Quade v Barnes... Australia's version of Carlos v Mehrtens?

[Groucho]

Barnes is no Mehrtens.never was never will be… Cooper on his day is far better the Spencer.

On the weekend I did think it was interesting that Barnes chose a cutout pass to Horne when McCabe was a safer option on his right in the open. Horne nearly dropped the ball as the pass was average. Did Barnes do this to avoid passing the ball to Pat McCabe who has been holding down the 12 spot and scoring often? Barnes coverts the 12 spot as Cooper will soon be back at Flyhalf. Frankly I thought this was a telling moment in Barnes psyche…

I think that's insulting.

 

[Groucho]

Frankly Yes, Barnes clearly selected his Tahs team mate rather than the man on his immediate right… and nearly bombed the try with a poor pass. just my honest observation. I wondered why risk it? I feel some of you guys are a little naïve about professional sportsmen…

However.. Perhaps Barnes cut out pass was instinctive and perhaps its was calculated, we’ll never know but he is capable of both and he would have made some these prefered player choices before going onto the field last Saturday night. He didn’t have some sort of epiphany during his line break like Barbs ludicrous epilogue suggested…

Quade Cooper use to do the similar to Matt Giteau at 12. Never gave him the opportunity to do anything with the ball in hand… You see this from time to time at the Wallabies. especially when they come from different clubs.

Wallabies will never be world number one when players think of themselves first before the team result…

Do people here really have problem at G&GR with analsysing a players game? And motivation?

There’s nothing like a good conspiracy theory to flush out the paranoid…

Conspiracy theories begin with the paranoid.

 

[Slim 293]

Even if we were to play a second five at 12 then JOC (James O'Connor) still wouldn't be the best candidate......

For mine:

Playmaker 12: Barnes or Lealiifano
Crash ball 12: McCabe or Tapuai

 

[fatprop]

I understand what you're saying, but it's not necessarily the case. It's the current fashion in some teams, but it doesn't have to be a rule. With a JOC (James O'Connor) or Barnes at 12 you have a second playmaking option or a boot to relieve pressure on your five-eighth when the defence are rushing up.

As long as there is that balance between the crasher and playmaking distributor in the midfield I reckon it's fine. Having McCabe or AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) outside of Barnes or JOC (James O'Connor) at 12 would fulfil all of those criteria.

With Beale at 15, you have that second distributor, having another one at 12 is superfluous.

I agree JOC (James O'Connor) could do it, but it is more about the defensive workload he would be expected to carry and how to get the best bang for the buck from the guy. To me, keep him fresh to counter and be the opportunist/pest/2nd 15

 

[waratahjesus]

JOC (James O'Connor) is an international winger, I don't know when people have seen him play wellat 10,12 or 15 at any level of rugby, but he has played international rugby well at 14 and should be kept there.

There or as a utility sub.

 

[Groucho]

Even if we were to play a second five at 12 then JOC (James O'Connor) still wouldn't be the best candidate..

For mine:

Playmaker 12: Barnes or Lealiifano
Crash ball 12: McCabe or Tapuai

Playmaker 12: Barnes or Lealiifano
Crash ball 12: McCabe
Elusive 12: Tapuai

 

[Paradox]

Lilio is superior to Barnes with ball in and passing - can make the break himself, has good pace, breaks tackles (yes Barnes made a nice break against Wales but that's not his game. Barnes controls a game better that most players. Both can tackle I was calling for a Lilo / Barnes 10 / 12 combo a while back and I think this could still be a goer. I also reckon Kurtley is a natural 13 with his outside break and ability to set up his winger (Bob Dwyer agrees ) . Cooper can play 15. Barnes to one wing and Ioane to another...so in summary..my backline of wet dreams:

9. Genia
10. Lilo
11. Ioane
12. Barnes
13. Beale
14. JOC (James O'Connor)
15. Q Cooper

Bench: 2 of Tomane/Schmoo/AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper)/Speight/McCabe/Taps, N White.

