Players to watch in 2014 - The Goal of the NRC

[KevinO]

Moli Sooaemalelagi (Rebels wider training group) I think everyone at Fox sports is dreading that name though.

 

[Dave Beat]

Sure there will be a bit of sameness but I don't think it will be the same sides. In the Force's case, we'll hopefully have a couple of players with the Wallabies (Cummins, maybe Godwin, maybe McCalman, maybe McMeniman), we'll have a couple that will probably be released to play in their home country competitions (Mathewson, Steenkamp), we'll have a handful of players out injured and we'll have a handful of players that will be released because they are not signed for the following year and Foley has no interest in them (Chris Tuatara-Morrison?).

I'm pretty hopeful that we will have 50% main squad players from the Force and 50% Wider Training group players. You guys have to remember that the Force and the Rebels have far less depth than the Tahs and the Reds. Our main squads need as much experience as your wider training groups.

So only one of the possibles step up made it to the Wobs this year as a starter but only after injury / suspension, and Speight is earmarked so that may put Badger back another peg.

Plus we have the likes of Palu and Higgers coming back. I'm sure it will possibly be > 80% Soup, plus any new Marquee players they sign - is it 3T, or is it Super?

So the Force will allow players to head back to their Home Country competitions but not players back to NSW and QLD that support the growth of Australian Rugby. Seriously that makes no form of sense, why not keep the overseas recruits hear to assist development. Another Speight may come by who wishes to stay on - I note Jason Woodward is looking at possibly staying now.

I want to see the Force, the Rebs, and Australian rugby develop - but seriously - to do this lets focus on the respective local comps. I'm sure there's more players like Godwin, and Hoskins coming through - setting up an U21 3T comp will assist.

 

[Forcefield]

So the Force will allow players to head back to their Home Country competitions but not players back to NSW and QLD that support the growth of Australian Rugby. Seriously that makes no form of sense, why not keep them hear to assist develop.

That is an assumption. They let Alby Mathewson go back last season.

I have no idea whether Force players originally from NSW or QLD will be allowed to return to their original states. I imagine it will be considered on a case by case basis.

 

[Dave Beat]

That is an assumption. They let Alby Mathewson go back last season.

I have no idea whether Force players originally from NSW or QLD will be allowed to return to their original states. I imagine it will be considered on a case by case basis.

I'd love to see NSW and QLD players return as i enjoy watching quality rugby and players that have gone through the system and made a career out of rugby. But I also want t see the 3T succeed and WA and VIC develop with a stronger player base so all our provinces are less reliant on just the 2 states as they are now. To achieve this I still think WA & VIC need to select from their local comp, plus a limited number of drafted players.

Lots of good ideas are floated here.
Whilst there are contracts, employers, employees etc I think - case by case approach whilst rather impossible it is also one of the better ideas if all parties are working together with the right focus - no doubt it will swing in roundabouts.

I've floated the idea of feeder clubs before, don't the NRL, and AFL have interstate feeder clubs that work??

 

[2bluesfan]

I'd love to see NSW and QLD players return as i enjoy watching quality rugby and players that have gone through the system and made a career out of rugby.

I share similar motivations - I particularly like to follow the careers of local juniors who, as Dave says, have gone through the system.

 

[Dave Beat]

I share similar motivations - I particularly like to follow the careers of local juniors who, as Dave says, have gone through the system.

Yep, and it can some times look like all I'm thinking about is Shute / Club rugby - but the Tah's haven't really brought good rugby to the table yet (good improvement last year though), and if I did follow them I'd be following allot of Sydney Uni players and I cant do that can i

I also want to see rugby develop in WA & VIC but I'd like to see this occur through concentrating on their own comp, IMO view the best way to do this;

Although Sydney Uni is in a rugby state they are a club side that now fields a team full of Super Players, this didnt happen overnight - it was developed. They achieved this because the developed at colts level and the colts have now aged (plus being able to offer tertiary benefits on the side has helped).

