Having no NRC is better how?

[WorkingClassRugger]

If a club based comp is the next to be tried, then I think it should go full FA style. Start with say 120 clubs, either by invitation as the top clubs in various selected competitions, or by opening participation up to bids, and make it knock out. That's 119 games, spread over say 15 or 20 weeks at 8 or 6 games per week, mid-week during and after the Super Rugby season.

In the early stages, play sides that are close geographically so costs are kept to a minimum. Stronger sides will probably play largely reserves in the early stages but will strengthen their sides as the comp progresses. Good for development of younger players as well as increasing exposure to the game nation-wide through more content for the current broadcaster/streaming service. At the end, crown a National Club Champion.

I should say, however, that my preferred model would be based around Super Rugby 'A' teams supplemented by regional or stronger club teams.

Probably a bit too expansive. Alternatively to this is go the Cup route where we take 24-32 teams across the competitions and run pools with games to determine qualification to the Round of 16 and beyond.

 

[The Ghost of Raelene]

I think that can be said about any form of club based competition, though GoR. Hence, why I prefer something based on the existing Super Rugby sides at the level between club and Super.

True, but players would shift to the Clubs included in the competition as I imagine they will in the soccer. If it has round robin format and finals they could get a good number per year. Imagine if your side got knocked out in round 1,2 and now these guys get no game time.

If sides ended up like 2009 Sydney Uni in a national club comp so be it but I still can’t see how it’s funded. You can’t charge people a lot for this to go and TV… we’ll see. Does have more appeal than some freshly created side

God I hate Uni but that’s a hell of a side. Can barely see them but it’s Peter Betham and Dave Dennis at the very back on top of the rest of them.

 

[Wallaby Ways]

How does the old saying go, anyone but Uni!
They thrive on it. Looking at that photo, a very, very strong side.
The NRC format was the right one, just need more buy in from some Sydney and Brisbane clubs.

 

[dru]

The NRC format was the right one, just need more buy in from some Sydney and Brisbane clubs.

There is no doubt that the NRC format could be improved.

Not only were the QRU and the Reds fully on board but they fully brought the clubs with them. Real leadership and alignment after the clubs decided not to bid, QRU stepped in with them. The pathway was clear and bought into. It was a thrill to watch the next-gen Reds building with the opportunity.

NSWRU, Waratahs, SRU - well they were another issue entirely. The smear can stop at the Tweed.

 

[Wallaby Ways]

There is no doubt that the NRC format could be improved.

Not only were the QRU and the Reds fully on board but they fully brought the clubs with them. Real leadership and alignment after the clubs decided not to bid, QRU stepped in with them. The pathway was clear and bought into. It was a thrill to watch the next-gen Reds building with the opportunity.

NSWRU, Waratahs, SRU - well they were another issue entirely. The smear can stop at the Tweed.

You know what, absolutely fair. Qld teams were always well organised and more consistent than the NSW sides. So keep qld country and Brisbane city and then what for the nsw teams?

 

[dru]

You know what, absolutely fair. Qld teams were always well organised and more consistent than the NSW sides. So keep qld country and Brisbane city and then what for the nsw teams?

That is an issue that starts with the relationship between SRU and both NSWRU and RA. I missed few home games of the Stars, even met Pulver at one. So there were parts of the Sydney club world who were on board, the rest were scud missiles in search of unapproved rugby to destroy.

There is a serious gap in expectations between elements of the SRU leadership and RA regarding professionalism. With Waugh that gap is likely to be closer but as a result wider with everyone else.

it is a fundamental issue like it or not (and I don’t) that whatever happens must have the buy-in from the SRU destructive malcontents with the inevitable compromise this means for most of us.

 

[The Ghost of Raelene]

Have a feeling Pulver was probably floating around since his son was on the Stars roster.

Big issue besides Clubs shitting on it was the fact a lot of players including some who had played and would play Super Rugby having no interest in participating. That’s why Colts and 2nd graders were getting games.

 

[Wilson]

Have a feeling Pulver was probably floating around since his son was on the Stars roster.

