Has Super Rugby Expanded to Quickly?

[rugbyisfun]

Anyone else reckon we would have been better off sticking to our guns and focused on growing the game in the traditional strongholds? (que dream sequence...).....

I picture Myself lying back on a nice Winters afternoon enjoying a beer whilst watching 'Sydney' play one of having just experienced a cracking Super 12 and then Club season where contracted players were required to play for their Clubs so they could qualify for the National competition....

The Sydney junior rep team had just played the curtain raiser, and before that we saw a top class school 1st xv match.

Heaps of families around , staying for the whole day to watch some footy, meet their heroes at arms length at a field like Concord Oval....

 

[Slim 293]

Nah...

 

[suckerforred]

Anyone else reckon we would have been better off sticking to our guns and focused on growing the game in the traditional strongholds? (que dream sequence...).....

I picture Myself lying back on a nice Winters afternoon enjoying a beer whilst watching 'Sydney' play one of having just experienced a cracking Super 12 and then Club season where contracted players were required to play for their Clubs so they could qualify for the National competition....

The Sydney junior rep team had just played the curtain raiser, and before that we saw a top class school 1st xv match.

Heaps of families around , staying for the whole day to watch some footy, meet their heroes at arms length at a field like Concord Oval....

Tell him he's dreamin'.

 

[wamberal]

A dream? Nup, a nightmare, in which the vast majority of our best players have either gone to league or to play overseas, because there is just no money in the game.

 

[GaffaCHinO]

Typical Sydney sider comment


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[The_Brown_Hornet]

No

 

[FiveStarStu]

Totally agree about strengthening rugby strongholds.

We should divert all funds to the state with the longest continuous club competition.

 

[Waylon]

Nope

Kiwis had 5 teams

fair's fair now

 

[AngrySeahorse]

Anyone else reckon we would have been better off sticking to our guns and focused on growing the game in the traditional strongholds? (que dream sequence...).....

I picture Myself lying back on a nice Winters afternoon enjoying a beer whilst watching 'Sydney' play one of having just experienced a cracking Super 12 and then Club season where contracted players were required to play for their Clubs so they could qualify for the National competition....

The Sydney junior rep team had just played the curtain raiser, and before that we saw a top class school 1st xv match.

Heaps of families around , staying for the whole day to watch some footy, meet their heroes at arms length at a field like Concord Oval....

That's all well & good for you & the people of Sydney but for the people of NSW outside of Sydney a lot of people simply would not give a shit.

That being said Rugby in NSW is already so Sydney-centric then maybe it wont make any difference if it got any worse.

For me personally I'm not concerned as this doesn't effect me. However, I feel for the kids playing Rugby in my region, they have one real option as they get older & its mungo ball. Now that's depressing. You talk about tradition well Newcastle has a very competitive comp with a lot of rivalries & history, Maitland Blacks Rugby Club for example was formed in 1877 which makes it the second oldest Rugby club in the region. I'd be surprised though if anyone in Sydney's Rugby fraternity even knew that after all there were those in Sydney Rugby circles that wanted NSW Country to dump its Orange & Black jersey & all the history & pride that went with it to just create a number of Sydney based rep teams.

Sorry to jump down your throat rugbyisfun - I do get the whole 'longing for the old days' (even at my young age I can understand that) but in NSW this is not the way forward.

And if I may enter the dream sequence myself (cue dream fade out). I'm not saying it will ever happen (in fact I concede it wouldn't - too many money & logistic issues, etc, etc). However, if we actually had NSW Country in superugby then a NSW Country v Tahs match would make a Tahs v Reds match by comparison look about as fierce as an episode of the brady bunch.

So long story short no expansion is good, going back to ultra traditional isnt (though I like tradition it has to be inclusive). I know in regards to the Force they have given more players more of a chance to shine than clubs who wouldn't have bothered. I'm sure Pat Dellit originally played for Maitland Blacks himself & the Force has given him an opportunity all the way over in WA.

 

[p.Tah]

ASH, where would you base the Country Super rugby team or would they have many 'home' games?

 

[rugbyisfun]

That's all well & good for you & the people of Sydney but for the people of NSW outside of Sydney a lot of people simply would not give a shit.

