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Eddie Jones rugby and the Brave Blossoms

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N

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Just watched this video of Japan’s last second victory over close rivals Georgia (Japan is 15th and Georgia 17th on the IRB world rankings).

It’s a real spectacle. The Brave Blossoms have Eddie Jones written all over them. It made me see pretty clearly how Robbie Deans has changed the way the Wallabies play since Jones had them between 2001 and 2005.

I was curious to see what influence Jones has had on the Brave Blossoms since the Pacific Nations Cup when they lost all 3 Tests to Fiji, Samoa and Tonga (albeit narrowly in each case). Well he’s had a massive influence. They play exactly like the Brumbies of the early 2000s. In attack they avoid the ruck as much as possible, all the play running off their No 10 who has runners from deep to dent the line and get continuity. The forwards are pretty small but their job isn’t to carry, it’s to get to the ruck quicker than the other side and give their 9 fast ball. The 9 never runs the ball. They rarely kick. In defence they don’t go after the dominant tackle, just drag their man down and try for a pilfer.

It’s very familiar to anyone who watched the Brumbies in the Gregan-Larkham era, or the Wallabies under Eddie Jones. No physical battles, just lots of running off the ball and set plays for the No 10 to keep throwing at the defence until it gives up a break or a penalty.

You have to admire the way Eddie does this. Georgia should have smashed Japan in this Test. They are at least half again as strong as the Japanese, man for man. Big Georgian units, legs like tree trunks, pushing through tackles and just picking up and manhandling the Japanese runners.

But Japan won the game, even dominated play for most of the Test match. Their structure looked good. They kept getting forward phase by phase, and looked very organised and pretty confident. The halfback is sharp and has a snappy pass. The flyhalf is assured, willing to run the ball into the defensive wall if need be, and makes good decisions. They snared a try from their own goal line by playing fast from the ruck and supporting well.

It all poses some questions, at least for me. Can Eddie actually take the Brave Blossoms into the IRB top 10? And is the Robbie Deans style better?

To rise in the IRB rankings Eddie is going to have to beat Samoa, Tonga and Fiji. To get up into the top 10 he’ll have to knock off Scotland and Italy as well.

I don’t think they’ll get ahead of Italy, who now attack very well on top of a world class scrum. But they could definitely beat Wales on their Japanese tour next year, and with a bit more strength and conditioning they’ll get more and more linebreaks out wide. He’s got two players in Super rugby squads, Shota Horie the hooker at the Melbourne Rebels and Fumiaki Tanaka at the Highlanders. That will raise their standards, maybe get them a bit stronger and fitter and faster.

If Eddie can upskill enough of his squad to make them attractive to professional teams in Europe and Super rugby, he might get some more rapid progress. I’d like to see his flyhalf Kosei Ono get a chance. But without that, there’s not much Eddie can do more than he’s already done.

Also this game clarified for me how differently Robbie has had the Wallabies playing, compared to the Eddie Jones era. The Wallabies used to play like the Brave Blossoms – I remembre John Roe at blindside, constantly conceding the gainline in every tackle. George Gregan never made a dominant hit, but just dragged his man down after giving up a meter. Our strategy was George Smith and Phil Waugh, stealing the ball or forcing a penalty.

Whereas now, we’ve really lifted our emphasis on dominant tackling and counterrucking under Robbie’s coaching. We now try to win games by beating the opposition in the collisions, rather than concede the collision and go for turnovers and fast structured phase play off the 10. Robbie has brought in pick and drives in a big way. He’s got us kicking the ball more as an attacking weapon – we never used to kick the ball in the opposition half until Quade Cooper started doing it, forcing a pressure lineout. Under Robbie we win games by winning the collisions, and by being more physical than the opposition. I think I prefer this to Eddie Jones/George Gregan rugby, but seeing Japan do it so well it’s hard not to admire.
 

disco

Chilla Wilson (44)
It's funny you mention the 3 narrow losses in the Pacific nations cup because they Japanese reminded me a lot of how the Wallabies not only played under Eddie but how we lost under Eddie. Start the game on fire with brilliant set piece moves & get out to a lead. Then from the 20th minute to the 70th minute it was confusion while the opposition built a lead then all of a sudden when the game was gone all these set piece moves started coming off & we'd lose by a respectable margin.

