Hooper stats looking good

[The_Brown_Hornet]

See my comment (No. 8) above about the type or roles I think they would play. Higgs was developing the ruck game nicely at 6 until Deans moved him to 8 which seemed to mess with his mojo. Anyway I feel thats a fairly balanced back row. You have ball carrying options in Hooper and Higgs. You have linking in Pocock and Hooper. You have the tackling in Hooper and Pocock. You have the pilfer in Pocock. Finally you have the breakdown work in Higgs and to a lesser extent pocock. I think Hooper is going to develop this over the next season or two also.

I think you need a combination of the following in a back row:

Fetcher: serial pest at the breakdown, securing possession on defence and attack. Can also link when necessary.

Enforcer: puts the hurt on in defence, cleans out at the ruck and generally makes the hard men of the opposition think twice about trying anything. Can also run an effective crash ball and offload in contact.

Ball running perpetual motion machine: receiving the ball one or two slots from the ruck and bending the line, setting up front foot ball. Also provides cover in defence, often breaking for the corner flag in old-school No. 8 terms. This kind of player also provides their share of dominant tackling and an option in the line out if the "Enforcer" style player doesn't.

From our current back row stocks, I see Pocock/Hooper able to do the fetcher role very effectively. Where I think we fall down at present is that enforcer style role. Higgers is capable of it, but plays too loose too often. I'd like to see him get in and do the dirty work more often. Timani could also be that guy if his improvement this season is anything to go by.

 

[cyclopath]

See my comment (No. 8) above about the type or roles I think they would play. Higgs was developing the ruck game nicely at 6 until Deans moved him to 8 which seemed to mess with his mojo. Anyway I feel thats a fairly balanced back row. You have ball carrying options in Hooper and Higgs. You have linking in Pocock and Hooper. You have the tackling in Hooper and Pocock. You have the pilfer in Pocock. Finally you have the breakdown work in Higgs and to a lesser extent pocock. I think Hooper is going to develop this over the next season or two also.

I can see what you're getting at.
But that backrow working would really require some key players being on the field - big ball carriers to be precise. Higgers makes his best metres wide (not a criticism, he is quick but in space than a blunt weapon), Hooper carries well, but is not a link man in the class of McCaw or Read, for instance (but who knows where he could be). If Horwill and Moore were fit, that'd be a good start.
It might work, but I have this nagging bad memory of trying to fit 2 good 7s in the pack somehow and it just not quite working.

 

[brumsfan]

To me the great thing about Hoopers game is that he doesn't seem to have a weakness.
He did Finnish in the top 3 best pilferers in super rugby this year. He has also had a pilfer against AB's and boks and several forced penalties. In fact the stats I'm looking at say he is second best in the rugby championships and he missed the first match. I also think his counter rucking is the best in the wallaby team he forced 2 turnovers alone against the boks.
A really good player such as McCaw or Smith, have all the tools and use them as required, Hooper will have to continue his development and be consistent over several years before he is at their status, but he is on the way.

 

[Jiggles]

I get where you are both coming from. Hooper is in his first season of test rugby so I don't think its right to compare him to McCaw or Read. Both are seasoned veterans near or at the top of their games. What I am encouraged by is that Hooper has taken this chance with both hands and is showing skills that Pocock doesn't have. This is why I think it could be balanced back-row. They seem to have complimentary skills. I think the balance will also deppend on A) when Higgers gets his chance to play 6, and B) is he actually developing his tight ruck game, or the 'enforcer' as BH calls it. If that doesn't happen then this back-row probably wont't work.

Cyclo - I know what you mean about the 2 7s thing. However Waugh was just doing what Smith was doing, but not nearly as well. I don't see that problem here, because again I see Hooper doing things we haven't seen from Pocock, namely in his ball running in the tight.

Brown - Timani isn't the option at 6 for this backrow. This role needs to be a good jumper and Timani is pants in that department, club level pants. I think the a lot of the issue at the lineout at present come from our inability to play an 8 man lineout because of Timani's lack of skills. But that argument is not for this thread.

 

[ACT Crusader]

It might work, but I have this nagging bad memory of trying to fit 2 good 7s in the pack somehow and it just not quite working.

