NSW Barbarians tour to Argentina

[Hawko]

Some thoughts on what was a very poor display by the Waratahs overall:

• Lucas was horrible and I thought Falealii was very promising. He needs an immediate promotion to Shute so he can be measured under pressure, but on this display you'd give him Lucas's EPS spot.
• Volavola was also poor and I'm beginning to think he might be better at 12 or 15. Horwitz was very good and I can see why he's been drafted-in even though he's so young. Complaints about his place kicking concern me. Why does everybody think the 10 has to be the place kicker? I remember when it was far more usual for the place kicker to be a winger or fullback. Don Clarke anyone?
• The Argentinian leg drive in the tackle, both offensive and defensive, was the primary reason for their domination - along with their scrum. We don't seem to teach this in Australian rugby and I don't remember one dominant NSW tackle.
• The Cheika gameplan where nobody turns up to the ruck to secure the ball is going to have to be changed or we will be beaten by any team that uses the Brumby-style defence.
• Alofa Alofa looked like he deserved to be at this level. Alex Gibbon, however, needs to return to tackling school. Some of that was just awful.
• I don't think I have ever seen a scrum given such a total hiding in a match at this level. Lots could be said, but the key for me was the foot position and leg bend the Argies had. Our scrum set up to fail by being too high and getting pushed back as soon as the pressure came on.

This is written straight after watching and may be a bit harsh, but I didn't like what I saw. The Argies will go OK in the RC, may even break their duck. I'll be cheering them on unless playing the Wallabies.

 

[Buster]

Just watched some highlights before. I am not getting the fuss on volavola. With foley and Beale both signed up, I would besetting Horowitz in quick smart and telling vola he can go help the rebels. He is ok in a couple of spots but given the tabs depth across 5/8 and fullback, he isn't whats needed. Lucas poor, McKibbin throwing some wild ones again. I saw some highlights of the uni souths game last week from the SS, I'll be damn happy to see Phipps passing quick and Clean to a 5/8 going forward. Forwards ordinary, tiles has got to be going close to an o/s gig, he has never made the next step, and was belted by a much better front row tonight. Some hope there, but geez they need to clean out some dead wood. Also I liked Dempsey, some mongrel in him! Could be a hand back up to hopper down the track

 

[#1 Tah]

I think you guys need to remember that this was basically a Shute Shield XV up against a test Pumas side. I was shocked we got so close last week. Agree Horwitz and Falaelii were standouts and some tackling practise must be done with Volavola and Lucas.

Overall I'm very happy that this tour went ahead, the players on both sides will be better for it. Thank you Argentinean Rugby, thank you NSW Rugby for making this happen.

 

[Buster]

Agree no.1 tah, however it is still a bit disappointing to see the unheralded guys from clb land show up the so called stars on the night. Volavola seems to command a lot of attention but has yet to really do much of anything. Watching a kid like horowitz run to the line like that was brilliant. If mr chicks reads these pages, .....SIGN THAT KID UP!! That's the kind of go forward the tahs need

 

[Fowi]

I can see why Horwitz has such big raps on him, takes it to the line. I still think Volavola has the potential to become a star, but I just don't see it happening at the Tahs. I only saw the second half but i was very impressed by Falealii as most people would have been i suspect, asked the defence lots of questions around the rucks. Hopefully Horwitz, McDougall and Falealii get EPS spots next season.

 

[boyo]

Some thoughts on what was a very poor display by the Waratahs overall:

• Lucas was horrible and I thought Falealii was very promising. He needs an immediate promotion to Shute so he can be measured under pressure, but on this display you'd give him Lucas's EPS spot.
• Volavola was also poor and I'm beginning to think he might be better at 12 or 15. Horwitz was very good and I can see why he's been drafted-in even though he's so young. Complaints about his place kicking concern me. Why does everybody think the 10 has to be the place kicker? I remember when it was far more usual for the place kicker to be a winger or fullback. Don Clarke anyone?
• The Argentinian leg drive in the tackle, both offensive and defensive, was the primary reason for their domination - along with their scrum. We don't seem to teach this in Australian rugby and I don't remember one dominant NSW tackle.
• The Cheika gameplan where nobody turns up to the ruck to secure the ball is going to have to be changed or we will be beaten by any team that uses the Brumby-style defence.
• Alofa Alofa looked like he deserved to be at this level. Alex Gibbon, however, needs to return to tackling school. Some of that was just awful.
• I don't think I have ever seen a scrum given such a total hiding in a match at this level. Lots could be said, but the key for me was the foot position and leg bend the Argies had. Our scrum set up to fail by being too high and getting pushed back as soon as the pressure came on.

This is written straight after watching and may be a bit harsh, but I didn't like what I saw. The Argies will go OK in the RC, may even break their duck. I'll be cheering them on unless playing the Wallabies.

Yes,
Why not not use a different number for the kicker?
In France often the 9 is the kicker.

 

[wamberal]

I think we all expect our tens to be able to kick. Most teams use the ten to restart play, after all. If a ten cannot kick, consistently and well, he should learn how to. Foley, please note.


I am not a kicker, but I would have thought that a good punt/drop kicker could easily learn to be a good place kicker.


I am not saying that a fly half has to be a goal kicker, just that it does seem to follow on from being a good kicker per se.

(I admit that this is written from the point of view of an old trundler who liked to look back and see our five eighth hoof the ball a bloody long way down field, especially when we were in trouble).

 

[Pfitzy]

Skelton was damaging. Love his work.

Lucas crap. Volavola crap. Backline crap as a result.

Some of the replacements were good, but got the benefit of a tiring Pumas side for about 20 minutes in the second half.

Falealii backs up my argument about country rugby. I think there should be more intra-comp games between Sydney, Hunter, ACT and South Coast and the other areas while Super Rugby is on

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I hate autocorrect ...

 

[masai]

Falealii backs up my argument about country rugby. I think there should be more intra-comp games between Sydney, Hunter, ACT and South Coast and the other areas while Super Rugby is on

I have no strong opinion on your idea of inter-comp games, but it's a bit disingenuous to use Falealii as a barometer for country rugby talent. He's an experienced ITM Cup player who was developed entirely by New Zealand rugby. He only came over to Australia this year and by all accounts has been a man among boys in the NHRU comp.

 

[fatprop]

Yeah a guy with 8 NPC games under his belt may not be the diamond in the rough generally available in country rugby

 

[Pfitzy]

Fair enough. But the guy who played at 13 for Combined Country was also good. You can't build depth with without widening the base.

Shute Shield can't grow - in fact looking at recent results down all grades you have to ask whether Gordon or Penrith even deserve to be there.

Subbies is stagnant as a result. Premier rugby doesn't want Drummoyne and Balmain, but they haven't seen that yet. Five Grades is a farce for competition - it would be better limited to three with a promotion/relegation system right up to Premier Rugby. Anything after that is social and doesn't count towards competition points.

No Division should have more than 10 clubs involved, either.

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I hate autocorrect ...

 

[Guy]

PS - In the late 1960s the Pumas started using their bajada scrum and pushing opponents off the ball.

See the article about it written by our Bruce Ross, here:

http://www.gen3kinematics.com/p_jun_06.php
.

Where the painful political phrase, 'Argie Bargie' originated from...

 

[Guy]

game over 58-12.

glad i missed it...

 

[Hugh Jarse]

but if i'm not here by any chance

here is is it.

• A JUGARSE
• 09/08/2013 - 20:10

• Padre Ernesto Martearena, Salta

./...snip.../

This guy has to be some sort of relative of mine..

Classic.