NSW CCC Rugby 2012

[Hugh Jarse]

Perhaps CCC could think about enlarging their representative programme and including a tour to Queensland during the July holidays as an incentive to get in the rugby programme and to have a few more games at that higher level.

There is the annual Gold Coast Rugby carnival, alternatively how about a 4 day 3 match carnival between NSW CCC, QLD CCC, and ACT/Combined States CCC at U16 and opens, maybe take the Under 15's up to prepare them as a development opportunity for a decent tilt at NSW Schools U16 tournament.

Probably dreaming, but they are free are they not?

Edit: spelling

 

[Hammo]

Perhaps CCC chould think about enlarging their representative programme and including a tour to Queensland during the July holidays as an incentive to get in the rugby programme and to have a few more games at that higher level.

There is the annual Gold Coast Rugby carnival, alternatively how about a 4 day 3 match carnival between NSW CCC, QLD CCC, and ACT/Combined Ctates CCC at U16 and opens, maybe take the Under 15's up to prepare them as a development opportunity for a decent tilt at NSW Schools

Brilliant idea. Perhaps put it to the CCC convenor for the boys next year. I believe he is from St Gregory's College

 

[Hammo]

Therefore add another 4 to the ARU JGS; but as noticed dual coders - not liked by NSW Schools.

Yes, I agree and it was the same thing I faced coming from a league dominated school which I now believe has converted to union. The program through the IAS is a great pathway to assist them in their development but the CCC needs to step it up & give them more support & development program throughout the year. A brilliant suggestion Hugh.!

 

[whatever]

I know I will get my a-hole kicked from breakfast to dinner but today CCC won the U18 national rugby league title and had 10 players named in the Aus team out of 17 to play an English academy side in a two test series, also, the CCC u15s won their national title and had 9 players named in a 13 boy Aus merit team.

I know it is a different game and the transfer over of players to the tight 5 is not a goer but a quick backrower and the backs can make the transition.

So, why is it that on a continual basis CCC has no players picked in the NSW Schools RU sides. This year 1 open player selected as a reserve and in the U16s none. And there are at least 8 U16s from this years squad were in the ARU JGS set up.

I will also post this on the selection bias thread.

 

[Hugie]

My view is that the development work should go on at the Dioceses level. Each of the Dioceses should play min 5 games before the CCC trials so that the league players they are trying to convert can learn rugby, and to get the team structures and pattern working. Some will make it some won't, this will be found out at the selection trials.Then select a rugby CCC team with NO ambitions of teaching anyone how to play rugby, but only to put a 1st class rugby team on the paddock. If they're not a rugby player by the time they reach the CCC trials it is too late.

The problem for selectors (particularly one that don't know what they're doing) is that it is easy for a good player to look bad in a team that is under pressure from poor option selection. Feedback from some of the Illawarra boys was that they were constantly covering up dumb options at the breakdown taken by the league players (not their fault they just don't know). This elevates their great result against GPS IIs. Those with an eye for what goes on on a rugby field would have seen that and thought "wow what could these boys do if we put them in a team of rugby players". Apparently the selectors just see what looks good.

Whatever, CCC don't get anyone selected directly but have indirectly. John Walker is a CCC boy, Corey Tullock ex Holy Spirit, Cameron Bond ex Holy Spirit it is just they have to change schools to get selected.

 

[Hammo]

My view is that the development work should go on at the Dioceses level. Each of the Dioceses should play min 5 games before the CCC trials so that the league players they are trying to convert can learn rugby, and to get the team structures and pattern working. Some will make it some won't, this will be found out at the selection trials.Then select a rugby CCC team with NO ambitions of teaching anyone how to play rugby, but only to put a 1st class rugby team on the paddock. If they're not a rugby player by the time they reach the CCC trials it is too late.

The problem for selectors (particularly one that don't know what they're doing) is that it is easy for a good player to look bad in a team that is under pressure from poor option selection. Feedback from some of the Illawarra boys was that they were constantly covering up dumb options at the breakdown taken by the league players (not their fault they just don't know). This elevates their great result against GPS IIs. Those with an eye for what goes on on a rugby field would have seen that and thought "wow what could these boys do if we put them in a team of rugby players". Apparently the selectors just see what looks good.

Whatever, CCC don't get anyone selected directly but have indirectly. John Walker is a CCC boy, Corey Tullock ex Holy Spirit, Cameron Bond ex Holy Spirit it is just they have to change schools to get selected.

