QLD Premier Rugby 2021

[The Nomad]

Sorry for offending you with my concerns about GPS only having two teams in Colts this year and not being competitive.

For the record , Colts 1 finished the season in 8th position with one win over Norths . Colts 2 finished in 7th position .

No Colts teams in 3/4/5’s

 

[Dean Moriarty]

I also think it wrong of the Reds to give Nasser opportunities at hooker ahead of blokes who have proven themselves in the position at junior rep and Premier grade level.

Will be interesting to see what opportunities are given to Nasser next year in the hooker position at the Reds. Then what position he plays for Uni in 2021.

All I know is that if he played in 1,2 or 3 for Uni in the GF, Easts would still have had scrum dominance. Which begs the question as to why any of the Easts front row were not identified as better options than Nasser? In particular Rhys van Nek who is capable and proven at Premier Grade level across 1,2 & 3. Rhys is off to the Rebels in 2021 despite having worked his way through the Reds pathways?

George Francis was also recognised at national level (Australia "A") before the Reds could see anything in him.

Yet another two that Cordingley & Corozza may have missed!

One wonders whether they appreciate what an abundance of hidden talent rests in QPR - Tom Banks is probably the most recent significant star that they failed to properly identify.

The pathway to the Reds is more so GPS School Rugby to Reds rather than School -> Club -> Reds.

Despite Wests inability to be a consistent top 4 club I still find that QPR (& school rugby) provides me with the greatest level of enjoyment in watching rugby in Australia.

Good post and you raise a lot of excellent observations and questions , that , for me flows into a side (systemic) issue.

Rhys Van Nek's season - with the exclamation mark of his Grand Final performance is hardly a head scratch or a "where did he come from" or a QPR loyalists claim of "our boy". The truth is , Rhys attended IGS before transferring to BBC for Grade 11 and 12 - and was a natural and early dominant scrummager that pretty much destroyed anyone and everyone across 2016 and 2017 Schoolboy Rugby. If anyone wanted to run a DNA match test with Rhys and Greg Holmes it would have seemed like a reasonable call. And then on top of this here was also a skill guy who was/is a very good thrower - and was the thrower on that BBC team in 2017. He has been through the local pathway and repped all the way through U20's while building a strong portfolio of work and further development at Easts, where at now age 20 /21 he dominated the QPR competition.

For whatever reason though that I can't fathom he's just always been one of those guys that came through that was unfashionable and not a trendy pathway darling with a lot of (comparative) attention

And now , what of George Blake , who , in the 2019 GPS season absolutely ate every other opponent's lunch - again , a natural scrummager - an absolute disrupter who could dismantle any THP that was thrown at him - and who also was/is a skill player who threw for TSS in 2019.

These 2 x blokes are , for me , easily the most dominant schoolboy set piece exponents over the last 5 years and because of the continual validation of some - that starts from within at their schools by their Coach/DOR and that sit a certain type/profile that captures a certain type of attention .......this is sort of why you now have guys with spots in the pathway (especially set piece prospects) and those that don't and have to go and ply their trade somewhere else.

I am no suggesting it is an endemic issue - it's not. But , here and there , I think there is a preferred "type" that may be a bit hoo-rah in manner that impresses junior Coaches that promote and validate a Dudley Do Right type.

And that is where you can miss a guy who may not be as hoo rah in their outwardly manner, or look and act in a certain way - but that doesn't mean they are the better prospect who still want to dominate their opponent.

 

[Dean Moriarty]

Professor Moriarty, University do shit to recruit? They send letters to several players across schools is my intel. Unfortunately a team of champions rolling through the club rounds couldn't beat a champion team when it mattered. You see that at club and school level frequently. And after a 35-5 flogging of Brothers in the semi, maybe they thought they just needed to turn up? I think someone said entitled? More like complacency but to be honest, anyone could have won that game. The filth just looked hungrier. Maybe you're right that 0-5 was just a coincidence and clubs like GPS would love to be bemoaning that finals record. Instead they were 1 out of 2 but when I was at Uni, that was a percentage that got you a pass.

I wouldn't call sending out 100 form letters out as masterful recruiting or planning. Granted , the token element of what it is, is something further beyond a "tell your mates sausage sizzle"

I guess in Uni's case they have some tuition and boarding scholarships that do,by themselves,bring interest.

I do agree that GPS is losing its identity. Since their Prems win in 2018, there is a lot of bitching about what they need. I agree that the complacency is palpable. But it is not exactly true they haven't had the best Marist players go there. Emosi Tuquiri and Ben Geraghty (MCA rugby captains in 2017 and 2018), Isaac DeFlavis, Ben Bucknell, Ben Byrne, Shaquille McLeod, Matt & Tom Dangerfield and John Downes played in recent years. Some of these guys played QLD Schools. Not many First XV players from 2019 but that might be because of the proportion of year 11 players in that team (5), Colts jumping to Under 20 in 2020, covid uncertainty and yes, quite a few RL advocates. But they might come back. I know of only one from that team who went to UQ and he wasn't playing First Grade, Colts 1 or 2.

