Global Rapid Rugby
- Thread starter ForceFan
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Kpc
Herbert Moran (7)
But who will be the seventh and eighth teams? In addition to Russians, I do not see any real options.
Rugbynutter39
Michael Lynagh (62)
Common sense would say if private investor still behind Western Sydney it should be....at one stage seemed having Japanese sides involved was almost seen as certainty early on but seems things have changed which I suspect to do with establishment of new Japanese professional league.
I am hence a bit more concerned about the viability of GRR as for me Fiji, Samoa, Malaysia, Singapore, Force and HK as 6 team competition does not commercially cut it, need some more established and more commercially established rugby markets involved (ie. Japan, another oz side, kiwi side).
ForceFan
Peter Fenwicke (45)
The Battle to Maintain the Pathway For Athletes in Western Australia
Earfulofdirt – Aaron Castro – 16 August 2019
I just spent most of the previous week enjoying everything that Perth, Western Australia, had to offer. It is a beautiful city with amazing cafes on almost every block, sometimes two of them. The people are extremely welcome. They also love their sports, whether that is the Western Force, Perth Glory, or the West Coast Eagles.
A few years ago, the broadcasters forced the realignment of Super Rugby. The Cheetahs and the Kings left the competition, but SARU found them a home in the Pro14. However, attendance for any South African Super Rugby team is atrocious. They've neglected to develop the match day experience for the fan and wonder why revenues haven't gotten better. At the time when the Force were cut they were one of the better supported Australian Super Rugby franchises. Interestingly, their attendance in Rapid Rugby is higher than all of the Australian Super Rugby franchises combined.
After a prolonged legal battle, the Western Force were cut from Super Rugby. As part of that ordeal, mining magnate Andrew Forrest had stepped forward to keep the Force in Super Rugby with financial guarantees but to no avail. Thursday ahead of the match of the Wallabies v. All Blacks Match there was an international referee forum for the Western Australia Referees. By the lapel pins on jackets and shirts, it was clear that this was Force Country.
Raelene Castle stood in front of the room to discuss how Rugby is quite healthy both commercially in Western Australia, noting the Wallabies sold out this fixture in less than 6 days upon opening for ticket sales six months prior. She also discussed the success of the grassroots and the pathway for Women with the Super W having put four WA Natives into the Wallaroos. But notably missing was the lack of acknowledgement of the pathway that is the Western Force. Raelene Castle is the de facto owner of the four Australian Super Rugby franchises. Rapid Rugby is basically a competitor to Super Rugby, yet the purpose of the Force and any other Rapid Rugby franchise in Australia is to create high performance pathways for players and to further commercially develop Rugby Union in Australia.
The following day, Andrew Forrest held a press conference where he guaranteed the launch of Rapid Rugby in season 3. Rapid Rugby was held as an exhibition in 2018 called World Series Rugby, and entered it's first season under the Rapid Rugby brand this year. The Force still played a few exhibitions, but Season 3 will be a 14 week schedule. What that looks like? They've got some work to do. Following the Western Force match last Friday Night I sat down with the Head of Rugby, Matt Hodgson whom is the most capped all-time Western Force player.
For Matt, he understands a lot of the pressure that is on his shoulders. Being granted the task of developing a competition across Oceania that will be sustainable. Not only in Australia but across Oceania. The teams in this year's showcase Series: South China Tigers, Asia Pacific Dragons, Fijian Latui, Samoa Kagifa, and the Malaysian Valke will likely form the backbone of a full 14 Week season in Rapid Rugby. Matt's job is to guide each of the new franchises towards commercial sustainability so that they do not need central funding. But having each one of these franchises themselves is important for each Nation to gain a local high performance pathway. Before the Fijian Drua, there was no local high performance pathway in Fiji. Before the Kagifa there was no high performance pathway in Samoa.
The Malaysian Valke, were mostly built off the Currie Cup Valke. But as Rudy Joubert stated, they have an intent to grow rugby in Malaysia as they integrated several Malaysian Rugby players into the side during their training in Perth. Those players [Badrul Bin Muktee and Samuel Meran] took the pitch and played considerable minutes contributing at a high level.