Jake White knew how to use Eddie & to be honest I would love the ARU to use him in the same way as he would definitely by an asset to a head coach if all he did was study opposition teams all week & give the head coach a game plan on where to attack & how to defend each and every opponent.
 

SuperGrover

Darby Loudon (17)
Here's an interesting article from the SMH a couple of months ago.

Japan rugby stuck in 1950s, says Eddie Jones
TOKYO: Japan coach Eddie Jones on Wednesday slammed the country's rugby development structure for being stuck in the past and urged players to be more aggressive if they want to challenge the best teams.

While announcing a 30-man squad for next month's tour of Europe, Jones said he had avoided the urge to blood young players as they were far from ready for the top-flight.

"I haven't picked any university students as we only have a short preparation and the level of rugby they are playing makes it impossible for them to play Test-match rugby by November 10," he told Japanese media.

"I watched a university game at the weekend and it was like I was in a time warp. I thought I was in the 1950s," he said, according to Kyodo news agency.

"I have to be honest, it's just not rugby. I don't know what they do in training but they have got to change."

The Australian took charge of Brave Blossoms in April, leading them to a fifth straight Asian Five Nations crown a month later.

Since then, however, they lost all three matches in the Pacific Nations Cup in June, when they also proved no match against the French Barbarians in two games at home.

His stated goal is to develop Japan into a top-10 nation before the 2015 World Cup in England.
The Brave Blossoms will play Test matches against Romania on November 10 and Georgia on the 17th, before taking on a Basque select team on November 21 and the French Barbarians four days later.

"The players that have not made the squad are not doing what they are supposed to be doing in the Top League," he said referring to Japan's nine-year-old rugby union league.

"George Smith runs around like he's got spiders on him because no one wants to tackle him," Jone said, citing the former Wallaby flanker who retired from international rugby in 2010 and now plays for the Top League's Suntory Sungoliath.

"He should be an inspiration to every backrow forward in Japan. He's the same size but he has the highest work rate," Jones said.

"But no one ever hits him. You need to see that attitude of 'I'm going to smash him,' if you want to make a mark in world rugby."

Romania are currently ranked 18th and Georgia 15th in the world, close to 16th-placed Japan, which hope to improve their standing before they host the World Cup in 2019.
As admirable as seeking to get Japanese players into foreign competitions is, it seems that a shake-up of the domestic pathways and culture would yeild far better results. Unfortunantely, if the corporate and economic worlds are anything to go by, trying to effect change in Japan is an uphill struggle to say the least.
 

Dan54

David Wilson (68)
I tend to think the only problem with Eddie's coaching is that he tends to coach rigid in his structures, teams don't play with enough freedom.I think he a good asst coach like disco says , but he definitely opposite to RD's idea of play what's in front of you, which I suppose is good when players don't have a lot of rugby "instinct". We had a coach at local club that had been to a few Eddie run coching schools, and he was same, captain actually told me he it got to point where it was hard to get players to change tactics if they didn't work, as the training was so structured there was very little "of the top of the head play".
 

Dave Beat

Paul McLean (56)
Ibut he definitely opposite to RD's idea of play what's in front of you, which
Crock of sheep shit - RD this year has had this idea to kick over "what's in front", or this idea to have a centre crash it up - McCabe comes to mind - and even if the D does get bent why not kick it next phase.
 
N

Newter

Guest
It's funny you mention the 3 narrow losses in the Pacific nations cup because they Japanese reminded me a lot of how the Wallabies not only played under Eddie but how we lost under Eddie. Start the game on fire with brilliant set piece moves & get out to a lead. Then from the 20th minute to the 70th minute it was confusion while the opposition built a lead then all of a sudden when the game was gone all these set piece moves started coming off & we'd lose by a respectable margin.