Big issue besides Clubs shitting on it was the fact a lot of players including some who had played and would play Super Rugby having no interest in participating. That’s why Colts and 2nd graders were getting games.

That was again a function of the club run teams in NSW and absolute disconnect between the NSWRU, tahs and the NRC teams. It wasn't a problem in Qld where super rugby contracts were up for grabs and the NRC teams were filled out with the top club players.

 

[The Ghost of Raelene]

Was top club guys as well. I knew a lot that said no thanks, earn more at my day job and got signed from Club Rugby.

Was a mess from the start when it was clear Uni wanted a side and tbh they had the talent but suddenly were involved with a Subbies club who had a benefactor dreaming of being a sports team owner. Imagine calling a Rugby team the ‘Stars’

 

[dru]

Was top club guys as well. I knew a lot that said no thanks, earn more at my day job and got signed from Club Rugby.

Was a mess from the start when it was clear Uni wanted a side and tbh they had the talent but suddenly were involved with a Subbies club who had a benefactor dreaming of being a sports team owner. Imagine calling a Rugby team the ‘Stars’

I wouldn't have chosen the name. They just happened to play in my backyard and I wasn't going to miss it.

The comp was poorly considered and rushed in at speed which is never a good sign. Funding was an issue especially when (in NSW at least) there was little chance to build a brand and a club income. Still is continued for much longer than the doubters suggested and gave a much needed opportunity for players trying to transition into pro rugby and a route for returning to game fitness for injured Wallabies. It was also a good pathway for coaches.

 

[Brumby Runner]

Have a feeling Pulver was probably floating around since his son was on the Stars roster.

Big issue besides Clubs shitting on it was the fact a lot of players including some who had played and would play Super Rugby having no interest in participating. That’s why Colts and 2nd graders were getting games.

But why was that GoR? IIRC, most of the professional players at the Reds and Brumbies seemed to be content to participate.

 

[The Ghost of Raelene]

But why was that GoR? IIRC, most of the professional players at the Reds and Brumbies seemed to be content to participate.

Professionals did. I’m talking the top Club guys who were not yet pros or use to be. 4 sides was too much. If you spread the Tahs not with the Wallabies, injured or signed overseas you might get 3 at a team. You then probably had 25 spots to fill per team. There aren’t 100 guys legitimately up to a standard needed to enhance the professional game.

Some of the good Club players made a business decision that I need to work/study and can’t be bothered with it. When they said no it meant Colts and lower grade players were getting the call up.

I’m a broken record when it comes to wanting a Super Rugby A comp over creating new entities. Use the facilities and coaches we have and it would create a higher standard comp when it becomes probably the next best 10-12 Club players getting a go. If it isn’t a quality game it won’t produce Super Rugby & International players when we need those sides to be successful.

 

[Wallaby Ways]

Super Rugby A system might work, though when would it run?

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

Taking into consideration the very uncertain future of the Rebels I've been thinking about a means of maintaining the pathway for Victorians into Super Rugby. And one way could be the formation of an academy based squad that would compete in one of either the Shute Shield or Hospitals Cup. I'd suggest the Hospitals as it a nine club competition and their inclusion would allow for the bye to be used.

Below that, in the Junior NRC a commitment to maintain the Vic U16s and U19s squads should also be made alongside a 2nd team from both NSW and Qld.

In terms of national competition. Go with a Cup competition. Every club comp runs their season. Top 6 from each of Sydney and Brisbane joined by the Top 3 from Canberra and a Perth rep/academy squad. Either home and away in pool with the winner of each going through to the finals or a single game each with the top 2.

 

[Wallaby Ways]

I’d still like to see Super rugby A
Or a National club comp with:
Randwick
Central East team (Easts and Uni)
Northern Districts (Manly Warringah Norths)
Brisbane City
Queensland Country
Perth
Canberra
Melbourne

That’d be a thrilling comp.

 

[Rebel man]

There is no doubt that the NRC format could be improved.

Not only were the QRU and the Reds fully on board but they fully brought the clubs with them. Real leadership and alignment after the clubs decided not to bid, QRU stepped in with them. The pathway was clear and bought into. It was a thrill to watch the next-gen Reds building with the opportunity.

