England is coming!

[Sully]

But not Tuilagi
http://www.englandrugby.com/news/tuilagi-withdraws-from-england-tour-squad/

Or Joe Marler

 

[Hugh Jarse]

Was Lieutenant Harry "Breaker" Morant misquoted?

 

[Sully]

England senior 32-man squad for Australia tour:
Forwards
Dan Cole (Leicester Tigers)
Luke Cowan-Dickie (Exeter Chiefs)
Jack Clifford (Harlequins)
Ellis Genge (Leicester Tigers)
Jamie George (Saracens)
Teimana Harrison (Northampton Saints)
Dylan Hartley (Northampton Saints)
James Haskell (Wasps)
Paul Hill (Northampton Saints)
Maro Itoje (Saracens)
George Kruis (Saracens)
Joe Launchbury (Wasps)
Courtney Lawes (Northampton Saints)
Matt Mullan (Wasps)
Chris Robshaw (Harlequins)
Kyle Sinckler (Harlequins)
Billy Vunipola (Saracens)
Mako Vunipola (Saracens)

Backs
Mike Brown (Harlequins)
Danny Care (Harlequins)
Elliot Daly (Wasps)
Owen Farrell (Saracens)
George Ford (Bath Rugby)
Alex Goode (Saracens)
Jonathan Joseph (Bath Rugby)
Jack Nowell (Exeter Chiefs)
Henry Slade (Exeter Chiefs)
Ben Te’o (Worcester Warriors)
Manu Tuilagi (Leicester Tigers)
Anthony Watson (Bath Rugby)
Marland Yarde (Harlequins)
Ben Youngs (Leicester Tigers)

 

[Dan54]

Love that pic at top, I know Marler is going in on angle, but there not to many in yellow jerseys look like they pushing straight either. I think that shows how much of a lottery scrum penalties can be, Marler is definitely turned in a mile, but imagine if he was staying straight he would have no one to scrum against. Would be interested to see whole video of scrum form above to see if he started on that angle. And no I not defending Marler's scrimmaging or anything, just always think there is often more to srums than one photo will show.

 

[Scoey]

The Wallabies were pushing straight. Marler is 90 degrees to his hooker. 90 degrees! Him shearing across like that is what has made the Wallabies front row head the direction they were.

I agree that scrum penalties are often a lottery but there was no lottery here mate.

 

[The_Brown_Hornet]

I'm going to watch that WC game again today, just to remind me of how awesome it was to dust the Poms in the scrum with our first choice tight five and then to do them over even more with the back up group.

 

[Dan54]

Scoey, I not arguing, but just saying how they can be a lottery because neither team is scrummaging straight in that pic, and I never saw why he got on that anlge, but generally if a loosehead is in that position it is because he has been done by opposition tighthead, great scrumming by Wallabies, but I doubt that Marler actually ever goes in with intent to scrum at that angle, because it takes power out of your own scrum. A real good tighthead will turn a loosehead in by putting a lot of pressure on his inside shoulder (sometimes not strictly legal, but....) and loosie doesn't have anyone stopping him turning in like a tighthead. Like I said great scrummaging Wallabies, but it not always as it seems.

 

[Scoey]

I agree with you Dan, but that particular match was the exception that proves the rule. Marler was setting up on a massive angle. It was just bizarre. Read any of Gaggers articles about it prior to the match or watch any of the spider cam video. It's hard to believe until you see it.

 

[Sully]

Yes Marlers set up was weird. The only person who defended him was Brian Moore. Find Gaggers article from the world cup. It's worth a read.

Sent from my GT-N7000B using Tapatalk

 

[Scoey]

This is a better couple of images from the game (from Gaggers article).
Original set up:

And then...... Note the ball hasn't been fed yet.

Full article here: http://www.greenandgoldrugby.com/scrum-analysis-how-the-wallabies-crushed-england/

 

[zer0]

I hope they're wearing protection.

 

[Dan54]

That's great scrummaging by Wallabies, looks like tighthead has separated hooker and loosehead, one of objects of a front row, separate the opposition front row, and watch them go to pieces.

 

[The_Brown_Hornet]

Watched the game again. Yep, still awesome.

 

[the sabanator]

Not too many shocks in Eddie's squad, outside of Ben Te'o. I'll imagine they'll run with something along these lines:

1. Mako Vunipola
2. Dylan Hartley (C)
3. Dan Cole
4. Maro Itoje
5. George Kruis
6. Chris Robshaw
7. James Haskell
8. Billy Vunipola

9. Danny Care
10. George Ford
11. Jack Nowell
12. Owen Farrell (Henry Slade if injured)
13. Jonathon Joseph
14. Anthony Watson
15. Mike Brown

Jamie George, Kieran Brookes, Paul Hill, Courtney Lawes/Joe Launchbury, Jack Clifford, Ben Youngs, Henry Slade, Eliot Daly

Saracens have conquered the world and will likely have their fingerprints all over this team (Vunipola's, Farrell, Kruis, Itoje)

The real danger is Maro Itoje. He has the makings of the world's best second rower for about the next decade. Strong ball carrier, excellent in the air, solid defence and is probably England's biggest threat over the ball in their whole squad (outside of possibly Clifford). The front row is experienced - Mako Vunipola isn't the world's best scrummager.

