NSW JRU State Championships & Representative Teams 2014

[Quick Hands]

For a district with a strong heritige of representative players in the past, Warringah Juniors (other than the recent and now current U17 squad) seem to be struggling in most age groups. Are they losing out to league, not enough boys in the private system (ie not getting a higher calibre of rugby constantly)?

Thoughts anyone.

As someone who's followed junior rugby on the peninsula for a long time, I have wondered about this myself. I think there's a few little issues.

I suspect that the travel involved in village juniors has a bigger impact in Warringah than it does anywhere else. When you can play league for Avalon and your furthest away game is Manly or you can play rugby for Newport and you could end up a Sylvania, Blue Mountains or Dural, it's a definite factor. It's a matter for another thread, but I think that sending 10s-12s all over Sydney is ludicrous and isn't attacting or retaining parents and boys who aren't rugby fanatics.

A lot of good young rugby players also prefer to spend their time surfing.

These things are also a bit cyclical - in the 90s Manly was really weak in the juniors and Warringah was the peninsula powerhouse

EDIT: The travel thing is starting to affect Manly as well. In at least 2 age groups that I know boys are playing rugby for their schools and league with their mates and have ditched village and district rep rugby altogether.

 

[Shane Smeltz]

You, Sir, are part of the problem. Fancy encouraging the young folk to have interests beyond Rugby.

Long Reef ?

You got me.
Long Reef or Dee Why, or Freshie if they're no good

 

[Hugh Jarse]

<snip>
What has gone before is nothing to what may lie ahead.

Probably for another thread, but it is early and I am enjoying a coffee in the sunshine and life is good.

These are the NSW JRU State championships, not the NSW State Championships. Given the Schools Arms Race which shows no sign of slowing down in the short term, Junior Club rugby is going to continue to suffer.

Worse still is the ARU are seemingly happy that a very small number of private schools are doing the heavy lifting for teenage development.

To bemoan the "player quality" in Under 16's this year compared to previous years is to ignore the fact that there is no second pathway into National Under 16's through the Village Club system. There is no incentive for time poor rockstars to put themselves in front of the two groups of selectors for rep honours.

The star quality players at this and future U16/U17 JSC that are at ISA/CAS/AAGPS schools are those from rusted on families that have loyalty to the community based model, and are prepared to thumb their nose at the edicts from the School Rugby Directors.

Kids who have been financially incentivised to attend private schools are generally not in a position to ignore what the School Rugby Director says.

Other kids in the CHS, CCC, and AICES system, and eligible for SJRU U17, have voted with their feet and are already in their district Colts programme. Last year these lads were eligible for JSC - The Manly "Facebook" team, Several Eastwood boys, and the West Harbour halfback are examples. The Grandfather clause removal seems to have put the kybosh on that.

The Pathway is still a mess, with many agencies like Schools and Juniors carrying on as they have always done despite ARU attempts to realign and restructure the Pathway.

 

[Hugh Jarse]

In an age of portable and instant communications, the updates from the JSC organisers have been rather poor.

The NSW Rugby Referees association are on the ball, with regular updates.

NSW JRU website is slow to post results. Day 2 Results from U12 and U13 are absent. Under 14 Results require "special" tools to interpret. Some Day 2 U15 results are missing from the "official" record.

The NSW JRU twitter feed was silent yesterday.

How hard is it to take a photo of the whiteboard at the various ovals and post them on the interwebs? No need to type stuff up on the Official spreadsheet.

There are parents, friends and family from all over NSW and some interstate that are interested in the timely promulgation of results.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

Probably for another thread, but it is early and I am enjoying a coffee in the sunshine and life is good.

These are the NSW JRU State championships, not the NSW State Championships. Given the Schools Arms Race which shows no sign of slowing down in the short term, Junior Club rugby is going to continue to suffer.