Jake White knew how to use Eddie & to be honest I would love the ARU to use him in the same way as he would definitely by an asset to a head coach if all he did was study opposition teams all week & give the head coach a game plan on where to attack & how to defend each and every opponent.

Well in terms of results you have to say Eddie's record was about par for the course for Test rugby coaches. He beat the All Blacks at home most of the time (4 from 6, I think).

But I generally never enjoyed the spectacle under his tenure. Too much avoiding the physical battle.
 
N

Newter

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He describes some of his attempts to innovate in this article.

Eddie Jones is cutting down on the foreigners in his efforts to discharge one of the more difficult tasks in rugby - transforming the Japanese national side into a credible force on the world stage.
Ask his opinions on the rebuilding of the Brave Blossoms and you get one of rugby's more creative thinkers in full flow, invoking inspiration from Spanish football, Argentine rugby and even a tale about rice farmers.
The former Brumbies and Wallabies coach took the job in April, following Sir John Kirwan's resignation after the 2011 World Cup.
"There is a lot to do," says Jones, as we sit in his modest Tokyo office. "The reality is Japan hasn't won a World Cup game for 20 years. The under-20s are in the second division and the sevens can't make the top 15 teams in the world. There is a history of non-performance here."
"We are building towards the World Cup at home and the first step is to be among the top 10 nations by 2015," affirms JRFU chairman Tatsuzo Yabe. "Then we want to be in the final eight teams when the tournament comes to Japan."
As well as the weight of an inglorious history, Japan also have to contend with a fragmented domestic structure, an indifferent public and obvious physical challenges.
Article continues below
"Argentina took 12 years (to move into the top 10)," says Jones, "and we are trying to do it in three. It's tough but we have some advantages compared to other tier two nations. Over 500 universities play rugby here and we have a club competition (Top League), with some of the biggest companies in the world putting teams on the field. I don't think the international performances reflect the infrastructure in the country."
Jones, whose mother is Japanese, first worked in Japan in 1997 as coach of a university team and the following year was appointed forwards coach of the national side. He has since had two spells at top Tokyo club Suntory before his appointment to the top national job. He says an absolute imperative is the formation of a uniquely Japanese style, which relies on a quick-passing, high-tempo game that he compares to the Spanish football team.
"We have got to be like Spain in football," says Jones. "In a typical match they pass the ball six times more than the opposition. Their midfield are all small but it doesn't matter; sure, football is a different game but we need to think exactly the same. We will never be the biggest side in the world so we need to move the ball quickly - in contact, out of contact and before contact."

Jones acknowledges the profound Kiwi influence on the sport here but says there are problems trying to ape the winningest nation in world rugby.

"The New Zealanders have had a great influence and have brought a lot of good things here," says Jones, "But one of the bad things is that the Japanese have tried to copy the New Zealanders - and you can't. The only team that can play a New Zealand style is New Zealand.
"We have to find our own way. As an example, in terms of scrummaging, we should look at France because they also have smaller props like us.
"They get low, race into it and are really aggressive. That is how we should be scrummaging, not like a New Zealand side that relies on bigger props."
Jones claims that before rugby turned professional, Japan was one of the world's most inventive teams: "I played against Japan schoolboys in 1978 and they were using two-man lineouts and quick channels into the scrum - no one else did that. Since then, rugby here has become so orthodox."
After the under-20 side lost 120-0 to Wales this year, Jones assembled some of the leading coaches and high performance people in the country to seek explanations. One of the more unusual offered was that Japan rugby retains a 'rice farmers' mentality.
"Fifty years ago, half the nation were rice farmers," explains Jones. "There was one guy in charge of a village and everyone had to do what he said and follow orders. If you didn't, you were kicked out. But I don't buy that now and our players can definitely think for themselves."

The elephant in the room remains the lack of, uh, elephants in Japanese rugby. Japan remains one of the smaller teams in world rugby.