One of the things that Matt and I spoke about were the rule changes. World Rugby has looked at various competitions to execute law trials around the globe. One of those most famously has been the Varsity Cup in South Africa. But as he stated: "Where in the world is there a professional competition that has the willingness to experiment, a large competition that will adapt." That is where Rapid Rugby sees itself in the space. A place where they will build new performance pathways for countries that do not have them, do them sustainably, and work with World Rugby on various initiatives. One of those, the Power Try. Prior to watching the Force score the Power Try I had some apprehension about the rules in place. When you watched the tempo that the Force executed to score a Power Try, it was like watching a Football team execute a 2-minute drill out of the spread offense. Was gloriously exciting.
I asked Tim Sampson about the change in scoring and kicking rules and how that affected him as a strategist. Did that require him to be more innovative in his attack shapes and game plans with a follow up of how that will change his planning for the next National Rugby Championship Campaign. He stated that it did and they will attempt to continue this high flying attack into the NRC and play a fast and exciting brand. I also asked if this became a more fun style to play, because it seemed like a more fun style to watch. Western Force's captain Jeremy Thrush stated that it was.
When you look at the promotion of the Western Force match. It was an event, it wasn't just a game. There was pre-kickoff entertainment with a youth club match before the Force v. Valke, there was also the Royal Australian Band performing during this period. At the half-time (pre-match of main game), Sam Perry, the winner of The Voice Australia Season 7 performed at half-time, with a full ensemble of backup dancers as part of the show. The introduction when the players hit the pitch, the stadium went dark as the individual players were announced, then smoke and flame throwers went off as each entered the pitch. To say it was like an NFL game might be right on target. In attendance that night were over twelve thousand to watch their Force. (It was actually ~8,500)
https://www.earfulofdirt.com/2019/08/the-battle-to-maintain-pathway-for.html?m=1&fbclid=IwAR1LF7JdWWslP1tltTHfUr_NMv-7lMbmJA6APxvxmeVcO_RHtdkAlWuRxto\
Earfulofdirt: A weekly livestream and podcast focused on the growth of Major League Rugby, professional rugby union in the United States.
Earfulofdirt – Aaron Castro – 16 August 2019
I just spent most of the previous week enjoying everything that Perth, Western Australia, had to offer. It is a beautiful city with amazing cafes on almost every block, sometimes two of them. The people are extremely welcome. They also love their sports, whether that is the Western Force, Perth Glory, or the West Coast Eagles.
A few years ago, the broadcasters forced the realignment of Super Rugby. The Cheetahs and the Kings left the competition, but SARU found them a home in the Pro14. However, attendance for any South African Super Rugby team is atrocious. They've neglected to develop the match day experience for the fan and wonder why revenues haven't gotten better. At the time when the Force were cut they were one of the better supported Australian Super Rugby franchises. Interestingly, their attendance in Rapid Rugby is higher than all of the Australian Super Rugby franchises combined.
After a prolonged legal battle, the Western Force were cut from Super Rugby. As part of that ordeal, mining magnate Andrew Forrest had stepped forward to keep the Force in Super Rugby with financial guarantees but to no avail. Thursday ahead of the match of the Wallabies v. All Blacks Match there was an international referee forum for the Western Australia Referees. By the lapel pins on jackets and shirts, it was clear that this was Force Country.
Raelene Castle stood in front of the room to discuss how Rugby is quite healthy both commercially in Western Australia, noting the Wallabies sold out this fixture in less than 6 days upon opening for ticket sales six months prior. She also discussed the success of the grassroots and the pathway for Women with the Super W having put four WA Natives into the Wallaroos. But notably missing was the lack of acknowledgement of the pathway that is the Western Force. Raelene Castle is the de facto owner of the four Australian Super Rugby franchises. Rapid Rugby is basically a competitor to Super Rugby, yet the purpose of the Force and any other Rapid Rugby franchise in Australia is to create high performance pathways for players and to further commercially develop Rugby Union in Australia.
The following day, Andrew Forrest held a press conference where he guaranteed the launch of Rapid Rugby in season 3. Rapid Rugby was held as an exhibition in 2018 called World Series Rugby, and entered it's first season under the Rapid Rugby brand this year. The Force still played a few exhibitions, but Season 3 will be a 14 week schedule. What that looks like? They've got some work to do. Following the Western Force match last Friday Night I sat down with the Head of Rugby, Matt Hodgson whom is the most capped all-time Western Force player.
