Our Centre Partnership - Moving Forward

[churchills cigar]

Mate we are New Zealand so we shouldn't try and emulate them otherwise we will never win.

Why, aren't they the benchmark, surely we should be striving to compete.


We aren't ever gonna beat the All Blacks by trying monster the midfield just like Socceroos are never going to beat Brazil by playing Samba football but please don't insult our centre stocks because realistically our prospects aren't that bad

and realistically base don positions played this year our centres aren't that patchwork

Why, aren't they the benchmark, surely we should be striving to compete.

How have I insulted anyone. I simply stated an opinion that our players were not as good as the opposition, or as a relative new person aren't I allowed an opinion. I did not slander, ridicule or debase anyone. Your assertion of me insulting anyone is typical of a precious attitude to the instant and blind to face reality.
I feel it's this insular behaviour that is seeing us neglect the realities and instead stick our head in the same wrt player performances.

 

[thierry dusautoir]

maybe insult wasn't the right word. Perhaps write off based on the fact that we dont have the cattle to pick a good pairing.

They are the bench mark but shouldn't striving to play with the same intent and hunger to win and discipline be enough? Just because there team is good doesn't mean we should select like for like players and play a similar style. That is pointless, you should play to your strengths Australia always produces smaller more skillful 12's and have one currently in Tapauai and similar in JOC (James O'Connor). We have a strong powerful outsides in Cummins, Tomane, and AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) or possibility of skillful outside in JOC (James O'Connor). Hence it makes sense for us to continue with the Australian approach of ball playing 12 and powerful 13.

But your saying because NZ do it with a strong powerful players in SBW and Nonu inside and skillful foils of smith at outside and they are number 1 we should emulate their approach? Regardless that our current crop of players aren't suited to this set up........similar to how the wallabies persisted with an unskillful crash balling 12 in McCabe and willing to place more skillfull players in Tapuai 13 which presented us with two season of a blunt ugly backline........doesn't make sense and never did, and after the weekend hopefully Robbie realises this as well

 

[The Rant]

Cummins has put his hand up hard and his abbrasive style over the last 4 games shows he has the goods to mix it at international level and a style that I would love to see at 13.

I've had a man crush on AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) for years...but the years are not on his side anymore and he's just not cunning enough to get away with it like conrad smith seems to be. He was dead solid on the weekend and should stay there for now. But he might be pushed hard to keep it for the lions.

Beale rarely gets talked about as a possible 12. To be honest I'd rather have him there than JOC (James O'Connor). That said Tapuai is a better 12 than either of them at the moment and can play 13 if needed though I don't want him there.

If McCabe gets picked again at 12 I'll scream - it will show one thing only - Deans is reverting to his defensive gameplan thatwe all hate. Nothing wrong with McCabe - it's just a different style with him. He could be a fullback in the style of latham but I doubt that will happen.

 

[Brumbieman]

Cummins has put his hand up hard and his abbrasive style over the last 4 games shows he has the goods to mix it at international level and a style that I would love to see at 13.

I've had a man crush on AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) for years.but the years are not on his side anymore and he's just not cunning enough to get away with it like conrad smith seems to be. He was dead solid on the weekend and should stay there for now. But he might be pushed hard to keep it for the lions.

Beale rarely gets talked about as a possible 12. To be honest I'd rather have him there than JOC (James O'Connor). That said Tapuai is a better 12 than either of them at the moment and can play 13 if needed though I don't want him there.

If McCabe gets picked again at 12 I'll scream - it will show one thing only - Deans is reverting to his defensive gameplan thatwe all hate. Nothing wrong with McCabe - it's just a different style with him. He could be a fullback in the style of latham but I doubt that will happen.

Which style of Latham would that be?

I remember a defensively suspect counter-attacking genius, with freakish balance and strength in the tackle, and a boot that only Gerrard could rival. How the hell could McCabe relate to that?

His only place for the Wallabies is like Fainga'a's: 12, outside Lealiifano, and inside Beiber. Leaving Tomane, Speight, Diggers, Mitchell, Shipperly and Cummin to battle it out fo teh wings, and Beale at 15.

 

[The_Brown_Hornet]

Mate we are New Zealand so we shouldn't try and emulate them otherwise we will never win.
Tapuai I believe is a solid option at 12 he is everything that Australian rugby stands for in an inside centre and although we may not have cracked the da vinci code yet i think we can all agree through out this dismal year we have all seen glimpses of the pieces of the jigsaw.
I don't think any team we have put out this year is close to our best 15 but I think most people will tell you they liked the look of some combinations across the 15.
Our backs are in a better place than last year we are seeing the emergence of people like Cummins, White and Lealifano to compliment the established backline rock of Digby, Genia, JOC (James O'Connor) and Beale.
Tapuai is a good starting block for 12 and has shown he can mix it with SBW and Fruen when he helped the reds win the Grand Final, depending on injuries next year I see a wealth of options play out side him with either JOC (James O'Connor) or Cummins being the most tantalising.
We aren't ever gonna beat the All Blacks by trying monster the midfield just like Socceroos are never going to beat Brazil by playing Samba football but please don't insult our centre stocks because realistically our prospects aren't that bad

and realistically base don positions played this year our centres aren't that patchwork

Taps really stuck his hand up on the weekend and deserves a fairly extended run in the position. I was calling for Cooper/Barnes at 10/12 at the beginning of the season, but Cooper shot himself in the foot and Berrick lost form. So on that basis, I think Taps should be our first choice 12 until someone takes it from him via Super rugby form. You are right TD in that you say he has all the attributes we traditionally look for in a 12: hands, tackling, step and a decent boot. Our best teams have had those kinds of inside centres.