These are exactly my thoughts. But these boys should also be considered directly at this level . It is clear some of the boys I observed had noticeable talent especially around the ruck & loose scrum area. Consider the point after researching some of the CCC boys as mentioned few serious rugby boys are developing through the Acadamey & representative & Country they are developing strong skill however is this enough or to develop further. NSW CCC provided a sturdy crew of boys .There is a small quoter of boys selected each year for scholarships.CCC need to have their own formula to support these boys & supply them a fair noticeable chance as they are strongly competitive & produce results.

 

[whatever]

My view is that the development work should go on at the Dioceses level. Each of the Dioceses should play min 5 games before the CCC trials so that the league players they are trying to convert can learn rugby, and to get the team structures and pattern working. Some will make it some won't, this will be found out at the selection trials.Then select a rugby CCC team with NO ambitions of teaching anyone how to play rugby, but only to put a 1st class rugby team on the paddock. If they're not a rugby player by the time they reach the CCC trials it is too late.

The problem for selectors (particularly one that don't know what they're doing) is that it is easy for a good player to look bad in a team that is under pressure from poor option selection. Feedback from some of the Illawarra boys was that they were constantly covering up dumb options at the breakdown taken by the league players (not their fault they just don't know). This elevates their great result against GPS IIs. Those with an eye for what goes on on a rugby field would have seen that and thought "wow what could these boys do if we put them in a team of rugby players". Apparently the selectors just see what looks good.

Whatever, CCC don't get anyone selected directly but have indirectly. John Walker is a CCC boy, Corey Tullock ex Holy Spirit, Cameron Bond ex Holy Spirit it is just they have to change schools to get selected.[/quote]

I will respond to the points in bold.

• where are these boys to find the time for these 5 games - they are in the middle of their school (mainly league) and at the start of the weekend comps, some have just completed their Harold Matthews representative commitments. The way I see it the incompetence this year (and previous years) was with the bias of the coach and his staff - to be honest there was an oversupply of players from the north coast. The two dominant teams at the trials were the MCC and the MCS but there were more boys selected from the north coast - guess where the coach was from. The trials are the best you can ask for given the above.
• I am not one to bag individual players, but maybe you should ask the Illawarra boys who were the point scorers (or the main players creating the attack) in the game against the GPS. Just maybe they shouldn't be bagging fellow players, maybe they are covering up for their own incompetence.
• Personally I don't give a ratz about kids who changed schools - there was enough talent showed at the trials and championships that should have seen 2 or 3 players selected in the NSW school squad.

 

[Hugie]

whatever,

• I don't know where they will get the time from BUT you don't learn to play rugby or put together a functioning team at the level they need by having a few practice runs. They need a number of good hard hit-outs at speed.
• You must have been at a different trial game to the one I went to. The three dominant teams were SS/Woll, Broken Bay and Lismore. SS/Woll went on to prove it by giving MCC a master class in how to play rugby in the final.
• My point about the options is that when the game is played hard and at speed it takes a lot of practice as a team to get the option selection right (see point above). A talented squash player would not be expected to get the option selection right playing tennis, without a lot of practice under pressure.

You won't break down the selection bias in the schoolboys selection until CCC comes out and gives GPS and CAS a good going over 3 years in a row. The first will called a fluke, second year some exuses but they'll be worried and third year they'll have to conceed. I've given my view on how to do this above.

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[whatever]

whatever,

• I don't know where they will get the time from BUT you don't learn to play rugby or put together a functioning team at the level they need by having a few practice runs. They need a number of good hard hit-outs at speed.
• You must have been at a different trial game to the one I went to. The three dominant teams were SS/Woll, Broken Bay and Lismore. SS/Woll went on to prove it by giving MCC a master class in how to play rugby in the final.
• My point about the options is that when the game is played hard and at speed it takes a lot of practice as a team to get the option selection right (see point above). A talented squash player would not be expected to get the option selection right playing tennis, without a lot of practice under pressure.

You won't break down the selection bias in the schoolboys selection until CCC comes out and gives GPS and CAS a good going over 3 years in a row. The first will called a fluke, second year some exuses but they'll be worried and third year they'll have to conceed. I've given my view on how to do this above.


.

The best you can do would be to run the trials earlier; giving the selected squad more time together and maybe a few more trials but then the CCC would lose there HM and SG ball reps from trialling if it is any earlier.

I have not got the scores but I know MCS won 3 of their 4 games.

The NSW schools bias could be stopped immediately by having an independent selection panel - not from 2/3 GPS, 1/2 from ISA, CAS etc and 0 from CCC; say, 4 independent ARU development officers.