Mark Lawrence Retires

[Jay]

More great work from the IRB and Paddy.

Anyone who has read his blogs will see how knowledgeable this bloke is.

But don't worry boys. Paddy reckons Bryce Lawrence and Alain Roland are better so all is good.

Not really. Or at least there's no way of knowing if it's true or not.

Paddy thinks Kaplan & Joubert are better (I don't) - and for 3 out of the 10 refs appointed to be from one country would be undesirable.

 

[Top Bloke]

What a waste! I had the pleasure of watching Mark close up at a Pirates match in 2003 (he did a club match the week before a TN test) and I've never seen a ref move so well to put himself in an excellent position to see the play at hand. At the time I thought it was an object lesson for young referees; if he can teach up-and-coming refs to get their positioning right he'll have done rugby a huge favour.

POB: why isn't Mark Lawrence at RWC2011? Not good enough. Pack your bags.

Start by availing yourself of the facts before posting - POB has nothing to do with the RWC appointments.
There is a specific RWC 2011 Match Official Selection Committee - POB was NOT on it.
Irishman David Pickering is the chairman, other members are Steve Hilditch, Tappe Henning, Michael Lamoullie, Bob Francis

 

[Lindommer]

Thanks for that info, TB.

 

[Hawko]

Start by availing yourself of the facts before posting - POB has nothing to do with the RWC appointments.
There is a specific RWC 2011 Match Official Selection Committee - POB was NOT on it.
Irishman David Pickering is the chairman, other members are Steve Hilditch, Tappe Henning, Michael Lamoullie, Bob Francis

Mate, if you think the head honcho's in big organisations don't have any influence over people working for them you haven't had much experience working in large organisations. For starters he would have had a lot to do with the selection of the committee and then he would have had behind the scenes influence too. That's how head honch's influence their organisations - for better or for worse.

 

[kiap]

Start by availing yourself of the facts before posting - POB has nothing to do with the RWC appointments.
There is a specific RWC 2011 Match Official Selection Committee - POB was NOT on it.
Irishman David Pickering is the chairman, other members are Steve Hilditch, Tappe Henning, Michael Lamoullie, Bob Francis

Bullshit

 

[antipodean]

Start by availing yourself of the facts before posting - POB has nothing to do with the RWC appointments.
There is a specific RWC 2011 Match Official Selection Committee - POB was NOT on it.
Irishman David Pickering is the chairman, other members are Steve Hilditch, Tappe Henning, Michael Lamoullie, Bob Francis

Actually David Pickering is Welsh. Steve Hilditch is Irish.

Mate, if you think the head honcho's in big organisations don't have any influence over people working for them you haven't had much experience working in large organisations. For starters he would have had a lot to do with the selection of the committee and then he would have had behind the scenes influence too. That's how head honch's influence their organisations - for better or for worse.

Just accept you're wrong. Paddy is not the 'head honcho', he is the referee manager.

David Pickering is on the IRB Council and a member of the Executive Committee. I doubt he or the likes of Tappe Henning are easily swayed.

 

[kiap]

Mate, if you think the head honcho's in big organisations don't have any influence over people working for them you haven't had much experience working in large organisations. For starters he would have had a lot to do with the selection of the committee and then he would have had behind the scenes influence too. That's how head honch's influence their organisations - for better or for worse.

Just accept you're wrong. Paddy is not the 'head honcho', he is the referee manager.

David Pickering is on the IRB Council and a member of the Executive Committee. I doubt he or the likes of Tappe Henning are easily swayed.

The committee gives the rubber stamp but Paddy was intimately and heavily involved in the selection. It's pointless to pretend otherwise. In Mark Lawrence's own words:

"Yes, I am disappointed, but Paddy O'Brien summed it up perfectly, when he told me that selection was not in my control and was merely someone else’s opinion.

