Eddie Jones - The Coach

[disco]

Ok well done Eddie on your Cook Cup win but I still find all this super coach man love for Eddie hard to swallow considering the state he left Australian Rugby in 2005. They say we learn from our mistakes and it certainly looks like Eddie has learnt a lot from his mistakes as Australian head coach and I hope Cheika has also quickly learnt from these last two losses. I'm sure the English all love Eddie now but I'm very keen to see how things are going with him and his players in 2-3 years time. Not sure if the British and Irish Lions coach has been selected yet but if he hasn't I'd be placing my money on Eddie getting that gig ATM especially with all the English love he'll be getting. While he is out here for the Cook Cup I would love just one person to ask him at a public press conference if he still feels responsible for the shambles he left our forward play & certainly the scrum in on his departure and if he still believes that Rugby is slowly following the path of the little brother Rugby League and Scrums are just a qucik restart.

 

[Highlander35]

He's said it's too soon for him when he signed, and I'd assume there'd be a little clause in his RFU contract with a big financial bonus for turning it down.

Joe Schmidt has 1 win from 2 in South Africa, missing a few of his best. If Wales don't dramatically improve in the 3rd test and EOY tours, think Gatland will miss out.

 

[wamberal]

Probably the single smartest thing Eddie has done is employ Glen Ella who, as England's attack coach must have the easiest job in world rugby. If not the whole world.


Talk about a Trojan Horse.

 

[Viking]

Can't believe people are still banging on about the way he left Australian rugby in 2005. He did take the wallabies to a RWC final in 03 too.

And that was over 10 years ago. Since then he helped coach the Boks to RWC win, and has been an international coach for Japan for a number of years.

I'd say he out-coached Cheika on experience alone.

I actually wish a coach like Cheika could have coached another international team before the wallabies so he can make his "mistakes" and learn from them before he started coaching for us. In reality, he was the best choice at the time given the circumstances.

 

[The torpedo]

IMO getting sacked in 2005 was the kick up the arse Eddie needed. He came back a better coach for it. Hopefully this series loss is the kick up the arse that Cheiks needed to have.

 

[The_Brown_Hornet]

Eddie took one of the great Wallaby teams of all time and was able to squeeze just enough out of them to maintain the Bled/3N for a couple of years and get to the RWC final (58% win rate overall). After that our performances tailed off and he didn't adjust the game plan, culminating in the nadir of Twickenham 2005. I thought he was fantastic as a consultant to Jake White in 2007 and that might be his calling, but he also did well with Japan and obviously now even better with England. What remains to be seen is if he can sustain that over the next three years. I'm not convinced he can, personally, but I won't begrudge him his success at the moment.

He's not a super coach, but has learned from his mistakes and become a better one. I wouldn't have him back at the helm of the Wallabies though.

 

[disco]

Can't believe people are still banging on about the way he left Australian rugby in 2005. He did take the wallabies to a RWC final in 03 too.

And that was over 10 years ago. Since then he helped coach the Boks to RWC win, and has been an international coach for Japan for a number of years.

I'd say he out-coached Cheika on experience alone.

I actually wish a coach like Cheika could have coached another international team before the wallabies so he can make his "mistakes" and learn from them before he started coaching for us. In reality, he was the best choice at the time given the circumstances.

The RWC final was at home with the bulk of the 99 defending champions team.

 

[Viking]

The RWC final was at home with the bulk of the 99 defending champions team.

So whats your point? It was no achievement?

Even so, it's been over 10 years on which means 10 years extra international coaching experience.

I doubt if he coached the wallabies again he would completely abandon the scrum again.

 

[Micheal]

The RWC final was at home with the bulk of the 99 defending champions team.

The fact of the matter is: people are writing Eddie off for his performances over 10 years ago (13 for the RWC, 11 for his departure from Aus).

As a person, I am completely and utterly different from the person I was 10 years ago and I've developed / changed a lot as a person.

Hell I don't even look like I used to look a decade ago.