Outside centre is a concern and again, I've always pushed AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) there. He's not the player he was although I would say he let absolutely nobody down there against England. He was able to contain Tuilagi and even got a bit of the pill himself (offloaded too!). I think he, McCabe, Horne and as an outside chance Inman are fighting for that job.

What we definitely do not want to go back to is the completely defensive bash and barge style pairing. That clearly didn't work.

 

[The Rant]

Which style of Latham would that be?

I remember a defensively suspect counter-attacking genius, with freakish balance and strength in the tackle, and a boot that only Gerrard could rival. How the hell could McCabe relate to that?

Funny enough time has erased by memories of Latham's tackling issues- but you're right it was his worst side so fair play.
As far as I recall mccabe is an ok kick from 15 (not as good as latham though) and I like his ability to hit the line at angles which latham was also good at and watching the brumbies he's better doing this from 15 than 12. Don't misunderstand me - he's no latham.

Can't agree to you idea to play JOC (James O'Connor) at 13 though. And a mccabe-JOC (James O'Connor) centre pairing makes zero sense.

 

[hawktrain]

I might be the only one, but I've never been impressed by Tapuai. To me, he's an in between player - not a hard runner and big defender like McCabe, not a ballplayer like O'Connor, but a bit of both and he often seems a little confused as to what his role is.

I think they should at least try, when possible with fitness etc, Barnes at 10, O'Connor at 12, AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) at 13 and Beale at 15. Go for the smaller guys, and actually attack. There's no excuse with those 4 not to be running all sorts of set moves in the backs, which don't need to be at all complicated, just well executed and subtle. Then have Mike Harris on the bench (because IMO he doesn't deserve a starting spot), and you have cover for an injury to any of those 4.

 

[qwerty51]

I would've thought as a Crusaders fan you'd be impressed considering he outplayed SBW twice in 2011.

 

[tranquility]

I might be the only one, but I've never been impressed by Tapuai. To me, he's an in between player - not a hard runner and big defender like McCabe, not a ballplayer like O'Connor, but a bit of both and he often seems a little confused as to what his role is.

How would you have described Aaron Mauger?

 

[Athilnaur]

Taps had a great game. He may not be imposing, but he is dynamic. AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) had a really strong defensive game, his attack was good but I wouldn't say particularly threatening. If I had one complaint about our backline it was that Ioane was not in play much and I attribute that to us not changing our lines of attack enough and going wide a little to quickly with our centres spaced out.

McCabe for me has the essential ingredient for a test player, he grows ten inches. He is starting to show a good read of the game. Unfortunately he has had a steep learning curve with only two seasons at centre, but under Larkham's tutelage he is going to become a super centre imo. Meanwhile he has a serious injury and won't be matchfit for a long time.

I agree completely here with others that our centre pairing should have two players with different playstyles. My preference is McCabe 12, a dynamic player at 13, but with Cooper out of the picture I don't much care which plays which at 12/13 provided we stick with it.

I continue to believe JOC (James O'Connor) should play 13, but I can't see him playing 13 for the rebels unless Deans asks Hill to swap his pairing.

We do have a great array of backs if they were all fit. Beale, Genia, Ioane, JOC (James O'Connor) and McCabe are givens for me. Then add AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper), Taps, Tomane, Lealeiifano, Cummins, Harris, Barnes and Mitchell.

 

[hawktrain]

I would've thought as a Crusaders fan you'd be impressed considering he outplayed SBW twice in 2011.

Fair point, can't say I really remember the backs getting much action for either side in those games though. May just be me trying to block those games out of my memory....

How would you have described Aaron Mauger?

Actually that's an excellent example, they do have somewhat similar styles. I'd describe Mauger as a combination of both the ball playing 'second five eighth' and hard running 'inside centre', which for me is the perfect skillset to play 12. The difference between the two for me, is that Mauger was outstanding in both roles, whereas Tapuai has only been good, i.e. not quite the level of a first-choice test player yet. He's only 23, so he has some maturing yet to do. I just personally don't think he has the passing/distributing and kicking skills of a top 12 such as Mauger. Tapuai is obviously a hell of an athlete and has a lot of skill, and he's probably been hindered a bit by playing outside of so many different 10's at the Reds, and also playing a lot outside Quade Cooper, because as a 12 it would be pretty tough to get your own game going when the fly half inside you is so unpredictable and error prone.