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NO Salary Caps in Australia

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Levo

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Have I been asleep? A new salary cap of $A4.4 million (?) a year has been officially introduced by the ARU to control the finances of the 5 Australian franchises. I also believe it is going to be reduced further in 2013/2014 to A$4.1 m per annum.

This issue of a salary cap has not been talked about in the press, apart from a few articles where it was "proposed".

I personally am not a fan of salary caps, because I feel they are verging on illegal and being a restraint of trade. When an individual pays to see a professional sportsperson, the price of the ticket should reflect the level of professionalism, like in Formula 1, soccer, golf, or tennis. I expect the market forces to be at work and the professional sportsman is getting the market value for his skills. The more money they receive, is usually a refection of how in demand they are. These sports people also attract large and lucrative sponsorships.

Rugby is an international game. Any decision for introducing operating parameters should be based on what is happening with the international competition. There are salary caps in the UK and France. The salary cap in the UK is currently A$6.25 million per annum, and France at A$14 million. These caps are quoted when the Aussie Dollar is strong. If the Aussie Dollar weaken again, then the European salary cap figures will look more like A$10 million in the UK and A$19 million in France.

If a salary cap is required in the short term then the dollar amount should be increased to match our competitors.

Australian Rugby needs to attract more money. The Rebels model being the privately owned Harold Mitchell's consortium seems to be working with a strong mixture of players, management and money.

I personally do not want to see the Super 15 become an inferior competition to the competitions in the UK and France.

The ARU should be a bit more imaginative. I would like the Super 15 vision, and the Australian teams to be at the top of their game playing in a rich and successful competition, watching the best players, being coached by the best coaches, in front of full stadiums, and large TV audiences.

Finally, how is Australian Rugby going to get its best playing combinations right. I would like to see a Genia, Cooper and O'Connor and Beale playing combination every week. This would be the new standard for the spur for the other Australian teams to find palyers and combinations to compete. The idea is very exciting. This I feel is not going to happen for A$4.4 million a year spread over 30 players.
 
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TOCC

Guest
i feel as though there has been a dramatic rise in the duplication of threads in recent months...


Leo, you make some good points which im sure many people will agree with, however i strongly disagree with your comment that having Cooper, Beale, Genia and JOC (James O'Connor) in the same Super Rugby team would be beneficial to Australian rugby in the long run.

Yeah it might make one team look pretty slick, but in terms of individual players i think there development would be stymied by playing alongside each other, the players wouldnt see nearly as much ball playing alongside each other as opposed to the current situation where they are the go-to men for there respective teams.
 

Groucho

Greg Davis (50)
i feel as though there has been a dramatic rise in the duplication of threads in recent months...


Leo, you make some good points which im sure many people will agree with, however i strongly disagree with your comment that having Cooper, Beale, Genia and JOC (James O'Connor) in the same Super Rugby team would be beneficial to Australian rugby in the long run.

Yeah it might make one team look pretty slick, but in terms of individual players i think there development would be stymied by playing alongside each other, the players wouldnt see nearly as much ball playing alongside each other as opposed to the current situation where they are the go-to men for there respective teams.

Absolutely. Australian rugby is best served by having five competitive teams, and having differences in coaching, preparation, skills and playing style competing to determine the winning team. What competes, improves. If money is what competes, then it it only money that improves.
 

Ignoto

Peter Sullivan (51)
Absolutely. Australian rugby is best served by having five competitive teams, and having differences in coaching, preparation, skills and playing style competing to determine the winning team. What competes, improves. If money is what competes, then it it only money that improves.

The bigger problem is, we are just creating competitive Australian teams. I doubt the South Africans or Kiwis will be going down the path of a Salary cap. As a result, you're forcing our teams to play with one hand behind their back.

The principle of a Salary Cap is great, that is creating more balanced Australian teams, but unless all parties are going to abide by it the benefits in my eyes will be limited!

More importantly, how does a salary cap actually grow talent where its needed? For example, the Force aren't producing young talent, same with the Rebels (but they've only come into the scene this year).

Also, what happens when more and more players start to move overseas because they can't even get a similar deal here in Australia? How will this then impact the Super teams to compete more importantly, how will it impact the Wallabies? Will we allow selection from other competitions?
 
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darkhorse

Darby Loudon (17)
Absolutely.

The system wasn't broken, so why are they trying to fix it?

The system was broken. The ARU is losing money rapidly.