For Matt, he understands a lot of the pressure that is on his shoulders. Being granted the task of developing a competition across Oceania that will be sustainable. Not only in Australia but across Oceania. The teams in this year's showcase Series: South China Tigers, Asia Pacific Dragons, Fijian Latui, Samoa Kagifa, and the Malaysian Valke will likely form the backbone of a full 14 Week season in Rapid Rugby. Matt's job is to guide each of the new franchises towards commercial sustainability so that they do not need central funding. But having each one of these franchises themselves is important for each Nation to gain a local high performance pathway. Before the Fijian Drua, there was no local high performance pathway in Fiji. Before the Kagifa there was no high performance pathway in Samoa.
The Malaysian Valke, were mostly built off the Currie Cup Valke. But as Rudy Joubert stated, they have an intent to grow rugby in Malaysia as they integrated several Malaysian Rugby players into the side during their training in Perth. Those players [Badrul Bin Muktee and Samuel Meran] took the pitch and played considerable minutes contributing at a high level.
One of the things that Matt and I spoke about were the rule changes. World Rugby has looked at various competitions to execute law trials around the globe. One of those most famously has been the Varsity Cup in South Africa. But as he stated: "Where in the world is there a professional competition that has the willingness to experiment, a large competition that will adapt." That is where Rapid Rugby sees itself in the space. A place where they will build new performance pathways for countries that do not have them, do them sustainably, and work with World Rugby on various initiatives. One of those, the Power Try. Prior to watching the Force score the Power Try I had some apprehension about the rules in place. When you watched the tempo that the Force executed to score a Power Try, it was like watching a Football team execute a 2-minute drill out of the spread offense. Was gloriously exciting.
I asked Tim Sampson about the change in scoring and kicking rules and how that affected him as a strategist. Did that require him to be more innovative in his attack shapes and game plans with a follow up of how that will change his planning for the next National Rugby Championship Campaign. He stated that it did and they will attempt to continue this high flying attack into the NRC and play a fast and exciting brand. I also asked if this became a more fun style to play, because it seemed like a more fun style to watch. Western Force's captain Jeremy Thrush stated that it was.
When you look at the promotion of the Western Force match. It was an event, it wasn't just a game. There was pre-kickoff entertainment with a youth club match before the Force v. Valke, there was also the Royal Australian Band performing during this period. At the half-time (pre-match of main game), Sam Perry, the winner of The Voice Australia Season 7 performed at half-time, with a full ensemble of backup dancers as part of the show. The introduction when the players hit the pitch, the stadium went dark as the individual players were announced, then smoke and flame throwers went off as each entered the pitch. To say it was like an NFL game might be right on target. In attendance that night were over twelve thousand to watch their Force. (It was actually ~8,500)
https://www.earfulofdirt.com/2019/08/the-battle-to-maintain-pathway-for.html?m=1&fbclid=IwAR1LF7JdWWslP1tltTHfUr_NMv-7lMbmJA6APxvxmeVcO_RHtdkAlWuRxto\
Earfulofdirt: A weekly livestream and podcast focused on the growth of Major League Rugby, professional rugby union in the United States.
Rugbynutter39
Michael Lynagh (62)
Surely the rugby public and especially the force fans deserve an update on global rapid rugby competition plans for next year. The silence has gone on for too long. Come on give us an update on plans - teams confirmed etc
Kpc
Herbert Moran (7)
Two news that are approaching two Krasnoyarsk clubs Enisei-STM and Krasny Yar to GRR.
1. From January 2020, there will be direct flights of Aeroflot to Southeast Asia from the new Krasnoyarsk Airport. Hong Kong, Singrapur or Kuala Lumpur? This will make Krasnoyarsk and any team GRR at a distance and accessibility comparable with Tokyo.
2. On September 6, Moscow officials of the Russian Union of Rugby should announce the transfer of the Russian championship from a convenient summer format (from April to October) to the European calendar (from September to May). It is impossible to play in the winter in Krasnoyarsk.