I know why you say it might be for another thread HJ but at the moment Im not addressing the cause, rather seeking a short term solution.
At the moment some U16 kids could be left with no rugby at all after this weekend - that may be a slim prospect but i suspect it is one that will become more real in future years.
I thought that Sydney U 16s were playing in the ad hoc not endorsed national u16s?

 

[Hugh Jarse]

As I understand it, the "national" U16's will be the same as last years U16 programme, (SJRU vs NSW JRU U16, NSW JRU vs ACT JRU), with "hoped" for TBA games against QLD JRU U16 (or BJRU - there is a LOT of politics in Qld JRU) and VIC U16 (not sure if JRU or Vic SchoolsRU or Vic "all comers" U16).

For U16 and above, the Village Club model in the Sydney and BrisVegas has been ursurped by the Schools. I maintain my view that the "elite" U16 + should be in a Comp administered by Colts, and the more "social" players in a comp run under Subbies clubs rather than Junior Village Clubs.

 

[Dingasden]

HJ

As I understand it, the "national" U16's will be the same as last years U16 programme, (SJRU vs NSW JRU U16, NSW JRU vs ACT JRU), with "hoped" for TBA games against QLD JRU U16 (or BJRU - there is a LOT of politics in Qld JRU) and VIC U16 (not sure if JRU or Vic SchoolsRU or Vic "all comers" U16).

For U16 and above, the Village Club model in the Sydney and BrisVegas has been ursurped by the Schools. I maintain my view that the "elite" U16 + should be in a Comp administered by Colts, and the more "social" players in a comp run under Subbies clubs rather than Junior Village Clubs.

I agree with your sentiments re club & school. I do believe we need an u17s comp & maybe even u16s comp to sit under the colts as these are the years most critical to retaining players in the game. If we can achieve such a model for these age groups, im not sure if there would be enough players left to play in a subbies run comp. i do know that once we lose players to other interests it's very hard to get them back. Travel will always be an issue but if you love the game enough it's a small sacrifice.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

U14
Todays Games
SF1 Illawarra v Gordon
SF2 Norths v ACT

PlayOff1 Warringah v Randwick
PlayOff2 Eastwood v Penrith
PlayOff3 Warringah v Central West
PlayOff4 Eastwood v Manly
PlayOff5 Randwick v Manly
PlayOff6 Penrith v Central West
Playoff 7th v 8th Eastern Suburbs v Southern Districts
Playoff 5th v 6th Parramatta v Hunter

Playoff 3rd v 4th Loser SF1 v Loser SF2

GF: Winner SF1 v Winner SF2

My snouts (better than yours HJ) tell me Gordon def Illawarra in SF 1.
Too much to hope for a score but i can tell you what's on exhibition at the regional art gallery.
Edit: perhaps a tad harsh "On the bell - sad for Illawarra" was the follow up

 

[The Incredible Plan]

Was it my imagination or at u16s, were there more selectors (assuming those men with clipboards weren't gps scouts) rotating around the matches in what seemed to be a very coordinated manner compared with u15s last year?


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[Hugh Jarse]

Along with the SJRU zone selectors, there will be ARU Scouts, Schools Scouts, Shute Shield Scouts, NSW JRU Selectors, and some Fivekick Scouts at the Under 16's, all wielding Clipboards.

With 16's and 17's at the same oval, there is more incentive for The Clipboards to concentrate at a venue where they can see two grades (although there is often not too much interest in the U17's due to the absence of many rock stars) than at the Under 15's which is usually a stand alone competition.

 

[Hugh Jarse]

@The Incredible Plan, Any results to report from the Semis?

 

[The Incredible Plan]

As a visitor, Thanks to Wests and their volunteers for putting on a well run couple of days at St Luke's for the U16s. The grounds were well organised and set up, the games ran to schedule, the BBQ was pumping all weekend even if they did run out of onions yesterday and they organised the weather perfectly.

Btw a couple of players told me they preferred the second oval as #1 had a rock hard 22m cricket square in the middle, a large puddle on the 5m line in one corner and several very uneven areas (wicky's spot).