Jones has employed an ex-UFC fighter to teach them about being quicker in contact, which he says gives someone a good chance despite being 10kg lighter.
With former Brumbies and Wallabies trainer John Pryor on board, he also hopes to make his team the fittest in the game.
"Against Georgia recently, we gave them 80-90kg in the forwards," says Jones. "The first 30 minutes, we got physically hammered but we came back from that and won the game in the last minute."
Jones regularly pays tribute to the work of Kirwan, who he says raised Japan to a new level. But his approach to foreign players is markedly different.
"I've cut out half the foreigners," says Jones. "We'll have two or three on the field and within the 30 have five or six - but they need to be part of the cohesive team. I think there were probably too many foreigners in the past and it really affected the way that they played. They played very traditionally, in an orthodox sense, and we can't win like that."
It is a brave stance by Jones. Football minnows Qatar, who are hosting the Fifa World Cup in 2022, long ago recognised their shortcomings on the field and are naturalising as many Brazilians and Africans as they can now, so that in a decade at home they will be competitive.
For now, after a difficult start (Japan lost all three matches at the 2012 Pacific Nations Cup and both home matches against the French Barbarians), Jones was basking in the afterglow of Japan's successes on the recent European tour, where they toppled Georgia (18th) and Romania (15th) for their first wins in Europe after 26 consecutive losses.
Their last tour there - in 2004 - was a dismal failure, with a 100-8 loss to Wales and a 98-0 thrashing by Scotland. Jones wants to visit more often, as part of a deliberate strategy to get used to playing in Europe ahead of 2015.
They also hope to engage more quality opposition on a regular basis; giant banners already hang outside the national stadium promoting next June's visit by Wales.
"I'm trying to 'Japanese' Japanese rugby but do it through world class principles," says Jones. "Results will be up and down but by 2015, we will have a good team. I'll finish in 2015 and want to leave a team that is respected around the world for the way we play."Michael Burgess travelled to Japan with the assistance of the Asia New Zealand Foundation.
 

Dan54

David Wilson (68)
Crock of sheep shit - RD this year has had this idea to kick over "what's in front", or this idea to have a centre crash it up - McCabe comes to mind - and even if the D does get bent why not kick it next phase.
I know Dave, but I think you will agree when he first came in his idea seemed to be play what's in front of you, I honestly believe a lot of players had been coached under Eddie style structures for so long, (and I have said other times not a lot of real thinkers in team) that it was quite foreign to the team. I also think he should of perhaps stuck with the plan, but think he maybe bottled it and went for a more conservative plan to cut losses. I also really doubt he has told them to kick as much as they do, especially when they bend defensive line, perhaps my thinking players comment comes into a bit.
I actually think Eddies idea with Japan may work well with them , as they seem to play better when they do play to a plan.
 

en_force_er

Geoff Shaw (53)
They're looking alright Japan.

They should get Fardy on the phone and there team would be looking even more fierce, I know they've got a mainly locals policy but in reality there can't be too many 195cm+ ethnically Japanese people who are Japanese qualified.
 

Dave Beat

Paul McLean (56)
I also really doubt he has told them to kick as much as they do, especially when they bend defensive line, perhaps my thinking players comment comes into a bit.
I actually think Eddies idea with Japan may work well with them , as they seem to play better when they do play to a plan.
Dan, "I also really doubt he has told them to kick as much as they do" So we have players calling it toxic under his tenure, now we have players not sticking to the game plan as they are kicking it to much.
This year was terrible, I think I recall alot of his side kicks were also changed at the start of the year?
I would like to see a change, he has held the position for too long.
 

Dan54

David Wilson (68)
No arguments from me Dave, I was more bringing up the RD thing to say what I though perhaps was a weakness with Eddie's style of coaching ie; players perhaps lose their ability to change game plan or think on their feet. I certainly not saying RD better coach, or even he should hold job.
 

Dave Beat

Paul McLean (56)
Dan sat on the fence for a long time giving Robbie the benifit of the doubt, this year was horrid.
Tah's fell into the same bucket.

Number of threads in the bellow.