1. From January 2020, there will be direct flights of Aeroflot to Southeast Asia from the new Krasnoyarsk Airport. Hong Kong, Singrapur or Kuala Lumpur? This will make Krasnoyarsk and any team GRR at a distance and accessibility comparable with Tokyo.
Aurelius
Ted Thorn (20)
Honestly I think what's happening in Hong Kong is casting a huge shadow over GRR's plans. Hong Kong (or South China Tigers) is clearly an integral part of Twiggy's plans for the Asian side of the tournament and it's nigh-on impossible to know what the situation will be like there next year. The pro-democracy activists clearly aren't quitters - are they still going to be protesting on the weekends if the Hong Kong government is too much under Beijing's thumb? Will Xi have sent in the tanks by then and imposed martial law?
Who knows? Obviously not Twiggy, unfortunately.
Yeah, those Russian sides are starting to look like a pretty good option if this is going to get up any time soon.
Rugbynutter39
Michael Lynagh (62)
Thumbs up mate - as stuffed if we can rely on anything else than speculation given lack of updates / detail for next year. Frustrated by this personally. But I guess I equally don't' have insight on their challenges and also appreciate not easy to launch a major new competition with all the challenges that go with it...so certainly not critical for what is great ambition and what should be commended for trying to give a crack to make something like this (which rugby needs) happen.
Rugbynutter39
Michael Lynagh (62)
I will also outline my thoughts on next years GRR competition from speculation perspective. Large amount of force signings to Super Rugby to me signals something...which is players not happy with what is planned for next year so jumping ship. ie 6 team that involve tier 3 nations not appealing as no Western Sydney, no Japanese team and definitely no NZ team.
Until updates provided I am concerned what written above close to accurate summary.
Forceright
Allen Oxlade (6)
As per Western Force website, there have also been at the moment 14 resignings of players with more expected. It’s disappointing to lose players like Deegan & Fines, and McDonald etc but at the moment GRR is up against Super Rugby who are waving the carrots under their noses. Latest news from Matt Hodgson a few weeks ago has plans are well & truly progressing, and no doubt until the WC is over and teams, fixtures etc can be confirmed, in addition to any other player signings. Apparently unlike eastern states franchises, the Force is concentrating also on pathways for our own players coming through - the battle is stopping Super teams thinking we’re a feeder team.
Personally speaking to Force guys myself, they are all very upbeat & looking forward to next Year,
Personally speaking to Force guys myself, they are all very upbeat & looking forward to next Year,
You were going well there with that post until the end.
Check out the Reds playing list for pathway efficiency.
As for the Force as a feeder team, they are just another professional team. Players move. Speight from the Brumbies to the Reds. Miller Waratahs to the Brumbies. Tuttle from Reds to the Rebels. Players will always move for various reasons. Like Andrew Ready, Jack McGregor, Rod Davies.
It’s a fact of the professional rugby world. Get used to it.
Check out the Reds playing list for pathway efficiency.
As for the Force as a feeder team, they are just another professional team. Players move. Speight from the Brumbies to the Reds. Miller Waratahs to the Brumbies. Tuttle from Reds to the Rebels. Players will always move for various reasons. Like Andrew Ready, Jack McGregor, Rod Davies.
It’s a fact of the professional rugby world. Get used to it.
Forceright
Allen Oxlade (6)
I’m quite aware that players will move around, gee thanks for informing me, and best wishes to those Force players like Deegan who have been great for the Force. They’re at the point in their careers they need to do that. And good on the Reds. Saying get used to it is the same type of comment we heard when the Force was axed- as in ‘Get over it’. We’re not getting over it, the Force are rebuilding the damage done to rugby numbers in WA and its a fact of life that we have to battle to keep them until GRR comp gets stronger without any assistance from RA.And then perhaps the tide will turn, but at least the Force won’t try to destroy a team in the process.
kiap
Steve Williams (59)
For pathway efficiency, you need to look at not only players signed, but players not signed. It's something the Reds have been poor at for many, many seasons. Now, the present time may be something of an uptick as far as that goes - I think it will be - but it's also a lagging indicator. It takes a year or two to know the results.