The fact people think that 2003 is indicative of his skills as a coach, given the time that has passed and all that he has ACHIEVED since then, is absolute madness.

The guy obviously knows what he's doing. Either that or all his accolades post-2003 have been some sort of marvellous set of coincidences.

 

[Gnostic]

Funny how most of the Jones detractors are Reds fans.

Jones had a mare of a season with the Reds who were truly woeful, but I also wonder what was going on in the background. The QRU was a very unhealthy place back then as well I have heard.

As for the RWC2003, Jones like Chieka outperformed to a certain degree. Yes in inherited a champion team, but that side was on its way out and a hell of a lot of the 1999 RWC side retired and the game plan change markedly from what Jones took over post Lions tour in 2002. Jones has always been a great thinker of the game and he bet wrongly on how the game would develop in the year post 2003, and that wrong bet along with Macqueen's constant recycle game in the cycle previously has handicapped Australia for a the better part of a decade, not helped by an incompetent ARU.

Jones however it has to be said learnt and developed and IMO his biggest success was in achieving the style of play and achievement he saw with Japan. He showed there that building a complete coaching team and being tactically astute with the skills and attributes of the players available can achieve great things. In that sentence lies the key, Jones has a very good extended coaching group, both at Japan and at England.

Australia in contrast has had a complete coaching group since Macqueen fit for purpose.

 

[RugbyReg]

Just some stats for you.

All time Wallaby coaching records:

Rod MacQueen - 43 tests - 34 won - 79.07% win
Alan Jones - 30 t - 21 w - 70%
John Connolly - 25 t - 16 w - 64%
Greg Smith - 19 t - 12 w - 63.16%
Bob Dwyer - 73 t - 46 w - 63.11%
Michael Cheika - 18 t - 11 w - 61.11%
Eddie Jones - 57 t - 33 w - 57.89%
Robbie Deans - 74 t - 42 w - 56.76%
Ewen McKenzie - 22 t - 11 w - 50%

Don't have stats for the likes of Tempo, Brockhoff and Haberecht cause I'm not 100% on what tests they coached.

Results after 18 tests though:

Alan Jones with 15 wins @ 83%
McQueen with 14 @ 78%
Smith and Deans with 12 @ 67%
Knuckles is with Cheika with 11 @ 61%
Dwyer's 2nd run (from 1988) is the same as Eddie and Ewen with 10 @ 56%
Bob's overall first 18 games though was just 7 wins @ 39%

For what it's all worth.

 

[wamberal]

Funny how most of the Jones detractors are Reds fans.

Jones had a mare of a season with the Reds who were truly woeful, but I also wonder what was going on in the background. The QRU was a very unhealthy place back then as well I have heard.
.

I do not know what was going on in the background, either, but before our very eyes we saw Eddie sticking to tactics which progressively destroyed the team. I mean physically destroyed them, particularly the forwards. Never seen anything like it, before, or since, and I hope I never do. It was abominable.

 

[Train Without a Station]

What a load of rubbish this is.

Firstly Disco, your anger at Eddie is massively misguided. In 2004 he coached the team to 75% win record and was decimated by injuries in 2005 which saw our fortunes drop dramatically. Players like Lloyd Johansson were capped because at the time we had something like 90 full time professional players in Australia.

He was by no means perfect, but he was pretty successful. In 2004 he had the team on the right track after previously taking them to a RWC final, and won 75% of that seasons games.

Massive injuries were a factor in him winning only 5 of 13 the following season.

People quickly wanted to ignore anything good he did and make him the sole scapegoat for everything bad in Australian rugby.

As for Gnositc's comments. Again what a load of rubbish. All the ridicule of Jones' appointment at QLD came from the other states.

The fact is it irks some people to see him go on and be successful after they perceived him such a failure here. Many only remember him for 2005 and 2007 and have wiped all success of his from their memories.

He was a decent coach a decade or more ago. With experience since then, he's only improved.

