W
waves
Guest
Anyone have any insight of how the boys played or any standouts for the NSW Championships ?
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C
catchpole
Guest
waves,
I am also very keen to hear about the results of the U.16 trial matches over the weekend.
I attended last season's U.16 weekend and learned quite a bit by observing the CAS, CCC, ISA and President's (GPS) games and then reviewing final two the teams produced by the selectors.
A number of reputations will be created, established or enhanced as a result of last weekend. Based on the comments on this site in the GPS & NSW Schools threads, the investment by the NSW Schools Rugby Union, together with the ARU, becomes a significant feature of future Open/U.18 selections over the next two years.
I am a novice with regards to Schoolboy Rugby and selection politics. However from now on I intend to pay far more attention to the selection of participating teams and appointment of coaches in the U.16 age division.
The dynamics of comparative physical development of players is probably at it greatest range in the U.16 division. Last year at Curragul my impression was that both the ISA and CCC teams were far larger and more physically developed than their CAS and GPS counterparts. Notwithstanding that comparative imbalance both CAS and GPS were competetive due to superior discipline and technical skills.
The option of routes available to the U.16 players to the National Championships is also intriguing. Players can progress to the Championships by either of the following two pathways;
1.NSW U.16 Schools
2.Sydney Junior Rugby Union U.16
In my opinion the best example of the classic selection puzzle was Cameron Clark who played in the Selection Trials for CAS U.16. Cameron Clark was not selected for NSW Schools but played in the National Championships for Sydney JRU and was ultimately recognized as one of the players of the tournament.
Players at this age are still mostly playing club and district representative rugby. In the example quoted above, Cameron Clark was playing for Gordon U.16 team that had been very successful over the years. I am advised that selectors are appraised of all the players of interest and take into account whether they have an alternative pathway to gain National Championship exposure.
I beleive that the two teams may be announced after the Sydney JRU and NSWSRU meet to discuss their options.
I am clearly very niaive and will never under estimate the influence/importance of the coaches in the pathways to senior schoolboy representative rugby again.
I am also very keen to hear about the results of the U.16 trial matches over the weekend.
I attended last season's U.16 weekend and learned quite a bit by observing the CAS, CCC, ISA and President's (GPS) games and then reviewing final two the teams produced by the selectors.
A number of reputations will be created, established or enhanced as a result of last weekend. Based on the comments on this site in the GPS & NSW Schools threads, the investment by the NSW Schools Rugby Union, together with the ARU, becomes a significant feature of future Open/U.18 selections over the next two years.
I am a novice with regards to Schoolboy Rugby and selection politics. However from now on I intend to pay far more attention to the selection of participating teams and appointment of coaches in the U.16 age division.
The dynamics of comparative physical development of players is probably at it greatest range in the U.16 division. Last year at Curragul my impression was that both the ISA and CCC teams were far larger and more physically developed than their CAS and GPS counterparts. Notwithstanding that comparative imbalance both CAS and GPS were competetive due to superior discipline and technical skills.
The option of routes available to the U.16 players to the National Championships is also intriguing. Players can progress to the Championships by either of the following two pathways;
1.NSW U.16 Schools
2.Sydney Junior Rugby Union U.16
In my opinion the best example of the classic selection puzzle was Cameron Clark who played in the Selection Trials for CAS U.16. Cameron Clark was not selected for NSW Schools but played in the National Championships for Sydney JRU and was ultimately recognized as one of the players of the tournament.
Players at this age are still mostly playing club and district representative rugby. In the example quoted above, Cameron Clark was playing for Gordon U.16 team that had been very successful over the years. I am advised that selectors are appraised of all the players of interest and take into account whether they have an alternative pathway to gain National Championship exposure.
I beleive that the two teams may be announced after the Sydney JRU and NSWSRU meet to discuss their options.