Aussies are generally very critical rather than supportive / constructive in there feedback, more through the media though, I think the ARU should employ someone to capture the thoughts and ideas of GAGR and use some and throw some in the bin.

I thought things started going backwards when we had the front rowers club coaching - Eddie, McBain, Nucifora, Link and (I'm sure there was one other all head coaching at the same time) - that being said I think Link should be our next coach.

A coach - a coach does not have to have been a great player, Alan Jones, and Rod McQueen are both examples of excellent different people managers who took the game to another level on and also off the field.

A coach can gel a good team into a great team, I think the playing talent is better now than when McQueen coached - I will take that back a step. McQueen created a team at the Brumbies from other states rejects, the players that other states did not want. He then "bonded them" a very key ingediant at the inner core - and then the ball started rolling the snow and supporters started sticking (Link did the same with the Reds).

NSW & Cheika - I didn't want Cheika to come in, I didnt / hadnt paid enough attention to his work off shore, since he's come in there haven't been alot of bold promises, most of the reading and hearing is about their old fassioned hard work and team bonding - bonding them - I like that.
I hope at the selection table it starts with a blank sheet of paper, and starts with;
  • Rugby Brand - type of rugby to be played.
  • A team is picked not on how many previous caps a player has, but on players in their position to suite that brand.
  • Players out of position - do not pick players out of position!!!!!! (interesting though Larkham started at half back, then fullback, then went on to be one of out best 5/8th).
  • Hooper V Pockock, Hooper showed class under Deans defensive game plan, under an attacking positive game plan I think even more of his strengths will shine through and we will see more of him. Pockock is excellent defensively but I never really see alot of his attacking qualities - the way George Smith linked in.
I've been told and want to read it for myself McCaw didnt rate Deans?

3T - don't start club comps in April, move them forward so a 3T (Zone type rep or Top Club side depending on economics) type comp can evolve at the back end of the season.
If the ABL (Australian Baseball League) can start, and get good exposure on Foxtel instead of saying Rugby can't ask how have they done it? Rugby is one of the foundations of Australian Sport - Baseball is not.
Rugby is International - AFL is not, AFL (A = Australian) has Auskick going through and promoting the game through all the schools what is that ARU (A = Australian) doing? On this in use to be V for Victorian but they have grown.
Alot of growth ideas on the forum, all models for growth cost, some ideas cost more than others - I like keep it simple NSWRU only to start with - SS starts in Feb / Mar, then a 6 team Rep comp made up of Nth Hbr / Sth Hbr / Western Sydney / NSW Country / ACT rep / Central Coast rep.

Happy new year
 

BPC

Phil Hardcastle (33)
Here's an interesting article from the SMH a couple of months ago.
Japan rugby stuck in 1950s, says Eddie Jones

So Eddie's plan is to bring Japan up to date by emulating the Brumbies/Wallabies playbook from the late 90's and early 00's?

Why not play to the Japanese strengths by building cyborgs?
 

MajorlyRagerly

Trevor Allan (34)
What an awful nickname. The Brave Blossoms. Whenever a sports team is referred to as brave, it always means tried hard but lost. Which also sums up Japan rugby - but they shouldn't be known as this, that's just demeaning and horrible.

Japan to (b)eat W(h)ales... umm, I don't think so.
 

Braveheart81

Will Genia (78)
Staff member
They should just go back to being the Cherry Blossoms. At least that's what the emblem is (sakura in Japanese).

I agree that Brave Blossoms sounds stupid and patronising.
 

p.Tah

John Thornett (49)
Perhaps the impact of Brave Blossoms is lost in translation. It may have a stronger/better meaning in Japanese.
 
T

TOCC

Guest
currently watch a bit on tv about the junior sumo wrestling championships in Tokyo... Eddie needs to be shopping there
 

en_force_er

Geoff Shaw (53)
currently watch a bit on tv about the junior sumo wrestling championships in Tokyo. Eddie needs to be shopping there

Their scrum is actually usually pretty solid, it's not their issue.