 

[Rugby Central]

I've floated the idea of feeder clubs before, don't the NRL, and AFL have interstate feeder clubs that work??

They also have this thing.....what's it called.....oh yeah, money!

I agree that players should be locally sourced but if you do that straight out, nobody will watch and the whole thing falls over. Honestly how would it help the game to see Perth trounced by 50+ every week.

Assuming 8 teams, you find the best 120 players (plus reserves) available and get them on the park. Doesn't matter what club they come from, just get them playing. Start sniping about club loyalties and who-comes-from-where later on.

If players are expected to go back to Sydney or Brisbane Clubs if they would otherwise make the starting XV in Perth then the Clubs are guilty of the same crimes as Sydney Uni having Super players coming off the bench. Warehousing players stunts the game.

 

[Jets]

It would be great if we could get back on topic guys. Players to watch out for. I'm not worried who they play for or where they are based. We have a couple of other threads to debate the pros and cons of the structure. I wanted to get away from that and focus on the guys who will benefit.

 

[Dave Beat]

They also have this thing...what's it called...oh yeah, money!

I agree that players should be locally sourced but if you do that straight out, nobody will watch and the whole thing falls over. Honestly how would it help the game to see Perth trounced by 50+ every week.

Assuming 8 teams, you find the best 120 players (plus reserves) available and get them on the park. Doesn't matter what club they come from, just get them playing. Start sniping about club loyalties and who-comes-from-where later on.

If players are expected to go back to Sydney or Brisbane Clubs if they would otherwise make the starting XV in Perth then the Clubs are guilty of the same crimes as Sydney Uni having Super players coming off the bench. Warehousing players stunts the game.

RC - I was not sniping, I simply said I enjoy watching players come through the system.

I want to see it work, and I want to see WA & VIC develop, surely there has to be a happy medium - to brick walls up with no flex ability creates a box. We need to have some give and take and that will enable growth.

My post was looking at focusing on an U21 3T team as well as grade as that will ensure development in the coming years.

 

[Rugby Central]

Apologies to Jet and DB. One for going off topic and for not stating the "sniping" what a generalisation of Club protectionists, not DB specifically.

There are a number of players to watch out for but as Link said, "There's no point beating yourself up in December about things that will happen in June. We'll just see who is playing well and who is delivering." He was talking about Wallaby selections but I think a valid reference.

 

[Hugh Jarse]

Link says "..There's no point beating yourself up in December about things that will happen in June. .."

There is a lot to like about Link, but not that.

If we followed his rationale, there would be no forum posts.

What next from Link "There is little point talking about the past. We can't change that. We are looking forward to our next game.."

 

[Train Without a Station]

I understand you're point of view Dave but what you are saying is both at odds with professionalism, and also the way things are done by AFL, RL and Cricket. In all these sports, once professional contracted, the players alignment changes to a club in the tier below which is either aligned to the professional club, or in it's region.

You have to look at it from the Super Rugby franchises' point of view. They pay these players and their success is tied pretty heavily to them. If they are back in Sydney and playing they cannot monitor their physical state. When these players are injured they are not able to assess these immediately. The Brumbies move to make all players play in Canberra was due to this. 3rd tier only extends the need. Imagine if a player has a knee injury for example, the 3rd tier club with likely inferior facilities, differing interests, located in a different state, doesn't manage it to the requirement of the Super Rugby franchise and that player post 3T season then has an op and recovery that causes them to miss Super Rugby.

Injuries cannot be avoided however the franchises have the right to manage injuries to their paid resources the best they are able to.

This is a 3rd tier comp, not state of origin. The next best tier of players, wherever they are from need to play. What would be the benefit of inferior Perth/Melbourne players getting a game and superior Sydney/Brisbane players not getting a game?

AFL players when not playing AFL play for their clubs aligned state league team, NRL players do the same. Cricketers not playing state play club cricket in their state since they live there. How is rugby any different?

These other sports all have local clubs that develop players. It all survives because clubs that the best players come from attract more talent based on their club's record in developing talent, as do professional clubs.

