George Smith - Will / Should He Play Against The Lions?
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jay-c
Ron Walden (29)
it looks to me like the aru doesnt want to be seen 'begging' smith to play, it looks like robbie deans doesnt wanna be seen' begging' smith to play and it looks like smith doesnt wanna make the first move either and doesnt wanna 'beg' to be able to play. i can see this going on till its too late- i really wish everyone would take their egos out of it and think about whats best for aus rugby.
is it possible one party sticks their neck out and gets the ball rolling?
is it possible one party sticks their neck out and gets the ball rolling?
Rassie
Trevor Allan (34)
Hooper and Gill still a bit green don't you think. Especially considering flankers jobs these days is not only to try and nick the ball but to create holes with blocking as well of the ball. Then there is the opsition flankers who is going to do the same to you on defense especially when playing wide
Brumbieman
Dick Tooth (41)
Oh for gods sake.
Hooper and Gill are awesome young players and would most likely perform admirably, but we have George fucking Smith back in Australia, playing as well as (if not better) than he did before.
Anyone else available to us that has won:
A lions series
Bledisloe Cup x 2
Tri-Nations
Super rugby x 2
RWC Final
110 caps of international experience
I reckon that could be quite useful to have on the field in crunch moments of these tests....
Hooper and Gill are awesome young players and would most likely perform admirably, but we have George fucking Smith back in Australia, playing as well as (if not better) than he did before.
Anyone else available to us that has won:
A lions series
Bledisloe Cup x 2
Tri-Nations
Super rugby x 2
RWC Final
110 caps of international experience
I reckon that could be quite useful to have on the field in crunch moments of these tests....
Dave Beat
Paul McLean (56)
Then there is the rapport / awe with the ref that has been developed over the years Fitzpatrick had it, McCaw has it, and George Smith has it - Hooper and Gill dont have it yet.
Deans is the only one with an ego.
Dan54
David Wilson (68)
Smith is unavailable because he not contracted to ARU, end of!! This is one time you can't blame ARU, Deans etc, it's the rules that ARU have, Smith knew that when he signed contract overseas, and I suspect he quite happy with it. Hooper and Gill maybe a little green, but they will do the job. Or they will have to anyway.
Dave Beat
Paul McLean (56)
Hit print and print a contract, surely that was learnt as one of the Private schools
Penguin
John Solomon (38)
Smith was also a little green when he first played the Lions, look how that turned out.
Look I think he was harshly dealt with when Deans first came into the job. Pocock was the greenhorn then & ousted Smith, Pocock is now recognised as one of the best. Smith, as much as I love him as a player, left to earn a fortune overseas instead of fighting off Pocock for his test spot.
Unless there is an all round agreement between three parties he aint gonna play for Australia again. And I for one feel comfortable in the knowledge that the young guys can do the job in his continued absence.
However if they can work something out I'd also love to see George go around for a few more tests. As long as he doesn't knock Sharpie off of our most capped forward!
Look I think he was harshly dealt with when Deans first came into the job. Pocock was the greenhorn then & ousted Smith, Pocock is now recognised as one of the best. Smith, as much as I love him as a player, left to earn a fortune overseas instead of fighting off Pocock for his test spot.
Unless there is an all round agreement between three parties he aint gonna play for Australia again. And I for one feel comfortable in the knowledge that the young guys can do the job in his continued absence.
However if they can work something out I'd also love to see George go around for a few more tests. As long as he doesn't knock Sharpie off of our most capped forward!
Joe Blow
John Hipwell (52)
Without Pocock our backrow lacks experience and direction, in fact 6 and 8 are far from decided.
George Smith is currently the best performing 7 in Australia, with Gill close on heals. That is enough for him to be considered. More importantly he would bring to the backrow exactly what Stephen Moore brings to the front row and Kev Horwill brings to the second row.
Hooper and Gill are outstanding prospects but I seriously the doubt that the Tahs or Qld backrows will be causing the Lions management to lose any sleep.
For gods sake this is the British Lions.
The ARU and Deans would be mad not to at least visit the possibility of securing GS for the series. He has more than earned the right.
George Smith is currently the best performing 7 in Australia, with Gill close on heals. That is enough for him to be considered. More importantly he would bring to the backrow exactly what Stephen Moore brings to the front row and Kev Horwill brings to the second row.
