New Zealand vs Australia Oct 11 2020 Bledisloe Cup
- Thread starter Dismal Pillock
- Start date
TSR
Andrew Slack (58)
With regards to the kicks - I think they can really help break the defence down - but the execution needs to be much better. The one that JB marked when the Wallabies has penalty advantage needed to be much higher so Koriobete could either contest or absolutely smash Barrett in the bottom corner. The one he grubbered into the in-goal was definitely a poor choice. MK almost got it, but gee he must have been shirty To'omua didn’t just pass it to him or put it through the hands.
Brumby Runner
Jason Little (69)
Fabulous game by the Wallabies and great to hold the ABs to a draw. Along with others, I thought at the end the Darkness were kept in the game by the officiating.
Every Wallaby played with distinction and there was a really noticeable step up from their performances in recent years. My only real criticism was the lack of a killer instinct, or whatever, to finish off their moves when they got into good attacking positions. So many pilfers by the Blacks, notably Cane and the THP, in their own red zone.
If I were to contemplate changes for Eden Park, I would want to strengthen the attacking options. Good as Paisami was, I reckon Petaia if fit offers more and needs to come into the 13 spot. I would also swap Ala'alatoa and Tupou. AAA was a rock when he came on, as he always is, and would be best when the going is tight at the beginning. TT on the other hand would relish the last 30 minutes where his unmatched attacking flair would cause no end of trouble.
I'm not sure what to do about the halves/No 12. After his ordinary game in the SRAu final, Nic White was fortunate to start the test, but he had an impressive game. Out shone Smith imo. JOC (James O'Connor) and MT were serviceable in attack and extremely effective in defense. Would Lolesio add to the attack at 10 with either JOC (James O'Connor) or MT at 12? Or should we be more than satisfied with the current combination which kept the dangerous Moanga/Goodhue partnership quiet for most of the game?
More than happy with the locking duo of LSL (Lukhan Salakaia-Loto) and Philip. Don't think the backrow was as strong as we'd hoped, and just maybe weakened the lineout as well. Wilson will be a star, but I think test match rugby is a step too far atm, at least against one of the world's top teams. Hooper and Samu made one pilfer each as far as I could tell. Both good players but probably not the strongest pairing when playing together. I think Liam Wright must come into calculations for next week for his lineout work primarily, but not at 6 or 8. Just won't happen, will it?
Kudos to the coaching team as well. Put out a team which surpassed most expectations, including those of the majority of NZers I would guess.
Every Wallaby played with distinction and there was a really noticeable step up from their performances in recent years. My only real criticism was the lack of a killer instinct, or whatever, to finish off their moves when they got into good attacking positions. So many pilfers by the Blacks, notably Cane and the THP, in their own red zone.
If I were to contemplate changes for Eden Park, I would want to strengthen the attacking options. Good as Paisami was, I reckon Petaia if fit offers more and needs to come into the 13 spot. I would also swap Ala'alatoa and Tupou. AAA was a rock when he came on, as he always is, and would be best when the going is tight at the beginning. TT on the other hand would relish the last 30 minutes where his unmatched attacking flair would cause no end of trouble.
I'm not sure what to do about the halves/No 12. After his ordinary game in the SRAu final, Nic White was fortunate to start the test, but he had an impressive game. Out shone Smith imo. JOC (James O'Connor) and MT were serviceable in attack and extremely effective in defense. Would Lolesio add to the attack at 10 with either JOC (James O'Connor) or MT at 12? Or should we be more than satisfied with the current combination which kept the dangerous Moanga/Goodhue partnership quiet for most of the game?
More than happy with the locking duo of LSL (Lukhan Salakaia-Loto) and Philip. Don't think the backrow was as strong as we'd hoped, and just maybe weakened the lineout as well. Wilson will be a star, but I think test match rugby is a step too far atm, at least against one of the world's top teams. Hooper and Samu made one pilfer each as far as I could tell. Both good players but probably not the strongest pairing when playing together. I think Liam Wright must come into calculations for next week for his lineout work primarily, but not at 6 or 8. Just won't happen, will it?
