NSW AAGPS Rugby 2016

[formerflanker]

Don't worry I was there. Still traumatized. Ahead with 5 to go. Scots go in the corner to take lead. . Shore come back with continuous pick and drive about 15 meteres out, then Emery has a brain explosion and box kicks. end of match

"Schoolboy error". Has been known to happen in this competition.

 

[Jean Pierre Rives]

Kings by far the best scrumaging pack pack regardless of size

Not sure how you arrived at this conclusion but it was very obvious and I think widely agreed that Riverview clearly out scrummaged Kings. This was even conceded to by Mr TKS. Sorry pal you're way off the mark there.

 

[formerflanker]

HJ, IMO I'd suggest that even in 'proper rugby" the bullocks we used to see ponderously plodding around the park, leaving 6 inch deep craters that swallowed up unsuspecting hairdressers appear to be going the way of the dinosaur, particular at the elite level.

The Top 14 seems to have plenty of the bullocks you so eloquently describe.
As long as the scrum leads to clean possession and the potential for penalties, the body shape of front rowers at elite level rugby will remain dinosaur-like.
Let's not forget the lifting role in line outs and attack/defence around the breakdown. Solid bodies are needed for many roles.

 

[Rich_E]

Not sure how you arrived at this conclusion but it was very obvious and I think widely agreed that Riverview clearly out scrummaged Kings. This was even conceded to by Mr TKS. Sorry pal you're way off the mark there.

Scots out scrummaged view IMO. When it mattered. Like scrum in lead up to yassmin try. But Kings out scrummaged Scots IMO. When it mattered. A scrum is only dominant if if it's effort is rewarded. Just saying

 

[Azzuri]

Not sure how you arrived at this conclusion but it was very obvious and I think widely agreed that Riverview clearly out scrummaged Kings. This was even conceded to by Mr TKS. Sorry pal you're way off the mark there.

You are correct the kings scrum was under pressure for most of the game against view. Like players, the scrum can have a bad day as well, and it did. The Kings scrum has more than held its own against every other side, many of who've also had View's measure. The return match however should demonstrate why @NIS gave the Kings scrum such a rap.

 

[Azzuri]

The Top 14 seems to have plenty of the bullocks you so .eloquently describe.
As long as the scrum leads to clean possession and the potential for penalties, the body shape of front rowers at elite level rugby will remain dinosaur-like.
Let's not forget the lifting role in line outs and attack/defence around the breakdown. Solid bodies are needed for many roles.

Totally agree FF (Folau Fainga'a). My point however was that these days, apart from a set of horns and a broad strong back they need to be fast and mobile as well.

 

[OAUI]

In that competition the young men aged 17 years are playing "proper" rugby and are not constrained by Under 19 Laws Variations, although Colts 3rd Grade does operate under the U19 Laws Variation (go figure).
Hugh Jarse, Yesterday at 2:23 PM
3rd grade colts, think now in its second season, was suppose to be open only to U18 players so had to be played under the U19 laws. Essentially SJRU Opens "A" comp, where most club teams looked like the district rep team and most players were viewed as aspirational, became aligned with their districts and encouraged to participate in the Saturday comp. (I believe there were 6 or 7 district who fielded sides last year) It was also thought by aligning it with districts it would be viewed as a stronger comp and attract players. The vast majority of those participating did not attend schools where Saturday sport was played so playing on Saturday was also preferred.

 

[Hugh Jarse]

No. The "experiment" of U18 colts "shared" with SJRU but played before Colts 3rds on Saturday Morning died a slow death after only one attempt at it in 2015.

West Harbour, The Hobbits, Randi-Wix, Gordon and Mighty Two Blues were the clubs that fully embraced the concept. The others sometimes found a team probably better described as Colts 4ths rather than U18 Colts in many respects.

There is no U18 Colts or Colts 4ths this year.

 

[Not in straight]

Not sure how you arrived at this conclusion but it was very obvious and I think widely agreed that Riverview clearly out scrummaged Kings. This was even conceded to by Mr TKS. Sorry pal you're way off the mark there.

I can only go off from the games that I have seen and those are the Shore games. For all I know a particular pack had an off day but played brilliantly the other 4 Matches.

The only objective measure is tightheads won. (I don't believe this to absolutely conclusive in any case).

But I do pay close attention to such things and I believe when Shore played View there was 1 tighthead in the match and that was in Shores favor. Against Kings there was 1 I saw against Shore and GaryOwenIII says there were 2 in the match report (as he has had the benefit of a video review he may be right).

So on that basis I rate Kings as a better Scrum than any other team Shore has faced.

I fully accept that other good people on this thread have been watching different games and may have come to a different conclusion.


I note that Kings were playing Peitch in the second row against Shore and normally he plays 8. Perhaps this gave the scrum a bit more grunt and View may have come up against a slightly different pack.