 

[Train Without a Station]

What a load of rubbish this is.

Firstly Disco, your anger at Eddie is massively misguided. In 2004 he coached the team to 75% win record and was decimated by injuries in 2005 which saw our fortunes drop dramatically. Players like Lloyd Johansson were capped because at the time we had something like 90 full time professional players in Australia.

He was by no means perfect, but he was pretty successful. In 2004 he had the team on the right track after previously taking them to a RWC final, and won 75% of that seasons games.

Massive injuries were a factor in him winning only 5 of 13 the following season.

People quickly wanted to ignore anything good he did and make him the sole scapegoat for everything bad in Australian rugby.

As for Gnositc's comments. Again what a load of rubbish. All the ridicule of Jones' appointment at QLD came from the other states.

The fact is it irks some people to see him go on and be successful after they perceived him such a failure here. Many only remember him for 2005 and 2007 and have wiped all success of his from their memories.

He was a decent coach a decade or more ago. With experience since then, he's only improved.

 

[Scrubber2050]

Train
I got your post the first time but upon reading it a second time it made more sense

 

[Gnostic]

What a load of rubbish this is.



Firstly Disco, your anger at Eddie is massively misguided. In 2004 he coached the team to 75% win record and was decimated by injuries in 2005 which saw our fortunes drop dramatically. Players like Lloyd Johansson were capped because at the time we had something like 90 full time professional players in Australia.



He was by no means perfect, but he was pretty successful. In 2004 he had the team on the right track after previously taking them to a RWC final, and won 75% of that seasons games.



Massive injuries were a factor in him winning only 5 of 13 the following season.



People quickly wanted to ignore anything good he did and make him the sole scapegoat for everything bad in Australian rugby.



As for Gnositc's comments. Again what a load of rubbish. All the ridicule of Jones' appointment at QLD came from the other states.



The fact is it irks some people to see him go on and be successful after they perceived him such a failure here. Many only remember him for 2005 and 2007 and have wiped all success of his from their memories.



He was a decent coach a decade or more ago. With experience since then, he's only improved.

A load of rubbish eh. I don't see how. All of the ridicule came from others states? I am only commenting about the massive detractors on this thread. At the time I think many were surprised about how bad that season was with the Reds, and it was truly bad in terms of play.

 

[Sir Eddie Jones]

While he is out here for the Cook Cup I would love just one person to ask him at a public press conference if he still feels responsible for the shambles he left our forward play & certainly the scrum in on his departure and if he still believes that Rugby is slowly following the path of the little brother Rugby League and Scrums are just a qucik restart.

Eddie didn't ruin your scrum, your front row playing stocks were weak and they still are. No coach can make anything out of mush.

 

[Pfitzy]

Yet another continuation of "The National Coach is reponsible for every single player in the country and that includes their skill levels and fitness!"

Its a bit shit, really, because the national coach might have a small influence on what comes through the pathways, but ultimately the lower levels decide what is most important.

And, for us, its back play. All the big contracts have historically gone to backs. All the advertising is centred around backs. Schoolboy stars are frequently backs.

If we want to harden the fuck up, then we need to do it at all levels, and take the fucking rose-coloured glasses off. Rod Macqueen had an awesome record because he changed the way teams were coached and managed. He had a crop of great players, too, but that doesn't mean shit if they're not all pointing in the same direction.

Eddie's lack of focus on the scrum was a reflection of what he was given to work with. How was he going to correct that? Particularly the way scrums were adjudicated at the time in these parts?

He took the England job, and told them what he wanted. He got it, and he's taken what was never a bad crop of players, and got them playing solid rugby - to their strengths.

If he can keep adding layers to that, England will continue to look good.

Waste your time spitting shit over Eddie if you want, but I'd rather look at how we fix our horribly narrow rugby pathways.

 

[Ignoto]

Looks like Eddie still needs the Aussie support network by hanging out the Aussie team; Orica-BikeExchange. I wonder if he's mates with Gerry Ryan?