I am clearly very niaive and will never under estimate the influence/importance of the coaches in the pathways to senior schoolboy representative rugby again.
thecow
Ward Prentice (10)
i was at the 16s weekend this year, and all the rugby played was very good, with all but two or three games being very close. from memory:
saturday:
cas 2s 27 beat isa 2s 26
cas 1s 41 beat isa 1s 7
country beat aices, cant remember score but it was close
chs 25 beat ccc 24 with a penalty from the sideline on the bell
gps 1s beat gps 2s by a lot
sunday:
country and isa 2s had a 17-all draw
cas 2s 32 beat aices 12
chs beat isa 1s by about 10-15 points from memory
gps 2s 24 beat ccc 20 will a brilliant try on the bell to win it
gps 1s 17 beat cas 1s 16 in a very good game.
some outstanding players from the weekend:
1. the cas 1s forward pack, especially the tight 5, got over the top of the isa 1s pack and kept the team in the contest against a very good gps 1s team
2. the gps 1s back row, in particular jack dempsey (brother of michael) from riverview
3. the gps 1s back line in general
4. henry clunies-ross, fullback in cas 1s from trinity, had an outstanding game against gps 1s
5. clint gutherson, the chs fullback from cromer high played very well over the two days
saturday:
cas 2s 27 beat isa 2s 26
cas 1s 41 beat isa 1s 7
country beat aices, cant remember score but it was close
chs 25 beat ccc 24 with a penalty from the sideline on the bell
gps 1s beat gps 2s by a lot
sunday:
country and isa 2s had a 17-all draw
cas 2s 32 beat aices 12
chs beat isa 1s by about 10-15 points from memory
gps 2s 24 beat ccc 20 will a brilliant try on the bell to win it
gps 1s 17 beat cas 1s 16 in a very good game.
some outstanding players from the weekend:
1. the cas 1s forward pack, especially the tight 5, got over the top of the isa 1s pack and kept the team in the contest against a very good gps 1s team
2. the gps 1s back row, in particular jack dempsey (brother of michael) from riverview
3. the gps 1s back line in general
4. henry clunies-ross, fullback in cas 1s from trinity, had an outstanding game against gps 1s
5. clint gutherson, the chs fullback from cromer high played very well over the two days
W
waves
Guest
Can someone explain the draft pick system aswell ?
thecow
Ward Prentice (10)
from what i know the sydney juniors and nsw country sides are club representative sides, and nsw schools is a school representative side. this means that if you play school rugby but not club, you can only be selected for nsw schools, and vice versa.
so, even if you play both and you only play at one of the trials (i.e. the past weekend for the schools sides, and the regionals next week for the sydney and country sides), you can only be picked for who you try out for.
if you play at both and both select you in the team, it is based on a pick system. i think it rotates and i know that sydney juniors had the first pick last year, so that would mean that nsw schools gets the first pick this year.
footy-kid
Allen Oxlade (6)
this is my tip on the team, though i believe it will be majority dominated by GPS 1's and CAS 1's, as Allan Alaatatoa is playing opens, not sure if he is available for selection.
#1Malaki Tiumalu-Afele CHS
#2Hamish Austin CCC
#3Chris Talakai CAS
#4Harry Rourke GPS
#5Mckenzie Rae GPS
#6Oscar Pryor-Lees GPS
#7Jack Dempsey GPS
#8Patrick Sio CAS
#9Jude Prater GPS
#10John Vaux GPS
#11Shaun Townsend CAS
#12David Horwitz GPS
#13Alex Vlahos GPS
#14Diego Lobos Gonzalez CAS
#15Clint Gutherson CHS
this is just from what i saw at the trials at Pittwater and Knox, i also would include #7Daniel Boxall CCC, #13Robert Duff CCC, #2Tom Wilson CAS, #13Fabian Natoli ISA, #3Matagi Sau CHS and #8Brandon Mafi CHS
what are your views on this?
#1Malaki Tiumalu-Afele CHS
#2Hamish Austin CCC
#3Chris Talakai CAS
#4Harry Rourke GPS
#5Mckenzie Rae GPS
#6Oscar Pryor-Lees GPS
#7Jack Dempsey GPS
#8Patrick Sio CAS
#9Jude Prater GPS
#10John Vaux GPS
#11Shaun Townsend CAS
#12David Horwitz GPS
#13Alex Vlahos GPS
#14Diego Lobos Gonzalez CAS
#15Clint Gutherson CHS
this is just from what i saw at the trials at Pittwater and Knox, i also would include #7Daniel Boxall CCC, #13Robert Duff CCC, #2Tom Wilson CAS, #13Fabian Natoli ISA, #3Matagi Sau CHS and #8Brandon Mafi CHS
what are your views on this?
W
waves
Guest
Apparently:
- CHS were very poor in their respective games
- The CAS forwards will dominate selection best pack in the competition by far with numerous Tighthead scrums and countless turnovers.
- The GPS backs will dominate selection in the front line with solid combinations.