 

[Slim 293]

If we were hypothetically to play Barnes and Lilo in the same backline I would think about playing Lilo at 12 because he is a much stronger ball runner.

This would be an interesting combination:

9. Genia
10. Barnes
11. Ioane
12. Lealiifano
13. McCabe
14. JOC (James O'Connor)/Mitchell
15. Beale

 

[tragic]

Try saving tackles against the Boks and Italy at the RWC showed he can tackle. Coaches, including Link, need to grow a pair and tell the fucker that if he wants to play at 10 he needs to defend at 10 too.

Do you think he defends at 15 because of his poor defence at 10 or his superior counter attacking prowess at 15? He has created numerous tries for the reds in counter attack and I would suggest this has as much to do with his defensive position. At least for the reds I wouldn't shift him to 10 in defence even if he became a brick wall...

 

[Groucho]

Do you think he defends at 15 because of his poor defence at 10 or his superior counter attacking prowess at 15? He has created numerous tries for the reds in counter attack and I would suggest this has as much to do with his defensive position. At least for the reds I wouldn't shift him to 10 in defence even if he became a brick wall.

He defends at 10 for the Wallabies because he's a turnstile.

 

[tragic]

He defends at 10 for the Wallabies because he's a turnstile.

Eh??

 

[waratahjesus]

Do you think he defends at 15 because of his poor defence at 10 or his superior counter attacking prowess at 15? He has created numerous tries for the reds in counter attack and I would suggest this has as much to do with his defensive position. At least for the reds I wouldn't shift him to 10 in defence even if he became a brick wall.

Both are true.

But his counter attack ability from 15 has been found due to his being hidden there in defense.

 

[Paradox]

If we were hypothetically to play Barnes and Lilo in the same backline I would think about playing Lilo at 12 because he is a much stronger ball runner.

This would be an interesting combination:

9. Genia
10. Barnes
11. Ioane
12. Lealiifano
13. McCabe
14. JOC (James O'Connor)/Mitchell
15. Beale

Yes but Lilo has a longer more accurate pass and plays flatter.

 

[Slim 293]

Yes but Lilo has a longer more accurate pass and plays flatter.

That is true.......

 

[Groucho]

Eh??

The reason Quade Cooper defends on the wing for the Wallabies is that he's an absolutely hopeless defender.

He pulls off some great hits in the loose but he's a complete bunny in the line. The selectors know this but think that's a fair trade for his attacking skills.

I broadly agree but Barnes' resurgence has made this a difficult question. On balance, I currently prefer Barnes who will put his body on the line in defence as readily as in attack.

Like Beale did, Cooper needs to learn how to defend, or perhaps more accurately, decide to.

 

[tragic]

He defends at 10 on the wing for the Wallabies because he's a turnstile.

fixed

 

[Groucho]

fixed

My bad, tragic!

 

[Scotty]

Even if we were to play a second five at 12 then JOC (James O'Connor) still wouldn't be the best candidate..

For mine:

Playmaker 12: Barnes or Lealiifano
Crash ball 12: McCabe or Tapuai

Taps is the only one that fits into both types. Let's hope he continues to develop and become an option for our next great 12.

Alternatively JOC (James O'Connor) continues to size up and also fight for that mantle.

 

[Braveheart81]

Alternatively JOC (James O'Connor) continues to size up and also fight for that mantle.

Maybe he needs to be the face of San Remo pasta as well as Swisse vitamins.

 

[It is what it is]

Most teams these days play their best kicker back at, or near full back when defending during phase play.
Dan Carter and the AB's were one of the 1st teams to realise that your No's 11,14 and 15 aren't necessarily your best kickers with respect to distance, placement or accuracy.
Barnes does a lot of this for NSW, and he tackles OK, it's more of a standard practice.
The trick is that if you use your 10 back there, then someone else needs to slot into 10 quickly if your receive some quick turnover ball.