, and move JOC (James O'Connor) to the wing or centers. He's a natural 12 and we didn't recruit him to play 10 or 15 so why play him out of position when Frisby is up to the job at 10 and Turner has been fine at 15.
With the solitary win last week against a poor Force we are in a world of hurt if things don't turn around soon... the Warratahs game could get very bloody at this rate.
With the solitary win last week against a poor Force we are in a world of hurt if things don't turn around soon... the Warratahs game could get very bloody at this rate.
liquor box
Peter Sullivan (51)
While being disappointed with the performance of the team I think we are about a bonus point from where I think we need to be.
I think in the current set up with three conferences that we need to do the following to make the finals.
1- Win all home games
2- Get a bonus point away from home against the Brumbies and NSW even when we lose.
3- Get a win and a bonus point loss away to NZ and SA teams.
This is based on NSW and Brumbies being our biggest threat in Australia.
If we win a game and get a bonus point in a loss when overseas it forces other Australian teams to win both games overseas to get ahead of us.
If we win at home and lose away then we break even not including the bonus points.
Realistically we are not in too bad a position and I think we have a pretty reasonable draw this season.
The problem in a short season is if you lose a couple of games your season can be gone overnight.
I think in the current set up with three conferences that we need to do the following to make the finals.
1- Win all home games
2- Get a bonus point away from home against the Brumbies and NSW even when we lose.
3- Get a win and a bonus point loss away to NZ and SA teams.
This is based on NSW and Brumbies being our biggest threat in Australia.
If we win a game and get a bonus point in a loss when overseas it forces other Australian teams to win both games overseas to get ahead of us.
If we win at home and lose away then we break even not including the bonus points.
Realistically we are not in too bad a position and I think we have a pretty reasonable draw this season.
The problem in a short season is if you lose a couple of games your season can be gone overnight.
T
TOCC
Guest
you need to build momentum and a winning habit as well though, the Reds dont have that currently..
Yes they beat the Force, but the Force were hopeless and I'm amazed that the Force were able to beat the Tah's the week before.. Reds should have beat the Highlanders, that was their best opportunity against a kiwi team and they needed to take away more then just 1 bonus point.
I think the Reds need to simplify the game plan, what they did last week against the Force was effective, play a territorial based game and slog it out. Its obviously easier said then done this week they kicked less and ran the ball more then the previous week, i just don't think the Reds have the partnerships in the back-line or the 5/8 to play an expansive game. JOC (James O'Connor) is a good player, but i still dont think he is a 10.
Yes they beat the Force, but the Force were hopeless and I'm amazed that the Force were able to beat the Tah's the week before.. Reds should have beat the Highlanders, that was their best opportunity against a kiwi team and they needed to take away more then just 1 bonus point.
I think the Reds need to simplify the game plan, what they did last week against the Force was effective, play a territorial based game and slog it out. Its obviously easier said then done this week they kicked less and ran the ball more then the previous week, i just don't think the Reds have the partnerships in the back-line or the 5/8 to play an expansive game. JOC (James O'Connor) is a good player, but i still dont think he is a 10.
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