Kudos to the coaching team as well. Put out a team which surpassed most expectations, including those of the majority of NZers I would guess.
Pfitzy
Nathan Sharpe (72)
My Thoughts From Another Forum, Part The First:
"I've calmed down a bit now, having had to go pay $430 to get my daughter's macbook fixed after she spilled water on it last week. That whole process - forking out money to Apple - was more enjoyable than watching Williams referee.
And before you get going: I completed my field test with NSW Rugby and am an accredited ref so I come from a position of knowledge on this. So... yeah... suck my balls all of you armchair fucking refs
As an introductory note: how AFG missed that foot on the line will forever be a mystery. You make a living out of this Angus. The lines are nice and straight. Stick your fucking flag up. Does it make some kind of cosmic justice thing when Ioane refuses to mess up his hair while dropping the ball later? No. It does not.
Some refs - a lot of the French ones - just let players sort it out, mostly. Sometimes that can look weird, but then they make a decision and you figure they're just keeping the threshold for intervention high i.e. they don't want to be the star attraction. Sometimes the decision made is a head scratcher but you sort of accept French people are weird and move on.
Williams tends to avoid decisions whenever he can - even when it is blindingly obvious that a decision needs to be made. In the first half Mounga gets rid of the ball and a full second later Wilson absolutely clatters him - right in front. Williams sort of puts his arm out and then does nothing. Just gets on with things. Multiple tackles from both teams go high - not dangerously so, but potential for escalation which should be ruled on early to set a marker - and he does nothing.
He rightly pings Tupou for being a shitwit at ruck time (twice) because it is well past the back of the ruck when he finishes trying to piss off Aaron Smith (a noble pursuit). But I counted at least three times for each team where a cleanout happened from the side of the ruck and did zero.
Penalises Koroibete for going off his feet when no AB was contesting the ball, then lets it go for another Wallaby player in the same situation and says nobody was contesting the ball.
Of course, there are the big ones - the biggest of which is probably the two scrums later in the second half where Alalaatoa hands out a complete reaming to Karl T (who packed at an angle, pushed at an angle, and got folded into an angle on the ground), and tells the Wobs "you're not getting it", then does Sio for exactly the same thing at the next scrum. What were the fucking ARs doing while Alalaatoa was introducing Big Karl's forehead to the turf?
I'd love to be a fly on the wall at the referee review. It isn't easy - I know that from personal experience even at my gumby level of refereeing. But there are head scratchers and then there is out and out inconsistency that leads to incompetence.
Note: the 2 short arms against Australia for going early at scrum time? Every fucking ref knows that the second one is a penalty you tit."
"I've calmed down a bit now, having had to go pay $430 to get my daughter's macbook fixed after she spilled water on it last week. That whole process - forking out money to Apple - was more enjoyable than watching Williams referee.
And before you get going: I completed my field test with NSW Rugby and am an accredited ref so I come from a position of knowledge on this. So... yeah... suck my balls all of you armchair fucking refs
As an introductory note: how AFG missed that foot on the line will forever be a mystery. You make a living out of this Angus. The lines are nice and straight. Stick your fucking flag up. Does it make some kind of cosmic justice thing when Ioane refuses to mess up his hair while dropping the ball later? No. It does not.
Some refs - a lot of the French ones - just let players sort it out, mostly. Sometimes that can look weird, but then they make a decision and you figure they're just keeping the threshold for intervention high i.e. they don't want to be the star attraction. Sometimes the decision made is a head scratcher but you sort of accept French people are weird and move on.
Williams tends to avoid decisions whenever he can - even when it is blindingly obvious that a decision needs to be made. In the first half Mounga gets rid of the ball and a full second later Wilson absolutely clatters him - right in front. Williams sort of puts his arm out and then does nothing. Just gets on with things. Multiple tackles from both teams go high - not dangerously so, but potential for escalation which should be ruled on early to set a marker - and he does nothing.