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[The Incredible Plan]

@The Incredible Plan, Any results to report from the Semis?

Sorry HJ, I can't help. I'm not at Drummoyne - fortunately not just one junior or one sport to support!


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[Inside Shoulder]

My snouts (better than yours HJ) tell me Gordon def Illawarra in SF 1.
Too much to hope for a score but i can tell you what's on exhibition at the regional art gallery.
Edit: perhaps a tad harsh "On the bell - sad for Illawarra" was the follow up

Pretty sure Illawarra have been champs in this U14 cohort since U11s - someone will correct me

 

[The Incredible Plan]

Also for those interested, I couldn't see the Gordon tumble dryer (or coffee machine) on display - mind you it was dry!


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[Cattledog]

Penrith v manly in the u12 state champs final at 2pm! Go the junior emus!

 

[Quick Hands]

I know why you say it might be for another thread HJ but at the moment Im not addressing the cause, rather seeking a short term solution.
At the moment some U16 kids could be left with no rugby at all after this weekend - that may be a slim prospect but i suspect it is one that will become more real in future years.

For U16 and above, the Village Club model in the Sydney and BrisVegas has been ursurped by the Schools. I maintain my view that the "elite" U16 + should be in a Comp administered by Colts, and the more "social" players in a comp run under Subbies clubs rather than Junior Village Clubs.

A root and branch review and complete restructure of age group rugby in Sydney (and probably all of NSW) is required.

We need to rationalise the levels of representation and avoid duplication.

We need to decide:

What is the purpose of these champioinships? Are they to provide district representation for boys playing village rugby or should they be open to all comers following a trial process à la JGC?

If they are restricted to boys playing village rugby, then that rule needs to be rigidly enforced - with sanctions on clubs who facilitate boys registering for a village club solely to play 4 games and qualify and then disappear leaving their non-elite team mates without a team.

Do we need 15s and 17s now that JGC covers those age groups?

Should we be picking rep teams for 10 and 11 year olds at all?

Should these champiopships be played at the end of the season instead of in the middle? Straight away this removes the boy/parent/club who only registers and plays 4 games to qualify.

In its current format, these championships may actually be hindering player participation and development - particuarly in the older age groups where at least one group of boys may be left without a team to play for.

Absolutely, 100% agree that 16s and up should be part of district colts - possibly even 15s as well.

A submission

District reps at 12s, 13s and 14s

JGC at 15s and 17s

16s and 17s play as part of district colts

Sydney 16s can be picked by selectors attending colts matches

 

[Azzuri]

Along with the SJRU zone selectors, there will be ARU Scouts, Schools Scouts, Shute Shield Scouts, NSW JRU Selectors, and some Fivekick Scouts at the Under 16's, all wielding Clipboards.

With 16's and 17's at the same oval, there is more incentive for The Clipboards to concentrate at a venue where they can see two grades (although there is often not too much interest in the U17's due to the absence of many rock stars) than at the Under 15's which is usually a stand alone competition.

HJ... Are the u16 Sydney City zone teams announced at the conclusion of hostilities at Drummoyne this afternoon?

 

[The Incredible Plan]

Along with the SJRU zone selectors, there will be ARU Scouts, Schools Scouts, Shute Shield Scouts, NSW JRU Selectors, and some Fivekick Scouts at the Under 16's, all wielding Clipboards.

With 16's and 17's at the same oval, there is more incentive for The Clipboards to concentrate at a venue where they can see two grades (although there is often not too much interest in the U17's due to the absence of many rock stars) than at the Under 15's which is usually a stand alone competition.

That is a shedload of clipboards. It would explain the sheer number there. I actually felt a bit inadequate without one. More left out really than inadequate.


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[Hugh Jarse]

HJ. Are the u16 Sydney City zone teams announced at the conclusion of hostilities at Drummoyne this afternoon?

If they are true to form, the Zone teams will be announced after the respective age group finals, through the Team Managers.

They will probably be on the SJRU web site tomorrow.