NSWRU, Waratahs, SRU - well they were another issue entirely. The smear can stop at the Tweed.

The NRC didn’t work because the Shute Shield and hospital cup are not fit for purpose.

 

[Sword of Justice]

The NRC didn’t work because the Shute Shield and hospital cup are not fit for purpose.

Surely that is why it must work. RA can take a net profit accounting approach to every decision they make and see the viewership and relevance continue to dwindle as a result. We need this investment to create a professional base which is sustainable.

 

[JRugby2]

Taking into consideration the very uncertain future of the Rebels I've been thinking about a means of maintaining the pathway for Victorians into Super Rugby. And one way could be the formation of an academy based squad that would compete in one of either the Shute Shield or Hospitals Cup. I'd suggest the Hospitals as it a nine club competition and their inclusion would allow for the bye to be used.

Below that, in the Junior NRC a commitment to maintain the Vic U16s and U19s squads should also be made alongside a 2nd team from both NSW and Qld.

In terms of national competition. Go with a Cup competition. Every club comp runs their season. Top 6 from each of Sydney and Brisbane joined by the Top 3 from Canberra and a Perth rep/academy squad. Either home and away in pool with the winner of each going through to the finals or a single game each with the top 2.

I like the idea of a cup competition but it must be said; this suggestion of a club-based 3rd tier comes up so often in these forums and others, but the fundamental issue remains - this serves purely for entertainment rather than as a genuine third tier that can be used to develop players from club to professional level.

You'd either see - players funnelled into certain clubs to ensure they are still playing rugby and are ready to be called upon, degrading the club competition or non-wallabies who play for non-cup clubs not playing when they really need to be.

Again - as a fan of rugby I like it but it won't resolve any of the player development or retention issues that not having a genuine 3rd tier is causing us. Would probably make it worse as the cup competition would compete for space with any other real 3rd tier comp that could happen.

 

[The Ghost of Raelene]

I like the idea of a cup competition but it must be said; this suggestion of a club-based 3rd tier comes up so often in these forums and others, but the fundamental issue remains - this serves purely for entertainment rather than as a genuine third tier that can be used to develop players from club to professional level.

You'd either see - players funnelled into certain clubs to ensure they are still playing rugby and are ready to be called upon, degrading the club competition or non-wallabies who play for non-cup clubs not playing when they really need to be.

Again - as a fan of rugby I like it but it won't resolve any of the player development or retention issues that not having a genuine 3rd tier is causing us. Would probably make it worse as the cup competition would compete for space with any other real 3rd tier comp that could happen.

It wouldn't. From facilities to coaching it wouldn't get it done.

The concept is loveable, sure. We can look at the tiers of English Soccer and enjoy the lower leagues and the concept but it's a different sport and environment.

Half our Premier Clubs play on fields that have Cricket on them for a start. They lack the infrastructure to provide a professional environment for current pros, Juniors for both male and female players. RA don't have the money to upgrade and then what? Local councils putting in for Rugby Union... good luck when the AFL walk in and say we'll take care of it for you.

I'm a parrot on this but Super Rugby A to me makes the most sense. Use the facilities & Brands we have and bring in the best of Club land, coaches included. If it works you can look at expanding into an extra side in NSW/QLD. If you want to increase the ability of our players it has to be a strong standard. Yes matches played are important but not if its a low standard.

I'd start it after Super Rugby finals so you have the players not selected for the Wallabies shift out which allows a few spots for the best Club players/academy players to move in. You also have a place for Wallabies returning from injury to play during the RC or European tour.

Haven't thought about the exact dates but can it become part of the U16s, U19s Super Season....

 

[Jimmy_Crouch]

I'm a parrot on this but Super Rugby A to me makes the most sense. Use the facilities & Brands we have and bring in the best of Club land, coaches included.

Agree it is coaches, support staff and referees that also get the chance to develop. I'd try to utalise one of the assistants as the head coach (Gilmore for example at the tahs) then bring some club coaches in to give them a taste of pro program.