He rightly pings Tupou for being a shitwit at ruck time (twice) because it is well past the back of the ruck when he finishes trying to piss off Aaron Smith (a noble pursuit). But I counted at least three times for each team where a cleanout happened from the side of the ruck and did zero.
Penalises Koroibete for going off his feet when no AB was contesting the ball, then lets it go for another Wallaby player in the same situation and says nobody was contesting the ball.
Of course, there are the big ones - the biggest of which is probably the two scrums later in the second half where Alalaatoa hands out a complete reaming to Karl T (who packed at an angle, pushed at an angle, and got folded into an angle on the ground), and tells the Wobs "you're not getting it", then does Sio for exactly the same thing at the next scrum. What were the fucking ARs doing while Alalaatoa was introducing Big Karl's forehead to the turf?
I'd love to be a fly on the wall at the referee review. It isn't easy - I know that from personal experience even at my gumby level of refereeing. But there are head scratchers and then there is out and out inconsistency that leads to incompetence.
Note: the 2 short arms against Australia for going early at scrum time? Every fucking ref knows that the second one is a penalty you tit."
Pfitzy
Nathan Sharpe (72)
Thoughts From Another Forum, Part The Second:
"All that said: you'd have to say that is a fair result in that NEITHER team deserved to win.
Wallabies lineout and ruck work was bad. The backline had a couple of flashes running that short side, but were given a mountain of possession and achieved very little with it prior to the rain hitting. The scrum was inconsistent (even if Ofa gamed the ref into giving some short arms), and the work off the back of said scrum was ponderous.
White's long passing game was sub-par but his running was good. Option taking from To'omua was often poor. JOC (James O'Connor) was solid but not spectacular. I thought Paisami was workable and Daugunu was rocks and diamonds - that offload to DMac when he made a break was crap, but he skinned the defender a couple of times with pace and a bit of good work from his inside men. Forward pack was OK bar the lineout - I thought Matt Philip and Harry Wilson were very good on the carry.
Overall surprised Wallabies were still in it despite operating a couple gears lower than the ABs. But our handling seems to have improved bar a couple of absolutely howlers (that set move before halftime).
Speaking of whom: handling errors must have been killers for AB fans. I think ?9? in the first half alone? Very much NOT like an AB team and you'd have to say the crucial one was the dropped ball over the tryline. Sorry Rieko but the game is about more than your hairstyle getting messed up, sunshine.
When they had the ball, the decision making was rapid and generally accurate from Smith but everything else was a bit meh. Besides the first try they didn't really execute a backline move with precision and there wasn't much first phase attack that really stood out. Defensively very good which you kind of expect these days.
Sam Cane was a fucking monster and easily MOTM for me. The number of times he saved the collective arse of the national pride was sublime. Honourable mentions to Harry Wilson on debut.
Both teams will be better for it, but I think barring injury we'll see an unchanged Wallaby side in Auckland while the pressure will come to bear on Foster over what he picked for today and it'll put a laser focus on what he picks next week.
The issue for AB fans is this: after a close game against the Wallabies (or * gasp * a loss) they're used to their team absolutely smashing them next time. So it is a cliff face of expectation, and I know someone like Cane will relish that.
Foster? Not so sure."
"All that said: you'd have to say that is a fair result in that NEITHER team deserved to win.
Wallabies lineout and ruck work was bad. The backline had a couple of flashes running that short side, but were given a mountain of possession and achieved very little with it prior to the rain hitting. The scrum was inconsistent (even if Ofa gamed the ref into giving some short arms), and the work off the back of said scrum was ponderous.
White's long passing game was sub-par but his running was good. Option taking from To'omua was often poor. JOC (James O'Connor) was solid but not spectacular. I thought Paisami was workable and Daugunu was rocks and diamonds - that offload to DMac when he made a break was crap, but he skinned the defender a couple of times with pace and a bit of good work from his inside men. Forward pack was OK bar the lineout - I thought Matt Philip and Harry Wilson were very good on the carry.
Overall surprised Wallabies were still in it despite operating a couple gears lower than the ABs. But our handling seems to have improved bar a couple of absolutely howlers (that set move before halftime).