The story he told me was about Eric Rush who was brilliant at Sevens but just couldn't make All Black selection in 15s. He would phone his Dad and share his disappointment every time he missed out on selection and his Dad would explain that Eric, to them, was an All Black, and that it was only another man’s opinion that he wasn't. Then one day he was called and told Eric had made the grade and was selected as an All Black. He was so excited he called his Dad, not realising the time. His Dad answered and upon hearing the news, said to Eric: “My boy, it is only one man’s opinion. don't call me at midnight ever again”, and hung up

Paddy may not have selected me for Rugby World Cup, but he did give me Six Nations, Tri-Nations and other test matches over the years, and so I am grateful for 25 tests!

In short, I did get ice cream and chocolate sauce; I just missed out on the cherry!"

http://www.sareferees.co.za/news/ref_news/2742081.htm

 

[antipodean]

The committee gives the rubber stamp but Paddy was intimately and heavily involved in the selection. It's pointless to pretend otherwise. In Mark Lawrence's own words:

I suggest you read what I wrote and try again.

 

[kiap]

I suggest you read what I wrote and try again.

Just accept you're wrong

 

[antipodean]

Just accept you're wrong

I will as soon as you can show how what element you quoted of my post is incorrect:

Paddy is not the 'head honcho', he is the referee manager.

David Pickering is on the IRB Council and a member of the Executive Committee. I doubt he or the likes of Tappe Henning are easily swayed.​

 

[kiap]

But you suggested I read what you wrote, and those were your own words.

Let's be clear that Paddy O'Brien was intimately and heavily involved in the selections. Simple.

 

[Top Bloke]

Mate, if you think the head honcho's in big organisations don't have any influence over people working for them you haven't had much experience working in large organisations. For starters he would have had a lot to do with the selection of the committee and then he would have had behind the scenes influence too. That's how head honch's influence their organisations - for better or for worse.

Most of the members on the selection committe predate POB appointment. You are assuming POB is the head honcho, he is far from that.
POB isnt even on the exective committee, David pickering however is on the Executive committee.
Using your theory then Bernard Lapasset is at fault for Lawrences retirement.

 

[Scarfman]

Top Bloke - then why was it POB who broke the news to ML?

 

[Top Bloke]

Top Bloke - then why was it POB who broke the news to ML?

Because he is the Referees manager and no doubt would have seen it as his responsibility. Regardless of what you may think of POB he does NOT shirk responsibility.
Another point to be considered is that 3 SA refs could present a potential problem (eg perceived neutrality) down the track the further the Boks go.
I can imagine the situation came up during the appointment meetings and a choice had to be made between ML, JK & CJ. Not forgetting Marius Jonker as well.

 

[antipodean]

Top Bloke - then why was it POB who broke the news to ML?

Probably because he's the referee manager?

Another point to be considered is that 3 SA refs could present a potential problem (eg perceived neutrality) down the track the further the Boks go.
I can imagine the situation came up during the appointment meetings and a choice had to be made between ML, JK & CJ. Not forgetting Marius Jonker as well.

No, Paddy stipulated that there was no quota system; that if five of the best 10 refs came from one country, they would be picked.

 

[Lindommer]

This shitfight's gone far enough, how about you three agree to disagree and we concentrate on the rugby at hand.

 

[Top Bloke]

At the end of the day I guess it's no different than the selectors picking National teams - someone always misses out who shouldn't have, someone always gets in who shouldn't have. Conspiracy theories abound.

 

[Bruwheresmycar]

Yea, people are clutching at straws when trying to connect POB to Mark Lawrence not being selected for the WC. They have a whole selection committee (that I don't think POB is not a part of), and i'm sure if all of them wanted Mark Lawrence at the WC but for some reason Paddy didn't, it wouldn't matter, he'd be at the world cup!

 

[MajorlyRagerly]

That's a real bugger - he was one of the best ref's going. Shithouse.

Not least because he dismissed scarfy's vid as well.

 

[Jumpers]

Thats a real shame Mr. Lawerence has retired. Pity he didn't get appointed to WC games. He is by far a very good referee and will be missed!