That being said Rugby in NSW is already so Sydney-centric then maybe it wont make any difference if it got any worse.

For me personally I'm not concerned as this doesn't effect me. However, I feel for the kids playing Rugby in my region, they have one real option as they get older & its mungo ball. Now that's depressing. You talk about tradition well Newcastle has a very competitive comp with a lot of rivalries & history, Maitland Blacks Rugby Club for example was formed in 1877 which makes it the second oldest Rugby club in the region. I'd be surprised though if anyone in Sydney's Rugby fraternity even knew that after all there were those in Sydney Rugby circles that wanted NSW Country to dump its Orange & Black jersey & all the history & pride that went with it to just create a number of Sydney based rep teams.

Sorry to jump down your throat rugbyisfun - I do get the whole 'longing for the old days' (even at my young age I can understand that) but in NSW this is not the way forward.

And if I may enter the dream sequence myself (cue dream fade out). I'm not saying it will ever happen (in fact I concede it wouldn't - too many money & logistic issues, etc, etc). However, if we actually had NSW Country in superugby then a NSW Country v Tahs match would make a Tahs v Reds match by comparison look about as fierce as an episode of the brady bunch.

So long story short no expansion is good, going back to ultra traditional isnt (though I like tradition it has to be inclusive). I know in regards to the Force they have given more players more of a chance to shine than clubs who wouldn't have bothered. I'm sure Pat Dellit originally played for Maitland Blacks himself & the Force has given him an opportunity all the way over in WA.

Great response mate. Thanks for taking the time to reply with such depth. Im glad my original post has raised some interesting conversation.

I am born and bred NSW Country lad and went on to experience rugby in sydney.

I probably should have elaborated more, part of my 'perfect world dream sequence' would have include other rugby strongholds like NSW and QLD country, the Illawarra etc etc.

Would have been nice to have seen some serious infrastructure funneled into these areas, as opposed to trying to convince the Mexicans down south and the bike riders in Perth to love the game the way we do.

What ever happened to country week? Etc etc etc

I think you get my drift.

 

[Jnor]

Bike riders in Perth?

 

[wamberal]

Not all that many years ago there was an annual Sydney vs Country fixture and it was always one of the highlights of the season. Country won its fair share of matches, one highlight that will always stick in my memory is the "up-the-jumper" try in 1975 by Greg Cornelsen to snatch a last-minute win in the 1970's at TG Millner.

However, I assume that the huge demographic changes that have affected country towns, allied with the advent of professional opportunities that are only available in the cities, has changed the landscape for the game irretrievably.


As a former Newcastle resident, I remember being told all about how strong rugby was in the Hunter, especially around Maitland, and I also remember my intense frustration that the strong rugby community was not at all interested in supporting the Wildfires in the Sydney comp. Another indelible memory, as an Eastwood supporter, being at the Wildfires last game, when they thrashed Eastwood in the backblocks of Charlestown. Eastwood went on to win its inaugural first grade premiership, but we ate lots of humble pie that famous afternoon.

 

[rugbyisfun]

Bike riders in Perth?

so flat...

 

[AngrySeahorse]

Great response mate. Thanks for taking the time to reply with such depth. Im glad my original post has raised some interesting conversation.

I am born and bred NSW Country lad and went on to experience rugby in sydney.

I probably should have elaborated more, part of my 'perfect world dream sequence' would have include other rugby strongholds like NSW and QLD country, the Illawarra etc etc.

Would have been nice to have seen some serious infrastructure funneled into these areas, as opposed to trying to convince the Mexicans down south and the bike riders in Perth to love the game the way we do.

What ever happened to country week? Etc etc etc

I think you get my drift.

Yes, I agree. To go back into fantasy land yet again I always felt that if an ARC national comp is not possible then the next best bet would be to have teams like Newcastle, Illawarra, Central coast, etc enter a team each into the Shute shield. Strengthen the state comps basically. For mine that would develop strength across the board in NSW & would potentially make a second Superugby side a real possibility as I believe this process would make more use of available players or at the very least just open it up more for people from NSW Country.

Its a tough one though, I get what your saying but I really feel we did need to have a few more teams from other states outside of QLD, NSW, ACT. I feel we've expanded enough for now & hopefully we can get back to our own backyards so to speak to make things better.