Speaking of whom: handling errors must have been killers for AB fans. I think ?9? in the first half alone? Very much NOT like an AB team and you'd have to say the crucial one was the dropped ball over the tryline. Sorry Rieko but the game is about more than your hairstyle getting messed up, sunshine.
When they had the ball, the decision making was rapid and generally accurate from Smith but everything else was a bit meh. Besides the first try they didn't really execute a backline move with precision and there wasn't much first phase attack that really stood out. Defensively very good which you kind of expect these days.
Sam Cane was a fucking monster and easily MOTM for me. The number of times he saved the collective arse of the national pride was sublime. Honourable mentions to Harry Wilson on debut.
Both teams will be better for it, but I think barring injury we'll see an unchanged Wallaby side in Auckland while the pressure will come to bear on Foster over what he picked for today and it'll put a laser focus on what he picks next week.
The issue for AB fans is this: after a close game against the Wallabies (or * gasp * a loss) they're used to their team absolutely smashing them next time. So it is a cliff face of expectation, and I know someone like Cane will relish that.
Foster? Not so sure."
Dismal Pillock
Michael Lynagh (62)
No, not his play, yes his leadership in the last 10.
FFS, Mounga casually wandering up to a ruck 5 metres away from the sticks. "GET IN THE POCKET FOR A DROPPIE YOU DUMB DOZEY ***** *******"
BDA
Jim Lenehan (48)
Normally id say id agree but i reckon gardner will be well aware of the reports that his miss tonight might have cost us a win and he's hopefully also aware of the criticisms of the kiwi ref. He'll hopefully try to right the ship
Joe Blow
John Hipwell (52)
No comment on Fainga'a?
Pfitzy
Nathan Sharpe (72)
drewprint
Dick Tooth (41)
No, not his play, yes his leadership in the last 10.
FFS, Mounga casually wandering up to a ruck 5 metres away from the sticks. "GET IN THE POCKET FOR A DROPPIE YOU DUMB DOZEY ***** *******"
Haha right yep, agreed. I was as incredulous with that as I was when we didn’t set up for one either. It’s like the stadium starting emitting crazy gas up through the field in those last 8 minutes. Everyone went bonkers.
Pfitzy
Nathan Sharpe (72)
His running was great.
His kicks were generally good.
His passing was good under 5 metres and the kind of accuracy you'd expect from Nick Phipps at anything beyond 10 metres.
So I wouldn't say "impressive" but he contributed solidly to the plays that mattered.
tragic
John Solomon (38)
So
Solid - enough to retain his spot.
I wouldn’t say one of our best though.
It’s a position in which we lack depth - and has been for a long time.
Solid - enough to retain his spot.
I wouldn’t say one of our best though.
It’s a position in which we lack depth - and has been for a long time.
BDA
Jim Lenehan (48)
Yeh i dont know. For me its all about petaia's fitness. I thought paisami had a strong debut and id be more than comfortable seeing him in the starting side again next week, but for me if petaia is 100% fit, you pick him. Its like leaving folau out of the side - i rate him on that level....if he's touch and go then i wouldnt rush him back.
TSR
Andrew Slack (58)
Not for me, I though Samu was good.
But across the board we were too passive and too slow as first support. A number of the turnovers happened when we actually punch through the defence line - so a good clean out would have opened the space up. That closest support needed to hit the break down like a rocket.
Derpus
Nathan Sharpe (72)
Wright won't fix ball retention. He might help win us some more - although winning turnover ball doesnt look to be a priority. The rush defence worked well.
I don't think you change any players. Just make it a focus at training and trust the boys to improve their execution.
KOB1987
John Eales (66)
The trade off is he kicks the ball back to the opposition when we’re in a scoring position and the play ends up 80m back up the other end. I don’t think you can train that out of him at this stage of his career.
PhilClinton
Mark Loane (55)
Yeh I think the breakdown accuracy we lacked can partly be attributed to new combinations in attack and by that I mean players getting used to how their new teammates go into contact - a few times the support seemed to be unsure of where to link with their lead runners. I’m confident that area will naturally improve next week.