Good Refs and Bad Refs

[RoffsChoice]

So we all know there is a gap in quality for international refs, but I'd just like an indication into who we think are good and who we think are bad.

For mine, Owens and Joubert are the best in the world. Walsh and Barnes are pretty good most of the time but when they're bad, they're really bad. I don't think Pollock or Peyper are too good.

 

[Hawko]

On the basis of his last game you would probably put Owens above Joubert for top two. But one game doesn't make a best overall, you have to look at it over time. Joubers went into a bit of a form slump following his world cup final display but does seem to have picked up his form recently. Walsh I like, particularly when there's a bit of niggle around, because he doesn't overlook it so it gets out of hand. Barnes has got a bad rep in NZ but IMO is very good.

For mine Pollock is good, but not top four. The same comment goes for Clancy. Peyper doesn't ref the breakdown strictly enough so IMO he's behind those two for a mid-table spot.

Poite we won't see for a while after the Bismark stuff-up, but he has been reffing reasonably well and would have been mid-table otherwise. Like Stuey Dickenson and Barnes, once one of the big nations takes a set against you, your career is pretty much nobbled for life.

There's a pretty big gap back to Jackson and the rest of the refs. Jackson lets everything go at the breakdown, Garces has to get a higher percentage of decisions right before he'll be OK. He would benefit by moving out of France for a year or two, the French seem to have great difficulty in developing consistency of performance. Perhaps we could get him on a 451 visa, our homegrown products all seem to rank on the third level with no one I've seen yet looking like making the step up.

 

[daz]

Barnes and Owens, easily.

I just like the way Barnes manages the players and the game in general. He is firm, fair and very clear in his instructions, but also treats the lads like grown-ups as his default position until they show they need a higher grade of parenting.

Owens is a tad more Regimental Sgt-Major in his approach from kick-off, but he also explains himself very well and is generally very consistent.

Where Barnes has the edge (IMO) is that he prefers to put the whistle away as the first option, and only penalise acts that directly impact the flow of the game. I like that.

 

[Jets]

The reason that I like Barnes is that he allows all teams to start the match with a clean slate. Some refs come in with the view that a certain team will have the edge in a certain area. He also seems to have an idea about what happens at scrum time and will not just award penalties to the team going forward but will go against them if they are responsible for the scrum going down. His big issue is that he seems to make a shocking call every now and then.

Owens does a very good job too. Like daz said though he can get a bit pedantic at times.

 

[Aussie D]

once one of the big nations takes a set against you, your career is pretty much nobbled for life.

Obviously the ARU aren't one of the big nations or they didn't complain loudly or often enough about Kaplan. Also, this doesn't explain why Bryce Lawrence wasn't nobbled after all the bitching and moaning coming out of South Africa after his performance in the World Cup quarter final.

 

[Bowside]

Where's the Bryce Lawrence option?

 

[GaffaCHinO]

I like Barnes mostly because you dont really get the WTF calls which leave everyone scratching. unlike most of the others........

 

[RoffsChoice]

Where's the Bryce Lawrence option?

Unfortunately it is too late to add Lesser Lawrence

 

[BPC]

George Ayoub?

 

[Hawko]

Obviously the ARU aren't one of the big nations or they didn't complain loudly or often enough about Kaplan. Also, this doesn't explain why Bryce Lawrence wasn't nobbled after all the bitching and moaning coming out of South Africa after his performance in the World Cup quarter final.

But he was. Hardly got a big international after that and retired about a year later. He reffed the Super final the year of the World Cup.

Kaplan was a special South African favourite. And everyone loved him except Australians. He returned the favour, especially if it was the Tahs.

 

[Dan54]

It's hard to say, Barnes is popular in Aus at moment because he reffed game on weekend that Wallabies won. I actually didn't think it best game he has reffed, I know we all happy he didn't award penalty try etc,(mind you some Argo fans may consider that a WTF call) but all in all didn't really think it a hard game to ref. Owens I thought went well, but to be fair I think it a bit unfair to say such and such is a better ref because I enjoyed that game more than one that was reffed by someone else. All this crap we hear that Kaplan doesn't like Aus. Such and such doesn't like NZ, someone else doesn't like whoever is just crap, I sincerely believe no ref goes out liking or dislike any team, just fans find the ref that seems to miss their teams faults are great, but if they miss other teams mistakes (or supposed faults) they are crap and are against thei9r team.

 

[Forcefield]

The Wallabies have a very, very good win record under Wayne Barnes- last weekend just reaffirmed why we like him. I think he had a good game against the Argies and generally made good decisions. I think Argies could consider themselves unlucky not to have gotten the penalty try, but likewise lucky that Landajo didn't go to the bin.

It's hard to call with Refs. Do you want one that generally makes good decisions or one that makes a few errors but gets the big decisions right? One of the things I really like about Barnes is that he looks (properly) at incidences of foul play e.g. Simmons, Landajo. Against the All Blacks earlier on when Ma'a Nonu shoulder charged whoever it was (Lealiifano?), nobody took the slightest bit of notice. Maybe that's bad captaincy but someone must have brought it up and things like that should be looked into. I was really pissed off with Jerome Garces from two weeks back (yes we are going there again) because he made a shit call regarding Michael Hooper and then followed it up by not looking at the post-tackle fight.

 

[boyo]

I sincerely believe no ref goes out liking or dislike any team, just fans find the ref that seems to miss their teams faults are great, but if they miss other teams mistakes (or supposed faults) they are crap and are against thei9r team.

I agree with that.

One-eyed fans,commentators,journalists, etc. are quick to label a referee biased but slow to label a referee fair.

 

[Jets]

Some referees do go into a game with ideas about certain parts of the game. The scrum is a major area in regards to this. The referees need to have a better understanding of what happens at scrum time.

Barnes seems to look at each scrum as a separate indecent and will penalise the team he views as doing the wrong thing (if it is the same issue continuously he will take action such as the card on the weekend). Other referees will decide that one team is weaker and penalise against them no matter what happens.