Haskell and Robshaw played a bruising style in the 6 Nations. It remains how effective this would be against the Fardy Pooper's more expansive game and work at the ruck.

Billy V is the running threat in the forwards and was sublime in the 6Ns. One of the top 8s going around right now and definitely the pick of Europe.

In the backs a lot will depend on Farrell's fitness. George Ford was solid, if uninspiring, during the 6 Nations and you could make a fairly good case they'd have been better without him. Woefully down on form and his club team were bundled out early.

Farrell on the other hand has been excellent for Saracens at 10, and surely Eddie has thought about starting him at flyhalf in Brisbane (despite blowing a lot of hot air up Ford's you know what after taking on the job).

If Farrell starts at 10, Henry Slade's time might have come to debut at 12 for England. Slade is a second ballplayer type 12 who is equally adept at running at the line. He's a class footballer - not the same type of brute impact as Tuilagi but a better kick and distributor.

The uber-athletic Joseph will start at 13. Wings will be the safe Nowell and explosive Watson (who I think England would fancy their chances with against which relatively inexperienced test player pulls on 14 for the Men in Gold). Mike Brown will play 15. Safe under the high ball and a good counterattacker, look for him to launch a tirade at the media within a fortnight if things don't go England's way.

On the bench Elliot Daly offers some intrigue. He has plenty of guile and it will be interesting if he is inserted with 20 to go to run the ball. Jack Clifford is more of a true 7 than Robshaw or Haskell (but not anywhere near the league of Pocock or even Liam Gill).

Either way this England team is a different prospect to the RWC team. A lot of similar faces but with a whole new energy and confidence.

 

[The_Brown_Hornet]

Itoje looked a million bucks in the games I saw him. What a talent that bloke is.

 

[Marcelo]

Is Mario Itoje like a Lopeti Timani who can jump?

 

[Groucho]

Scoey, I not arguing, but just saying how they can be a lottery because neither team is scrummaging straight in that pic, and I never saw why he got on that anlge, but generally if a loosehead is in that position it is because he has been done by opposition tighthead, great scrumming by Wallabies, but I doubt that Marler actually ever goes in with intent to scrum at that angle, because it takes power out of your own scrum. A real good tighthead will turn a loosehead in by putting a lot of pressure on his inside shoulder (sometimes not strictly legal, but..) and loosie doesn't have anyone stopping him turning in like a tighthead. Like I said great scrummaging Wallabies, but it not always as it seems.

Seriously? So boring in is just a misunderstanding, an honest mistake by diligent props doing their best to stay straight, despite every provocation? I'm honestly rolling on the floor laughing.

 

[Groucho]

Is Mario Itoje like a Lopeti Timani who can jump?

No he's more in the skillful mode of lock.

 

[USARugger]

Scoey, I not arguing, but just saying how they can be a lottery because neither team is scrummaging straight in that pic, and I never saw why he got on that anlge, but generally if a loosehead is in that position it is because he has been done by opposition tighthead, great scrumming by Wallabies, but I doubt that Marler actually ever goes in with intent to scrum at that angle, because it takes power out of your own scrum. A real good tighthead will turn a loosehead in by putting a lot of pressure on his inside shoulder (sometimes not strictly legal, but..) and loosie doesn't have anyone stopping him turning in like a tighthead. Like I said great scrummaging Wallabies, but it not always as it seems.

It's a deliberate tactic that Rowntree has been coaching his LHPs to execute for years. Even the Lions did it.

Neitehr Vunipola or Marler are particularly flash when scrummaging straight so by swinging out their hips they can start a wheel, creating the illusion of dominance, before destabilizing and collapsing the scrum to draw a penalty.

No he's more in the skillful mode of lock.

I'd put him more in the "bloody good at pretty much everything" category

 

[Dan54]

Geez Groucho, you fellas are just not prepared to give Wallaby front row credit are you, I still think Marler has been done in that scrum, he has got no power going forward, but if anyone imagines a coach teaching a prop to go at that angle, I would think it best to just let you think there is any advantage in it. I know EVERY loosehead tries to come and put the tighthead under pressure, but if he doesn't succeed and tighthead gets onto his inside shoulder he will get turned out like that. I say give credit to Wallaby front row where it is deserved.