1. V. Morsello (CAS)
2. T. Wilson (CAS)
3. C. Talakai (CAS)
4. C. Ingram-Melson (CAS)
5. H. Rourke (GPS)
6. J. Dempsey (GPS)
7. J. Johnson (CAS)
8. P. Sio (CAS)
9. J. Freeman (GPS)
10. J. Vaux (GPS)
11. J. Hopoate (CHS)
12. J. Stewart (GPS)
13. D. Horwitz (GPS)
14. W. Patterson (CAS)
15. H. Clunies-Ross (CAS)
Although with a top side like this with a number of First 15 players alot of them played in the Sydney trials (in bold) last weekend which could see a number of players being drafted into Sydney jrs.
footy-kid
Allen Oxlade (6)
From watching the Pittwater trials i noticed that the CAS #11 & #14 dominated, with elusive running. Also the #2 from CCC was the stand-out forward easily in their respective match against ISA, a strong runner and didn't stop, the CCC #10 played well. With the Knox trials, CAS wingers kept form, and only saw one match of CCC when the #10 didn't play as well, though the #2 won a tighthead and didn't lose a lineout against GPS, wondering if would put him into contention. i agree with that team, though didn't see much of CAS during the tournament, their forward's did look dominate during my viewing. I noticed you didn't pick any CCC players, though not winning any games, they were only ever beaten on or over full-time, and holding strong most games, still believe this will be a GPS dominated side.
any other possible/probables?
any other possible/probables?
thecow
Ward Prentice (10)
rorke and stewart definetely did not play at the trials at knox, which were the only ones gps played in, and im pretty sure but not certain hopoate didnt, so they can only be selected for sydney juniors. with the fullbacks, clint gutherson had 2 outstanding games over the 2 days, while henry clunies-ross had 1 really good game against gps and 1 pretty average game against isa.
footy-kid
Allen Oxlade (6)
stewart was playing league one day of the weekend, fairly sure, and rourke was injured but attended, could consider him, hopoate played 3rds for CHS, so does that keep him in contention? also it is going to be tough to choose between patrick sio and brandon mafi. did anyone see the player from CCC who had a possible broken leg? didnt catch a number.
thecow
Ward Prentice (10)
u have to play at either the pittwater trials and/or the knox trials. seeing that rorke did not [PLAY at either, he can only be selected for sydney juniors. im not sure if hopoate played at pittwater, but he definetely played at regionals on the weekend.
footy-kid
Allen Oxlade (6)
so that keeps rourke out, and did see hopoate play at pittwater
who would be your starting xv?
W
waves
Guest
Not necessilary one of the head selectors told me that injured players may still be available for selection depending if fit for the competition no matter in Opens or 16's. I though Jim Stewart was injured thats all didn't know he was playing league, Jamil Hopoate played at Knox and at Newington for CHS 3rd's and should be in the front running for a wing spot.
As for other players, Ive hurd who could be in the mix:
- Brendan Mafi (brother of Alfie Mafi) played at #8 for CHS in the trials at knox and #14 for MWZ at the sydney trials. Should be a top shot to make either team it would seem that both Patrick Sio and Brendan Mafi should get the gig at 8 depends on his first choice position.
- Matangi Sau #3 CHS to my knowledge only played at the Knox trials and to be fairly honest didnt make much of an impact around the field from him dispite him making it last year. Chris Talakai (brother of Sam Talakai) #3 CAS was a real standout at the Knox and Sydney trials although it could work against him making NSW with this draft system in place, Captain of MWZ also.
- Cameron McIness #9 CCC played at 10 in the second game and looked a real good prospect, behind a good CAS or GPS pack would imagine him to have a good go, I believe he is contracted with South Sydney Rabbitohs, Also Vaux from GPS should be a notable front runner.
- The hooker spot is very much open I believe between CCC - Hamish Austin , CAS - Tom Wilson and Sam Kitchen last year's Hooker also the GPS hooker dont know his name but this spot wide open as for the #7 CAS - Johnson , GPS - Dempsey , CCC - Boxall all very talented players.
- Second Row CAS#4 Ingram-Melson very big boy and should get a spot in the side, also played for MWZ and I believe that if fit Rourke would slot straight in after his performances last year.
- The Centre combination is going to be a tough pick I believe if Jim Stewart was playing union he'd be apart of the NSW team after last year and his selection in the Scots First XV team, CHS - Vinnie Baranyi played well also GPS - Horwitz and Vlahos combined well together and Rob Duff put in solid performances.