 

[Rich_E]

AAGPS 1st XV ‘Players of the week’ – Round 5

Below, I have listed all the point winners from Round 5 assigned by the GAGR writers who reviewed the three matches, with the number in brackets indicating how many times the player has been nominated this season.


Shortly, I will post a list of all players nominated over the first 5 rounds and, from that, I will collate the ‘Most picked 1st XV’ for first half of the season. Stay tuned.


Front row
Opeti Helu – New (4)
Daniel Lombardi – Kings (1)

Second row
Jack Spooner – Joeys (1)
Nick Brown – Kings (4)
Rory Suttor – Shore (2)

Back row
Tom Serhon – New (2)
Hugh Green – Scots (4)
Charlie Rorke – View (3)
Michael Fenn – View (3)

Halves
Bayley Kuenzle – New (1)
Kyle Brown – Kings (3)
Max Sinclair – Shore (3)
Nick Shannon – Scots (2)

Centres
Archer Gavin – Scots (1)

Back three
Matthew McTaggart – Joeys (2)
Lachlan Day – Joeys (4)
Ed Gregory – Shore (3)
Oliver Smeallie – View (3)​

 

[Marched Ten]

Haven’t seen the video but apparently Haskins did not play so how did you compare!!!. It is a good thing that the GPS teams are not selected by the Shore fathers who dominate this forum with agenda based comments.Last level playing field was 2014 NSW side where Brown got the points.He is the top point scorer in the GPS at present in one of the top teams.Best to not bag players in a lame attempt to promote your own and leave this one to the selectors who hopefully don't have agendas
Stats from GPS website

Kings – Equal top of table - Brown 2 tries 12 penalties 9 conv - 64 points
Shore - Bottom of the table - Haskins 2 tries – 10 points

Mate Brown obviously kicks, Haskins is not a kicker therefor how is that a fair judgement. Same amount of tries humor me that?

 

[William88]

The entire Scots front row consists of converted back-rowers.

Others I can think of include Holley, Lynch, Lombardi and Serhon at one point last year.

Are there any more?

Does it make for better watching?

This is why the wallabies struggle at scrum time!

In Argentina scrummagers are built from a young age, bring me back a time when the art form of the scrum can't be learnt in an off season by a back rower, but takes years of practice to develop.

 

[Azzuri]

This is why the wallabies struggle at scrum time!

In Argentina scrummagers are built from a young age, bring me back a time when the art form of the scrum can't be learnt in an off season by a back rower, but takes years of practice to develop.

You make a very good point @W88.

The time spent on practicing the "premier set piece" of the game seems inadequate when you think about the strategic importance of having a dominant scrum even at U19 level.

This is less to do with the issue of "converted back rowers" than it is about the amount of time and resources actually dedicated to learning and reinforcing scrum fundamentals and honing counter scrummaging tactics.

IMO this is a systemic issue with junior Rugby across the AU landscape and must therefore have a flow on effect to the senior/elite ranks.

My "back of an envelop" calculation indicates the following:

Based on each scrum play being calculated at a generous 15 seconds but in reality closer to < 8 seconds the following paints a dismal picture:

• Game time scrummaging: If approx 20 scrums are set during a normal game there is 5 minutes of practice X 10 games. I.e 50 minutes per season
• Training scrummaging 1 : approx 40/50 scrums set against a machine with no counter scrummaging ability. 12.5 Mins pw X 10 weeks =2 hours per season.
• Training Scrummaging 2: approx 20 live scrums set against 2nds or thirds = 5m pw X 10 = 50 mins per season

So the grand total is less than 3.5 hours of practice per regular season on arguably the most technically difficult and physically demanding set piece.

If it took Topo Rodriguez 300 pages to provide his thoughts on "Mastering the Art of Scrummaging" I'm not sure that 3.5 hours per season is enough to create master scrummagers post leaving high school.

 

[footy4life]

This is why the wallabies struggle at scrum time!

In Argentina scrummagers are built from a young age, bring me back a time when the art form of the scrum can't be learnt in an off season by a back rower, but takes years of practice to develop.

just 2 years ago the Newington prop Opeti Helu was playing inside centre..

 

[JuanBarn]

Props are born, not made. You virtually know at birth if you have a prop or not.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Lindommer]

.....and then you drown them, quickly, before they grow too big.

 

[Azzuri]

just 2 years ago the Newington prop Opeti Helu was playing inside centre..

and that suggests what exactly?

 

[footy4life]

and that suggests what exactly?

well you just wouldn't really expect it would you? you'd expect he had been playing the position for a lot longer after watching him play recently

 

[Inside Shoulder]

...and then you drown them, quickly, before they grow too big.

I thought that was wingers?

 

[badratsky]

just 2 years ago the Newington prop Opeti Helu was playing inside centre..

To be fairthough, two years ago he was in Tonga and compared to the rest of them he's a hobbit.