Impact running and ruck security are.
 

SuperGrover

Darby Loudon (17)
It looks like we'll get to see more of Eddie's attempts to innovate in an expanded Pacific Nations Cup.

USA & Canada join Pacific Nations Cup

The International Rugby Board has announced an exciting shake-up of the IRB Pacific Nations Cup with an expanded schedule and inclusion of new teams confirmed for 2013.

Underscoring its long-term commitment to boosting the Tier Two competition schedule and competitiveness of the international game, the IRB has confirmed that Canada and USA will join the IRB-funded tournament on a permanent basis, joining Fiji, Japan and Tonga in the 2013 competition.

Reigning champions Samoa take a sabbatical from the tournament in 2013 to play in a quadrangular competition in South Africa in June against the Springboks, Scotland and Italy, having earned their spot as the highest-ranked Tier Two Union in 2012.

The new-look competition, will be played between May 25 and June 23 and will see matches hosted in Canada, Fiji, Japan and USA.

Japan will host the finale with double-headers on the final two match days as excitement continues to build ahead of the nation's hosting of Rugby World Cup 2019.

The announcement follows an unprecedented November 2012 competition schedule for Tier Two Unions, which saw 15 nations in action, the introduction of the IRB International Rugby Series and notable performances from Samoa, Tonga and Japan in Europe.

This exciting enhancement to the IRB Pacific Nations Cup is good news for Japan, Canada, USA and the Pacific Islands. We now have in place an annual high-calibre competition that will deliver compelling matches, while also fulfilling the high performance needs of our Unions. I am sure it will capture hearts and minds in the Pacific Islands and North America." said IRB Chairman Bernard Lapasset.

IRB Head of Development and Performance Mark Egan said the the global body was investing more than £10 million per annum in tournaments and high performance programmes for our targeted group of Strategic Initiative Unions.

"The inclusion of Canada and USA in a new-look IRB Pacific Nations Cup is a key outcome of continued consultation with our Unions to deliver a schedule that suits their high performance programmes. It also provides an opportunity to benchmark performances two years out from Rugby World Cup 2015 in England," added Egan.

USA Rugby Chief Executive Nigel Melville said: "USA Rugby is delighted to be given the opportunity to compete in the IRB Pacific Nations Cup. It has been a pleasure working with all the participating Unions and we are now looking forward to playing against them on the field. The new look PNC (Pacific Nations Cup) will provide the Eagles with consistent fixtures against some very competitive teams, this can only be good news for the Eagles as we plan our path to Rugby World Cup 2015 in England."

Canada Rugby Chief Executive Graham Brown added: "This is a fantastic opportunity for Canada to play quality matches to help us build our high performance programme. We are grateful to the IRB for their support of this initiative and excited about hosting a number of games in Canada in 2013."

For Japan, hosting the climax to the 2013 competition alongside two inbound Tests against Wales represents a further boost for the profile of Rugby as the nation prepares to host Asia's first Rugby World Cup.

Japan head coach Eddie Jones said: "The IRB Pacific Nations Cup is a wonderful opportunity for Japan and all participating Unions to elevate their performances to a higher level in order that we can be more competitive at future Rugby World Cups.

"Combined with playing two Tests against Wales in June, the PNC (Pacific Nations Cup) provides us with a strong competition calendar. The physical nature of Canada and USA plus the Pacific flair of Fiji and Tonga will make for a compelling tournament and we are very excited to be participating."

IRB Pacific Nations Cup 2013 fixtures:

Saturday, May 25
Japan v Tonga
Canada v USA

Saturday, June 1
Fiji v Japan

Wednesday, June 5
Fiji v Canada (in Canada)

Saturday, June 8
Canada v Tonga

Saturday, June 15
USA v Tonga

Wednesday, June 19
Japan v Canada (in Japan)
Fiji v USA (in Japan)

Sunday, June 23
Japan v USA (in Japan)
Tonga v Fiji (in Japan)

http://planetrugby.com/story/0,25883,16024_8425572,00.html
 
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