Yes, players moving is a fact. But their reasons for moving determines whether or not you might be looking at a feeder team - and, in particular, whether they're moving to another level.
BTW, this is not only limited to players moving out of such a team, it also includes players moving in. Case in point, Andrew Ready - or Jack McGregor (I would not include Davies) with both being surplus to requirements and having future career time still ahead. You might say 'rejects' to use the old ACT Brumbies term although, being in the same comp, the Brumbies weren't a feeder team as such.
Defining where teams (or competitions) are at a different "level" comes down to a few factors including standard of play and representative opportunities, but I'll limit myself to the main one - money. An example here is Samu Kerevi doubling his salary going to Japan. Easy rugby or not, he ain't going to a "feeder" team.
The thing I know about Super Rugby teams (some here will still deny this) is that they are moving down the "feed" chain as we speak. They're not far off being feeder teams themselves. Such teams don't have to be owned by teams up the chain - it's really a power and money game. The money is outside Sanzaar. The hunter can become prey.
it's just the type of rhetoric we hear from the west regularly, "We are the only doing ....." (developing grassroots, doing pre-match entertainment etc) It's ridiculous to suggest the Force are concentrating on their pathway when the eastern states are not. Not only ridiculous but blindly naive.
I am glad you do acknowledge that players move around. Then stop bleating about it.
Again, another typical reaction from the west is manipulating words said elsewhere. Suggesting me saying get used to player movement is basically the same as saying get over the Force axing is, again, ignorant and inflammatory.
I am glad you do acknowledge that players move around. Then stop bleating about it.
Again, another typical reaction from the west is manipulating words said elsewhere. Suggesting me saying get used to player movement is basically the same as saying get over the Force axing is, again, ignorant and inflammatory.
When the system produces approx 50% of the player market, then you will lose players. Yes we lost Pocock but we had David Croft at the time. But that's a decade or so ago? Even at the moment when we have the likes of Lucas, Petaia, Stewart, Hegarty, Campbell, CFS, McDermott, Sorovi et al we lose players like Lolesio and Tuttle. It happens.
Slim 293
Stirling Mortlock (74)
It's unfortunately the reality, but GRR will likely always remain a tier or two below Super Rugby (and possibly NRC), so there's always going to be that carrot if the players are good enough.............
Well, that's just rubbish.........
As per Reg, the game is professional and players move around....... take NSW rugby player Andrew Deegan (about to turn out for his third Super Rugby team), or Queenslander Issak Fines for example.
Players who can't get a break in Super Rugby are going to look at the Force for an opportunity to prove themselves, and in return there will be players auditioning for a Super Rugby or o/s gig.
The circle of life.........
kiap
Steve Williams (59)
I thought more like 35-40%. But maybe with the muppets running NSW shitting the bed, it's gone up of late. Fiji seems to have increased market share (or is that in Queensland?).
This thing is more recent than Pocock. Check out the Brumbies playing list for QLD pathway efficiency in recent years.
Sure, there's always an element of chance in picking that crop but they've got it wrong quite often in the recent past. That may have turned around now, like I said.
I don't think Cordingley should be getting a pumpkin scone gong at the mo'.
Kpc
Herbert Moran (7)
Amazing! Today, world leaders talked about rugby in the Asian region of Russia! In Vladivostok (Russian Pacific), the Eastern Economic Forum was held. There were leaders from India, Mongolia, Japan, Malaysia and Russia. Putin and Abe exchanged t-shirts of the national teams of Russia and Japan. And wish success to our teams at the Rugby World Cup. The Japanese also invited Putin on September 20 to the opening match of the RWC.
Also about the World Cup and the match between Japan and Russia spoke the Prime Minister of Mailaysia. He called this match a game of world giants. And he said that Vladivostok could host such matches. He also said Russia is interesting for Malaysian tourists.
But I can answer the Prime Minister of Malaysia. There is no rugby tradition in Vladivostok. We are waiting for Malaysia Valke and other participants of the GRR in Krasnoyarsk!
Also about the World Cup and the match between Japan and Russia spoke the Prime Minister of Mailaysia. He called this match a game of world giants. And he said that Vladivostok could host such matches. He also said Russia is interesting for Malaysian tourists.