Would you have Zac Hogan , Josh Radford , Dougal Perrers , Floyd Aubrey , Nick Baker in your Top 10 Marist players from 2017 to 2020 ? Maybe not Perrers or Radford but I would have thought you'd have to find room for Hogan,Aubrey and Baker with Tuquiri, Geraghty, Byrne , Downes, Moller, Tennison Woods and Law.

In any event , there are at least 5 to 6 decent players that should be in Jeeps Colts program,presently,or in the preceding year or two that arguably have them on the edge of,if not being,a Top 4 team,however those missing players are at Brothers or Uni.

FOOTNOTE : I am told by a reliable source that Aubrey and Baker to Brothers is not a done deal (despite playing some games there in the back end of this season)

 

[RugbyReg]

George Francis was also recognised at national level (Australia "A") before the Reds could see anything in him.

.

He came up from Canberra and was selected by THE REDS to play NRC for QLD Country

 

[Bulldog]

He came up from Canberra and was selected by THE REDS to play NRC for QLD Country

Well give him a Reds deal so that we can see more of him in QPR.

 

[Bulldog]

I wouldn't call sending out 100 form letters out as masterful recruiting or planning. Granted , the token element of what it is, is something further beyond a "tell your mates sausage sizzle"

I guess in Uni's case they have some tuition and boarding scholarships that do,by themselves,bring interest.



Would you have Zac Hogan , Josh Radford , Dougal Perrers , Floyd Aubrey , Nick Baker in your Top 10 Marist players from 2017 to 2020 ? Maybe not Perrers or Radford but I would have thought you'd have to find room for Hogan,Aubrey and Baker with Tuquiri, Geraghty, Byrne , Downes, Moller, Tennison Woods and Law.

In any event , there are at least 5 to 6 decent players that should be in Jeeps Colts program,presently,or in the preceding year or two that arguably have them on the edge of,if not being,a Top 4 team,however those missing players are at Brothers or Uni.

FOOTNOTE : I am told by a reliable source that Aubrey and Baker to Brothers is not a done deal (despite playing some games there in the back end of this season)

Isn't this the point that the traditional school to club transitions (Nudgee to Bros, BBC to Wests, MBAsh to GPS) for better or worse have gone by the wayside for the better part.

GPS can't just expect that every decent rugby player from MBAsh will end up at GPS in Colts. Even if they do it won't ensure colts success.

I would imagine that you would have to form relations with players in their formative years to get them into your colts/senior ranks.

It is no surprise that Brothers & Easts who shared the Doughty Shield and won 9 of the 10 premierships this year have had strong junior numbers for many years - as have GPS (who won the 10th premiership - 4th grade) for that matter.

Also having coaches in GPS 1st XV and at Qld Schoolboy level with links to your club is also another important commodity when looking to secure young talent.

It is a tough gig competing in the arms race for colts talent with Uni & Brothers.

But does colts success convert to QPR success a few years later? We will have to look at Souths and Brothers ss the test cases - as Southd won Colts 1 & 2 in 2019 and Bros colts 1-3 in 2020.

 

[D'Lite Full]

Sorry for offending you with my concerns about GPS only having two teams in Colts this year and not being competitive.

For the record , Colts 1 finished the season in 8th position with one win over Norths . Colts 2 finished in 7th position .

No Colts teams in 3/4/5’s

No offence mate. The table finishes were not acceptable to the club I would imagine. That is why they are looking for a new coach.

 

[D'Lite Full]

I wouldn't call sending out 100 form letters out as masterful recruiting or planning. Granted , the token element of what it is, is something further beyond a "tell your mates sausage sizzle"

I guess in Uni's case they have some tuition and boarding scholarships that do,by themselves,bring interest.



Would you have Zac Hogan , Josh Radford , Dougal Perrers , Floyd Aubrey , Nick Baker in your Top 10 Marist players from 2017 to 2020 ? Maybe not Perrers or Radford but I would have thought you'd have to find room for Hogan,Aubrey and Baker with Tuquiri, Geraghty, Byrne , Downes, Moller, Tennison Woods and Law.

In any event , there are at least 5 to 6 decent players that should be in Jeeps Colts program,presently,or in the preceding year or two that arguably have them on the edge of,if not being,a Top 4 team,however those missing players are at Brothers or Uni.

FOOTNOTE : I am told by a reliable source that Aubrey and Baker to Brothers is not a done deal (despite playing some games there in the back end of this season)

Yes good points. I suppose 100 letters is better than no marketing at all.

