Rank our props

[fatprop]

Fairbrother was on one leg, Alexander? When? In the Semi Final, I didn't think he was outscrummed in his half of rugby

 

[Gnostic]

Fairbrother on one leg? He was fit going into the game and was injured during it. You commented at the time you were surprised to see Fairbrother dominated by Kepu. The Woodies game was the last round wasn't it? They used three props and the Wicks maintained the same front row throughout and were able to advance their scrum and pressure the Woodies ball.

I was impressed by Kepu this year was easily the best I have seen him against good opponents.

You thoughts on Paddy Ryan - future prospect as he is only 22-23.

 

[fatprop]

I was surprised and I honestly thought in retrospect that Fairbrother must have been wounded, I would expect parity between those two 9 times out of 10


Ryan? we will see, he was behind Jerry and Tilse at Uni with Tilse being moved to THP, If Ryan was really dominant, to me he would have started at THP for Uni. But I thought Uni was far better in the final with Ryan and Tilse,

 

[Slim 293]

Can the Brumbies swap Jerry for Kepu?

Jerry's not going to get a game anyways and it benefits Australia...

Please?

 

[Spewn]

on scrummaging ability?


THPS:

1) Dan Palmer
2) Al Baxter
3) Tim Fairbrother
4) Laurie Weeks
5) Ben Alexander
6) Salesi Ma'afu
7) James Slipper

LHP:

1) Benn Robinson
2) Ben Alexander
3) James Slipper
4) Greg Holmes
5) Tilse
6) Sekope Kepu
7) Jerry
8 ) Ben Daley
9) Matt Dunning

I hesitate to contradict Fatprop, but Palmer was v ordinary when he came on as a replacement in the Super 14. I was interested in how he'd do because I had heard some positive things. Quite poor I thought.

 

[Groucho]

the back of a maxi-taxi.

Where is the disagree button?

 

[fatprop]

Spewn

Was that when he came on a LHP or when he played THP?

He started at LHP against the Highlanders and did pretty well, but he is an out and out THP

 

[topo]

on scrummaging ability?


THPS:

1) Dan Palmer
2) Al Baxter
3) Tim Fairbrother
4) Laurie Weeks
5) Ben Alexander
6) Salesi Ma'afu
7) James Slipper

LHP:

1) Benn Robinson
2) Ben Alexander
3) James Slipper
4) Greg Holmes
5) Tilse
6) Sekope Kepu
7) Jerry
8 ) Ben Daley
9) Matt Dunning

As pure scrummagers:
THP
I'd have Baxter at 1 and Weeks at 2 then Palmer, Fairbrother, BA, Slipper and Salesi for THPs
Don't get me wrong, I'm a fan of Palmer and have been watching him since he was a runt of a 12 yo, but he hasn't had enough game time against top quality opposition yet.
Weeks has been hard done by IMO.

LHP
Agree with FP, except Daley would be ahead of Jerry and Tilse (it hurts me to say that about a couple of Uni boys). Both Jerry and Tilsey are yet to prove it consistently against top quality opposition, whereas Daley had a good S14 season.
I was reasonably impressed with Holmes in the limited opportunities he had this year.

 

[Scarfman]

Yeah, I remember seeing Palmer getting smashed and being surprised. Can't remember the circumstances, though.

 

[topo]

Can the Brumbies swap Jerry for Kepu?

Jerry's not going to get a game anyways and it benefits Australia...

Please?

Very similar players with similar strengths and weaknesses. Kepu has the distinct advantage of not having a broken ankle, though, so I think we'll keep him

 

[qwerty51]

I remember Palmer destroying the Uni scrum in the first half of the final. Things changed in the second half though

 

[Eyes and Ears]

Dan Palmer - I don't think you can judge him against the others until he is regular starter in super rugby team. It seems highly unlikely that he will start ahead of Maafu at the Brumbies this year. Plus his game is not suited to super rugby as he has many deficiencies in the other parts of his game.

Pat Ryan - I thought he looked a great prospect in 2009 but I thought he went backwards in 2010. He has a lot of problems keeping the scrum up at engagement particularly against strong opposition and looks to be penalised quite a bit (v Souths in semi and v Eastwood in ABC match of the day). Maybe one of our Uni fans could tell us if they agree and if the reason was injury or over-confidence.

My ratings -

LHP
1.Robinson (but not in good form)
2.Slipper (looks a great prospect)
3.Alexander (too many penalties in S14 this year)
4.Kepu (huge improvement in 2010)

THP
1.Baxter (too many penalties)
2.Alexander (in terrible form yet)
3.Maafu (not International standard)
4.Weekes (looks too small for mine)

I know this is a bit negative but our scrum has been hopeless for a long time. I'm not sure I can remember a Test Match in many years against a decent team where we have won the scrum contest. I thought the Ben's were the answer and they could still be but they are awful at the moment. I hope Moore makes a difference but I think we will concede at least 1 penalty or pushover try tomorrow night and we will also have a prop with a yellow card.

 

[Spewn]

Spewn

Was that when he came on a LHP or when he played THP?

He started at LHP against the Highlanders and did pretty well, but he is an out and out THP

I might be a bit hazy on this but I think it was either against the highlanders or one of the SA teams. The week after, the same opposition confronted QLD who were quite dominant. I'm thinking it was a SA game when he came on and was poor. I'm pretty sure it was as Lhp but I have to be honest that I cannot quite recall other than being very surprised about how poor he was for that game compared with the QLD front row against the same opposition the next week.

This probably doesn't help but I do remember his lack lustre performance clearly.

 

[Langthorne]

I'm not saying I'm an expert, although I have packed down many times in the past...but anyway...


This is a difficult one as:

-the step up from Super rugby to international rugby is clearly a big one
-we haven't seen enough of most of these guys even in Super rugby
-scrummaging is not done in isolation (the opposition and their own team can make a huge difference)
-form is not constant
-as a result we are left making judgements based on limited views, potential, assumptions

For those reasons, I would give some weight to regular s14 and test appearances, much though I think some of the lower ranked guys could move up the table with more game time (in brackets).

THP (the problem side):

1) Fairbrother (was solid all s14 with some random crap going on around him)
2) Baxter
3) Weeks
4) Alexander
5) Palmer (1)
6) Slipper
7) Ma'afu
8) Kepu
9) Tilse
10) Ryan (basically wanted to list him even though he is yet to play for the Waratahs)


LHP:

1) Robinson (when in form)
2) Alexander
3) Slipper
4) Holmes
5) Tilse (2 - admittedly based on one very impressive cameo)
6) Kepu
7) Yanuyanutawa
8 ) Daley (drops down mainly because he has been exposed at international level)
9) Dunning

 

[Reddy!]

Fatprop, I'm surprised you ranked Alexander so lowly as a THP. I thought you regarded him highly as a tight head scrummager and lowly and a loosehead.