Please go on about those memories, because I only remember good times - Bledisloe back, 50 points on the Wallabies

In seriousness though, with both Smith and Waugh starting it put extra pressure on the likes of Kefu, Giffin, Vickerman, Norieaga to pick up the ball carrying. Kefu fine, that was his game and perhaps Vickerman but he was still finding his feet at intl level, but not the others. At that stage Smith wasn't a great carrier, that came later. Plus it put one of the better ball runners in Finegan to the bench.

If the right players are surrounding a Hooper/Poccock combo then it can easily work. But like you say it would require Horwill, Moore and others stepping up. On the other hand they probably wouldn't need to make as many tackles as these two would account for the majority of them.

 

[Sir Arthur Higgins]

hooper has been a total revelation on the test scene lately.
I think pocock will manage to get back in and relegate hoops to the bench, but it will be controversial. for my opinion, poey needs to drop a bit of weight and pick his speed up which i think would allow him to offer more in attack. at the moment poey is a bit of a big lug in attack and doesn't offer the dynanism that hooper does.
tough to see how they fit in to the wallabies fold together. would you want a fetcher who can only play 7 on the bench?

 

[waratahjesus]

It's hard to believe we were debating if hooper or gill should be pococks understudy a few months back, if Gill gets a chance and proves as good as he looks at Super Rugby at test level as well we are gonna have to start playing an all 7 back row.

 

[tranquility]

I have zero doubt in my mind that we will see all three on the paddock at the same time in the coming years. Hooper is playing fantastic rugby, what a pickup he will prove to be for the Tahs.

 

[USARugger]

Hooper reminds me in a lot of ways of a faster Pocock who is much better at running the ball.

 

[Dave Beat]

Pockock 6, Hooper 7, George Smith 8

 

[The Red Baron]

It's hard to believe we were debating if hooper or gill should be pococks understudy a few months back, if Gill gets a chance and proves as good as he looks at Super Rugby at test level as well we are gonna have to start playing an all 7 back row.

That would only work if we play your all halfback backline.

 

[ACT Crusader]

Pockock 6, Hooper 7, George Smith 8

Add Adam Frier at hooker and Australia would qualify to enter the hobbit league

 

[fatprop]

Signing of the decade by the Tahs

 

[JJJ]

Why are none of the people who want Hooper at 7 and Pocock at 8 suggesting the other way around? Hooper is a much better ball-runner, which you want in an 8.

 

[Jiggles]

Pocock has better ball skills so I'd rather him helping at the back of the scrum.

 

[Iluvmyfooty]

Hooper is less than 100Kgs too small to be an 8 or a 6.

 

[fatprop]

I will prefer to see Hooper, Pocock and possibly Gill battle out for the 7 spot.

Not try to slot them into other backrow spots.

Let Dennis & Higgenbotham battle for 6

And find a decent 8 to cover the regrettably regular times that Palu is wounded. McCaffry, McCalman, "little" Timani,

Fotu Auelua & Mowen ​

are all possibilities

 

[Viking]

Pocock is without doubt one of the best players in the world. This is a proven fact. Hooper is playing well but he'll be sitting on the bench everytime Pocock is fully fit. I don't care how good his stats are, Pocock does something that no-one in the world does, he provides key plays that change games eg. A turn-over at a crucial moment, A try-saving tackle.

Hooper has good general stats but I'm yet to see him pull out anything extraordinary like Pocock has done consistently (refer to Pocock Vs South Africia RWC where he single handily won us the game).

Sorry Hooper, great player but you'll always be number 2.

 

[BDA]

Our best backrow might actually be 6.Hooper, 7.Pocock, 8.Palu (Higgers on the bench) but wil our lineout suffer too much?

In terms of defence, Pocock is hands down the most valuable player in world rugby. Hooper's running game is much better than Pocock, but I'd start Pocock. At the same time, its concerning that we'd have a guy as good as Hooper sitting on the bench.

 

[Dave Beat]

I think George Smith stands above both of them, his pilfering was extrodinary, his link play was top notch, his d could not be faulted, then there's the jaw dropping briliance that came up far more frequently than what we have now.