- Wing spots James Blackwell i believe #14 CCC played a solid few games both at outside and on the wing, tall rangy player. Lobos-Gonzalez CAS #14 has some serious speed, literally speed to burn, although gets abit lost on the field his other winger aswell in Townsend.
Fill free to post any other players its literally whoever gets first picked will post a strong side, so you'd like to think.
thecow
Ward Prentice (10)
my starting xv would be:
1. vinny morsello (trinity/cas)
2. tom wilson (barker/cas)
3. allan alaatoa (newington/gps) - gordon broome played at both aru division 1 championships and aru 16s nationals last year
4. charles ingram-melsom (waverley/cas)
5. michael rowley (knox/cas)
6. oscar pryor-lees (newington/gps)
7. jack dempsey (riverview/gps)
8. patrick sio (trinity/cas)
9. charlie freeman (riverview/gps)
10. clint gutherson (cromer high/chs) - his number was 15, but at knox he was playing 10
11. jamil hopoate (cromer high/chs)
12. jim stewart (scots/gps)
13. alex vlahos (newington/gps) - this would be an outstanding centre combination
14. diego lobos-gonzalez (waverley/cas)
15. henry clunies-ross (trinity/cas)
footy-kid
Allen Oxlade (6)
- Alaatatoa (GPS) picked in NSW 1's Opens, should be automatic selection, Sau (CHS), seemed lazy after a few runs, and both Morsello (CAS), Talakai (CAS) where strong for their team and dominant scrum
- Mafi (CHS) and Sio (CAS) should both be picked
-Tough between Vaux (GPS) and Mcinnes (CCC), as Vaux is a union background, i believe this will get him selected, though Mcinnes is a strong runner and good hands
-Austin (CCC) and Wilson (CAS) are most likely the front runners, as CAS forwards packed well against GPS forwards, also Kitchen (CAS) is only in CAS 2's, believing Wilson cancels him out of contention, with the only other possibility Fitzpatrick (GPS)
- Johnson (CAS) and Dempsey (GPS), both great around the park and with size, with Boxall (CCC) a great pilferer and a menace in the breakdown, thinking his size will let him down, with a small frame
- Rourke (GPS) if fit and well, will get the pick after great performances with Gordan and NSW last year, Ingram-Melson (CAS) was as solid in the lineouts as around the park
- Baranyi (CHS) and Stewart, NSW last year, all have size and power, especially over the likes of Duff (CCC) ,though being a good player, i heard size was an important factor for this team, with combination of Horwitz and Vlahos (GPS) could prove better, wait and see
-Blackwell (CCC) scored 3 tries in first match against CHS and proved he has the skill, but is beaten on pace by Lobos-Gonzalez (CAS) and on par with Townsend (CAS), anothet tough one
- Clint Gutherson (CHS) and Clunies-Ross (CAS) are both quality players, showed alot of potential and talent in both games
-possibles include, Moylan (GPS) for a flanker, he has size and power and could be selected, Prater (GPS) the scrumhalf came off bench on second game, though starting number, lifted his game, clean ball, quick plays and a nice all round player
any others you believe?
Lee Grant
John Eales (66)
Pardon my ignorance, but it seems that the U/16 trials have changed in the last few years.
As recently as a couple of years ago IIRR GPS didn't even have an U/16 team and Joeys lads, for example, had to be invited to a Presidents team to get a trial run.
Anybody know when the scenario changed - or am I having a senior moment and it was always as it is now?
As recently as a couple of years ago IIRR GPS didn't even have an U/16 team and Joeys lads, for example, had to be invited to a Presidents team to get a trial run.
Anybody know when the scenario changed - or am I having a senior moment and it was always as it is now?
W
waves
Guest
Had a chat with him last week and he said his not participating in the NSW16s competition, I went and watched West Harbour play at the state champs their backs let them down greatfully but the forwards were in top class.
1. C. Talakai
3. A. Aalaatoa
4. C. Ingram-Melson
7. N. Mae
8. P. Sio
footy-kid
Allen Oxlade (6)
they are all strong players, i dont think that Mae is as strong as the other flankers at knox trials though, the rest should all make it
this does leave hooker wide open
any more ideas on starting and reserve hookers?
tom wilson-CAS, hamish austin-CCC, jackson fitzpatrick-GPS...
W
waves
Guest
To be honest i think Tom Wilson will play for SJRU in the championships with this draft system as NSW will probably pick Talakai one of the 2 will be shifted leaving Hooker wide open, Jackson Fitzpatrick to start - Hamish to reserve.
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