Hooper and Gill are outstanding prospects but I seriously the doubt that the Tahs or Qld backrows will be causing the Lions management to lose any sleep.
For gods sake this is the British Lions.
The ARU and Deans would be mad not to at least visit the possibility of securing GS for the series. He has more than earned the right.
Dave Beat
Paul McLean (56)
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Very well put. It should be noted though when Smith debuted in 2001 there was Eales, Gregan, and a number of other ver seasoned players who were involved in the 99 world cup success - given our performance over the last 18 months I'd struggle to say there was a seasoned perfermer that knew how to win.
Chase his fortune? he is one of only a very few players who I thought earnt the right to do that - congratulations to him.
It rubs me up the wrong way when players are renewing contracts and suggesting they'd walk away from the gold jersey for the coin.
George has always been very humble, right now he's letting his play do the talking - as for Deans, I can only reflect on the last 12 months - even Richie McCaw didnt rate him highly.
Scoey
Tony Shaw (54)
This is the curious point. How has he earned his right? I'm not so sure he has.
If his goal was to play against the BIL again then he has known for the past 12 years what he had to do to accomplish this.
No one can argue against what he brings to the table but fact of the matter is, he doesn't meet the eligibility criteria and changing the rules for one person sets us up atop a very slippery slope.
Scoey
Tony Shaw (54)
This is the curious point. How has he earned his right? I'm not so sure he has.
If his goal was to play against the BIL again then he has known for the past 12 years what he had to do to accomplish this.
No one can argue against what he brings to the table but fact of the matter is, he doesn't meet the eligibility criteria and changing the rules for one person sets us up atop a very slippery slope.
Slim 293
Stirling Mortlock (74)
It's not about changing the rules if the ARU can negotiate a deal with Suntory for a temporary release.........
I agree completely.
Losing Pocock hurts, but Hooper and Gill are excellent players. We are hardly at desperation stakes here.
George Smith is definitely still good enough to play for the Wallabies, but I don't think the situation warrants changing the ARU eligibility rules to make it happen.
I feel like lots of people are loving the walk down memory lane of having George Smith back in Australia and would love to see him play for the Wallabies again. I don't feel that this sentimentality is reason enough to change policy and potentially deny another very worthy player the chance of playing against the Lions.
thierry dusautoir
Alan Cameron (40)
I am not sure if he wil lplay or not but there is no doubt in my mind that the george planne dhis super comeback to coincide with the lions series
wamberal
Phil Kearns (64)
The first question is, would Smith be available for selection, or do his Japanese contractual commitments take precedence? If he is available, the second question is one of principle for the ARU. Should a foreign-based player be considered for selection in a national team? (My answer would be, yes, he should be considered, because he is now based in Australia, and the overwhelming priority is for the Wallabies to field the best possible sides against the Lions).
The final question is, of course, would he make the squad. He would certainly make my squad, along with both Gill and Hooper. On current form, I would take Smith and Gill into the First Test. Somewhere along the line, Hooper should also get a run, either because we are leading 2 - zip or because of injuries, or because we need to try something different.
Nobody owns a Wallabies jersey, the best possible teams should be selected. By definition, that means that some very worthy players will miss out.
I wonder what David Pocock thinks about all this? My guess is that he would put the national interest first, and it is overwhelmingly in the national rugby interest for us to beat the bloody Lions.
The final question is, of course, would he make the squad. He would certainly make my squad, along with both Gill and Hooper. On current form, I would take Smith and Gill into the First Test. Somewhere along the line, Hooper should also get a run, either because we are leading 2 - zip or because of injuries, or because we need to try something different.
Nobody owns a Wallabies jersey, the best possible teams should be selected. By definition, that means that some very worthy players will miss out.
I wonder what David Pocock thinks about all this? My guess is that he would put the national interest first, and it is overwhelmingly in the national rugby interest for us to beat the bloody Lions.
BDA
Jim Lenehan (48)
I'm torn on this issue.
On the one hand, I do think we would benefit from having Smith in our squad. A quick look at our team and its obvious that outside of Horwill and Genia (and maybe Moore) we lack guys with test leadership experience. Smith definitely brings that to the table. Gill and Hooper haven't even played at a World Cup, let alone a Lions Series (as Smith has).