The new system will allow clubs to allocate their money to where they need it. The previous system only allowed them to pay players up $150,000 a year. Under the new system they'll get more money to pay the players they want. Players like Sharpe and Waugh who are no longer vital to the wallabies future, yet they're crucial to their franchise from a leadership point of view. The tahs and the force would eagerly pay them an extra $100,000 to keep them in the country and now they will be able to just under the confines of a salary cap which will encourage finanical responsibility.
 
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TOCC

Guest
The bigger problem is, we are just creating competitive Australian teams. I doubt the South Africans or Kiwis will be going down the path of a Salary cap. As a result, you're forcing our teams to play with one hand behind their back.

The principle of a Salary Cap is great, that is creating more balanced Australian teams, but unless all parties are going to abide by it the benefits in my eyes will be limited!

More importantly, how does a salary cap actually grow talent where its needed? For example, the Force aren't producing young talent, same with the Rebels (but they've only come into the scene this year).

Also, what happens when more and more players start to move overseas because they can't even get a similar deal here in Australia? How will this then impact the Super teams to compete more importantly, how will it impact the Wallabies? Will we allow selection from other competitions?

Kiwis already use a form of dispersing there talent, and they have had the most competitive teams for the entirety of the Super Rugby competition.
 

cyclopath

George Smith (75)
Staff member
Kiwis already use a form of dispersing there talent, and they have had the most competitive teams for the entirety of the Super Rugby competition.
Well, they've had 2 very good teams / franchises, and 3 that have shown glimpses of form at times, but no consistency. South Africa have had 3 very good teams, and Aus sort of 3 (although they've all been pretty up and down at times). I agree the weaker NZ teams are more likely to trouble other teams than those at the bottom of the other 2 conferences now.
I agree that I cannot see how a salary cap induces growth in rugby-poor regions.
 

James Buchanan

Trevor Allan (34)
I personally am not a fan of salary caps, because I feel they are verging on illegal and being a restraint of trade.

Once again the "Restraint of Trade" chestnut is raised. Do you understand what the legal position regarding this is?
 

James Buchanan

Trevor Allan (34)
I don't think anyone does because it has never gone to court.

Thing is, I know that there's a body of law on section 92 of the constitution, which is generally referred to the "restraint of trade" provisions. However, current interpretation of that section is that it prevents 'restrictions in trade in a protectionist sense'. ie: it prevents the states from enacting laws which impedes trade between states.

Now, I know under an old interpretation it used to apply to individuals as well, but I am not sure if that is still the case.

What I am trying to ascertain is whether the term 'restraint of trade' is being bandied around in an attempt to add credibility to an argument, if it is being used innocently or if the person using it has a greater understanding of what it means than I.
 
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TOCC

Guest
A Salary Cap is perfectly legal in Australia, in addition JON has experience in introducing one(remember the A-League)...
A draft on the other hand would be pushing shit uphill...
 

jay-c

Ron Walden (29)
this will be a disaster
force fans arnt gunna like it but australian rugby is better off having one or two stacked teams that make the finals with a shot of winning it rather than 5 mediocre teams
the saffas have in the last few years had a couple of good teams and a couple of shit teams, same as the kiwis- its the best chance for trophies
 

Bullrush

Geoff Shaw (53)
I am quickly beginning to think that the most important person in any team in any sport is the coach. If I ran or owned a club, the coach may be the most highly paid person in the squad.

And if the coach is good, you stand by them thru thick and thin, wins and losses, player power and contract negotiations.....the best coaches will get wins from players and teams the average coach won't.

Get the coach right and the salary cap won't matter....
 

The_Brown_Hornet

John Eales (66)
Totally against the salary cap for reasons that I've outlined many times before. All I think it will do in the end is reduce the tenure of players in Australia and send them overseas. It's a ridiculous idea. You can't enforce equality anyway. A good, well managed franchise will beat a mediocre one any day, even with the governing body trying to reduce their advantage. Everything I've seen in pro sport over the last 20 years points to it.

EDIT: Bullrush, I agree with you. A coach is very important, which should surprise nobody.
 

Shiggins

Simon Poidevin (60)
Leo, you make some good points which im sure many people will agree with, however i strongly disagree with your comment that having Cooper, Beale, Genia and JOC (James O'Connor) in the same Super Rugby team would be beneficial to Australian rugby in the long run.

Spot on toc. You need guys like this spread out too help all the youngsters coming through. Even though they are youngsters themselves.




Go the force!!!!
 
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