 

[GaffaCHinO]

Dave can you please explain how removing the super rugby players from Perth Club rugby/3rd tier would do anything to increase the quality of players coming out of WA or VIC?

As a player in the local comp who has gone through the grades from Juniors to Colts up 1st and now back on the slide down I can tell you that having the Force players involved in club rugby here has done nothing but wonders to help the development of rugby in the state.

When they come to training you see what the standard you need to strive for is. When you play along side then they do thing that you don’t see unless your on the field with them and that’s how you learn and get better.

This year after the Super rugby season there was about 20 players left here and about half of them were injured. The players not injured where made available to the local clubs to play and the ones that were injured were made to complete a coaching course and go down to their local clubs and run training session and run water on the weekend.

I can’t tell you how valuable this was to the local players. To have Battye down a the Roodogs running the lineout or Pek over at Wests mentoring the from rowers or Tessmann running lineout drills at Neddies, Junior helping the boys at Cott or Haywood helping players like Lacey (who is in the wider training group now) at the back . It was amazing and all the clubs go so much out of it.

Removing players will only hinder the local comps as things like this wouldn’t happen. The players would just scatter to the ends of Aus and develop other comps.

You say you want to see the WA and VIC develop but you want them to do it on there own just so the Sydney clubs or QLD clubs can get 'Their' players back. It’s just a stupid way of thinking.

Has anyone spoken to the players? Looking at the Forces list you would have maybe 12-13 players who would maybe still have a link to there local club in QLD/NSW but a lot of them have been in WA a long time so who is to say they would even want to return. They have a house here their partners are here their life is here why wouldn’t they/shouldn’t they play here after the super rugby season is over.

Nothing personal but I just cant stand people on the east coast making claims on players and saying things like I want the local comp to develop and produce their own players yet want to take away the best way in which to develop the local guys.

Rant over.

 

[GaffaCHinO]

On the actual topic of this forum some of the WA players to look out for next year in a 3rd teir comp would be Hosking, Lacey, Burton as well as Corey Thomas and Bruce Smith-Wright 2 big local locks.

If we wanted to use some guys in the local comp we could use Joe Savage he should be playing Super rugby and has I thnk in NZ but for some injurys. 2 year in a row the best player in the comp. Big Powerful prop.

Lukas Birch is a big young flanker with a bright future coming out of Kala who is about 17-18 and is in his second year of 1st grade but may still be abit off the next step up.

Looking to the future the brightest light will be Jayden Ngamanu this kid will play for the Force in the next 3-5 years and be huge. He is about 15-16 now and is playing 18s and could play 1st now if allowed he will be one of the best to come out of WA. I watch a trial game about 2 years ago he was in u14s from the kick off he took the ball on the 22 and scored a try at the other end not one player put a hand on him.

 

[secondfive]

few of the boys from the John I Dent cup will shine in the new national comp

 

[RugbyReg]

few of the boys from the John I Dent cup will shine in the new national comp

something a little more specific would be great. Like names and possibly positions?

 

[refugee]

few of the boys from the John I Dent cup will shine in the new national comp

Is that 'a few' or prehaps 'few' meaning none ?

 

[secondfive]

heap of them will show people up....
Ben Johnston, Timmy Cornforth from Canberra Royals... take ur pick from the Vikings....
The Western District Lions are full of talent also, particularly in the backline.
Qbn are tough as nails aswell

 

[Eyes and Ears]

Moli Sooaemalelagi (Rebels wider training group) I think everyone at Fox sports is dreading that name though.

I don't think it is as bad as you think

Soo - ae - ma - le - lagi

 

[Dave Beat]

Apologies to Jet and DB. One for going off topic and for not stating the "sniping" what a generalisation of Club protectionists, not DB specifically.

There are a number of players to watch out for but as Link said, "There's no point beating yourself up in December about things that will happen in June. We'll just see who is playing well and who is delivering." He was talking about Wallaby selections but I think a valid reference.

No sweat, I want to see it work, I enjoy watching players that have come through the system - and just sharing some ideas.