SA would have to be the most unluckiest state in OZ, no Superugby team & now they dont have the 7's. I'd like to see some trial games go there at the least. Surely there are Rugby comps & people there that deserve some high quality Rugby.

 

[AngrySeahorse]

Not all that many years ago there was an annual Sydney vs Country fixture and it was always one of the highlights of the season. Country won its fair share of matches, one highlight that will always stick in my memory is the "up-the-jumper" try in 1975 by Greg Cornelsen to snatch a last-minute win in the 1970's at TG Millner.

However, I assume that the huge demographic changes that have affected country towns, allied with the advent of professional opportunities that are only available in the cities, has changed the landscape for the game irretrievably.


As a former Newcastle resident, I remember being told all about how strong rugby was in the Hunter, especially around Maitland, and I also remember my intense frustration that the strong rugby community was not at all interested in supporting the Wildfires in the Sydney comp. Another indelible memory, as an Eastwood supporter, being at the Wildfires last game, when they thrashed Eastwood in the backblocks of Charlestown. Eastwood went on to win its inaugural first grade premiership, but we ate lots of humble pie that famous afternoon.

Oh my god me too. I talk about the 'old boys club' mentality of some Rugby organisations in Sydney but this is an example of how its happened in my own backyard. IMO if your in the Shute Shield, regardless of whether you played schoolboys in Sydney or not, your esentially in a position to put your hand up for Superugby or even a stint overseas, i.e. your in a position to get noticed by those that matter. How the hell some of the 'higher ups' in Newcastle Rugby couldnt understand how great this opportunity would have been for locals growing up I dont know. We are very proud of our local comp but really I don't think a Wildfires team would've killed off our comp or anything serious like that.

If we still had the Wildfires maybe players like Mark Wade from the Slime who was amazing last year would not have signed with NRL side the Knights. Then there is countless players I've heard of that went to Sydney, handled it well playing wise but financially & family wise just couldn't stay there. How good would it have been to have a team for the Shute in their own backyard.

It boggles my mind some of the decisions that get made by those that make the decisions.

Maitland blacks always have big numbers I find - they have a really nice home ground too, its in Lorn. I've found over the years all the clubs seem to have very interesting histories.

 

[AngrySeahorse]

ASH, where would you base the Country Super rugby team or would they have many 'home' games?

Tough one. Re-entering the 'dream state' where all is sorted except where we are playing.

With the list of NSW Country areas at the bottom the three that have stadia are Newcastle, Illawarra, Central Coast.

I would go for Newcastle (I know, biased but its the biggest country town in NSW & the mens team has been the top country side in NSW for 4 years straight) the most games would be played there, Illawarra (second biggest number of games for lower country NSW), & Central coast would get a couple but its not that far to get to Newcastle from CC (some people travel within Sydney to Tahs matches that have to wait in traffic that probably evens out to about the same time you'd drive from CC to Newcastle).

Newcastle is also closer than Illawarra to a lot of the other NSW Country areas.

Trial games would be taken to the other NSW Country areas (I'm not aware of any large stadiums in those areas so maybe taking the trials there would be the go). The main issue aside from lack of room for spectators is the difficulty in some of these areas to get big crowds.

That would be for games. I'd do training at Newcastle, ideally you'd want it shared but that would be really hard to do.

It would be absolutely essential that all the areas listed that don't have large stadiums or where the players would have to relocate to the central coast or in Newcastle so they could get to training that programs & structure is set in place to develop & support them. The last thing I would want is for the NSW Country side to become known as "Newcastle-centric" because that would be the same thing I've been complaining about the existing system in NSW. So, you would have development officers scouting for young players in these areas, running advanced programs, etc. These players would end up going into what is now the NSW Country side but with a Superugby side now in place this team would be called "NSW Country Development".

1 - Newcastle Hunter ​

2 – Central North ​

3 – Central Coast ​

4 – Central West ​

5 – Illawarra ​

6 – Western Plains ​

7 – Far North Coast ​

8 – New England ​

9 – Mid North Coast​

Anyhow, it will sadly probably never happen but its nice to dream. I'm sure some people would have a very different idea to mine as to what to do but that would be my best bet.

I really need to get out of the dream sequence, the flashes are blinding me