 

[Red Heavy]

Isn't this the point that the traditional school to club transitions (Nudgee to Bros, BBC to Wests, MBAsh to GPS) for better or worse have gone by the wayside for the better part.



But does colts success convert to QPR success a few years later? We will have to look at Souths and Brothers ss the test cases - as Southd won Colts 1 & 2 in 2019 and Bros colts 1-3 in 2020.

From 2011 to 2017 UQ won 14 of the 19 colts premiership on offers (and lost in the gf for 2 others)

Around that time they won 8 straight Dougherty shields, 5 prem grade premierships and appeared in 3 more GF's.

Its not a one shoe fits all but I think Uni has showed there is a pretty good correlation between strong colts and successes at premier grade and indeed the rest of the club.

2020 aside colts haven't been as strong at UQ and you have seen the result in the middle to lower grades the last few seasons. Despite losing the 3 GF's (something they did in 2001 before going on to will all 3 in 2002) you would expect a solid improvement across the board for UQ next season.

Wests were building nicely off the back of strong colts in 17/18 until 2020 when they seemed to recruit in a whole Prem grade side at the start of the season. Prems were poor but the middle grades seemed strong from afar

 

[The Nomad]

For me the correlation between success at Colts level and Prem grade would be more related to consistent Top 4 finishes in Colts 1&2 over a number of years rather than winning Colts in the odd year.

One good year of Colts doesn't necessarily follow through into success in grades, where you would expect consecutive years of good results in Colts to do exactly that.

QPR clubs should be investing in their Colts programs . Parachuting players into Prems chasing GF success is not a long term solution, actually can easily be seen as detrimental if it disengages those progressing through your club ( or those about to sign up but don't ) .

 

[The Nomad]

Interesting choice ?
Heenan and Burrange are confirmed for 2021.

 

[PhilClinton]

So that's two former Norths Prems Head Coaches (Fogarty the other) in the last few years who've left the club to take up roles as 2nd grade coaches/assistants at other clubs.

What's the plan at Norths for 2021?

 

[Dean Moriarty]

So that's two former Norths Prems Head Coaches (Fogarty the other) in the last few years who've left the club to take up roles as 2nd grade coaches/assistants at other clubs.

What's the plan at Norths for 2021?

Last one out turn off the lights ?

 

[Adam84]

Well give him a Reds deal so that we can see more of him in QPR.

I watched him in the NRC last year, and I’m not afraid to say he was disappointing. I was expecting a bit more, I’m not sure if fitness was an issue and maybe he has since worked on that, but he was brought up to play the NRC so QLD coaches could get a better look at him and he simply didn’t do enough.

 

[Adam84]

All I know is that if he played in 1,2 or 3 for Uni in the GF, Easts would still have had scrum dominance. Which begs the question as to why any of the Easts front row were not identified as better options than Nasser? ..

Richie Asiata is training with the Reds in pre-season

 

[Oracle83]

Last one out turn off the lights ?

Perhaps they have finally recruited a genuine first grade coach?

 

[PhilClinton]

Perhaps they have finally recruited a genuine first grade coach?

It was discussed on here at length a few weeks ago so don’t want to rehash but what good is a top line first grade coach without any cattle? The issue needs to be fixed at a recruitment level and start with building a good foundation in Colts.

Wayne Bennett would struggle to turn their current crop into a good team.

 

[Oracle83]

It was discussed on here at length a few weeks ago so don’t want to rehash but what good is a top line first grade coach without any cattle? The issue needs to be fixed at a recruitment level and start with building a good foundation in Colts.

Wayne Bennett would struggle to turn their current crop into a good team.

Agree totally but good first grade coaches have recently proven to draw good talent and other first grade coaches revert to reggies

 

[Bulldog]

Question for debate - I love QPR but I have a sense that the stardard of the comp may have dropped off in the last few years.

I say this because despite Bond's final appearance this year there are a number of clubs who haven't featured in finals for some years and won't next year - (unfortunately) Wests, Norths, Souths, Snbk and if you think GPS are falling off the pace then you could say that the final 4 in 2021 will be Easts, Uni, Bond & Brothers.

 

[warhorse]

Question for debate - I love QPR but I have a sense that the stardard of the comp may have dropped off in the last few years.

I say this because despite Bond's final appearance this year there are a number of clubs who haven't featured in finals for some years and won't next year - (unfortunately) Wests, Norths, Souths, Snbk and if you think GPS are falling off the pace then you could say that the final 4 in 2021 will be Easts, Uni, Bond & Brothers.

Souths won in 2015, were in the semi's in 2 016 and 2018. They won Colts 1& 2 in 2019 and were in Colts finals in 2020. They are a club on the move, finishing the single round 2020 season with two wins against Norths and Wests. They defeated Brothers in the first of the non-points rounds and should have won the opening game v Sunnybank if not for a very controversial scrum penalty on fulltime.