On the other hand, qwerty is right in saying that we have two outstanding no.7s available for selection. I probably wouldn't rate them in the top 3 in the world but they all certainly well in the top ten behind only Pocock, McCaw and Brussow. I think both guys are capable of outplaying warburton (when on song). Whether they are better than smith is debatable. I don't think we need to push the panic button.
If we were a risk of being horribly exposed then I would be concerned. If you look back to the RWC2011, we really had no quality back up for Pocock. That ultimately bit us on the arse. Robbie Deans went with McCalman
, with the alternative at the time being Beau Robinson (who you probably wouldn't rate in the top 25 no.7s in world rugby).
I think both Gill and Hooper will do a good job for us, and in fact I think both are capable of putting in man-of-the-series performances, such is the caliber of their play. And at the end of the day, the team that wins the series will be the team that is greater than the sum of its parts (slightly worrying given that Robbie Deans seems incapable of getting the best out of our players).
One added benefit of playing Gill and Hooper this June is that it is an investment. Pocock's injury has created a rare opportunity for these guys to gain top level test experience. Whilst a Lion's series win would be nice, the World Cup is what I really want. 2015 is our end goal.
If your view is that Deans' Wallabies are really incapable of winning with the series without Smith then ponder this scenerio - smith is brought in, we win, Deans gets reappointed as coach, Smith leaves, we are no better off and we are stuck with Robbie Deans. Personally I expect McKenzie to take over later this year, barring a clean sweep of the major trophies, so I dont really care if no concessions are made for Deans.
So would like to see George in the June tests? - Yes
Is it essential? - no, we have world class back-ups
On the one hand, I do think we would benefit from having Smith in our squad. A quick look at our team and its obvious that outside of Horwill and Genia (and maybe Moore) we lack guys with test leadership experience. Smith definitely brings that to the table. Gill and Hooper haven't even played at a World Cup, let alone a Lions Series (as Smith has).
On the other hand, qwerty is right in saying that we have two outstanding no.7s available for selection. I probably wouldn't rate them in the top 3 in the world but they all certainly well in the top ten behind only Pocock, McCaw and Brussow. I think both guys are capable of outplaying warburton (when on song). Whether they are better than smith is debatable. I don't think we need to push the panic button.
If we were a risk of being horribly exposed then I would be concerned. If you look back to the RWC2011, we really had no quality back up for Pocock. That ultimately bit us on the arse. Robbie Deans went with McCalman
, with the alternative at the time being Beau Robinson (who you probably wouldn't rate in the top 25 no.7s in world rugby).I think both Gill and Hooper will do a good job for us, and in fact I think both are capable of putting in man-of-the-series performances, such is the caliber of their play. And at the end of the day, the team that wins the series will be the team that is greater than the sum of its parts (slightly worrying given that Robbie Deans seems incapable of getting the best out of our players).
One added benefit of playing Gill and Hooper this June is that it is an investment. Pocock's injury has created a rare opportunity for these guys to gain top level test experience. Whilst a Lion's series win would be nice, the World Cup is what I really want. 2015 is our end goal.
If your view is that Deans' Wallabies are really incapable of winning with the series without Smith then ponder this scenerio - smith is brought in, we win, Deans gets reappointed as coach, Smith leaves, we are no better off and we are stuck with Robbie Deans. Personally I expect McKenzie to take over later this year, barring a clean sweep of the major trophies, so I dont really care if no concessions are made for Deans.
So would like to see George in the June tests? - Yes
Is it essential? - no, we have world class back-ups
Great post BDA. I agree with you wholeheartedly.
It creates a great story if George Smith plays against the Lions but I think it is far from essential. Despite some of the hyperbole, it would not be a terrible decision or a travesty if Smith isn't asked to play against the Lions. Hooper and Gill are both tremendous players and are thoroughly deserving of their places in the squad and/or team.
It creates a great story if George Smith plays against the Lions but I think it is far from essential. Despite some of the hyperbole, it would not be a terrible decision or a travesty if Smith isn't asked to play against the Lions. Hooper and Gill are both tremendous players and are thoroughly deserving of their places in the squad and/or team.
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