Eddie Jones is at it again

[qwerty51]

Take the Reds losses in SA away and it look totally different, in fact the SA teams broke the Reds in SA.

SA teams are busy setting records in tour wins.

I don't understand.

The facts are the Lions and Cheetahs are yet to notch up a win against the Bulls, Stormers and Sharks. The Sharks are yet to beat the Stormers or Bulls.

The Force have beaten the Tahs and Reds. The Rebels have beaten the Force. The Brumbies have beaten the Force.

So actually the Australia conference is much more competitive than the SA one, if anything we have reason to complain that the top SA teams get easy rides in the conference system.

 

[Cave Dweller]

I don't understand.

The facts are the Lions and Cheetahs are yet to notch up a win against the Bulls, Stormers and Sharks. The Sharks are yet to beat the Stormers or Bulls.

The Force have beaten the Tahs and Reds. The Rebels have beaten the Force. The Brumbies have beaten the Force.

So actually the Australia conference is much more competitive than the SA one, if anything we have reason to complain that the top SA teams get easy rides in the conference system.

Yet the Sharks have beat the Brumbies, The Bulls have beat the Reds as well as the Sharks has beat them.

Plus

 

[qwerty51]

CD, you've joined late in this discussion but out of conference games are irrelevant.

 

[Bruce Ross]

I'm aware that Hux came from the Brumbies, to the Reds and back to the Brumbies. However, Rod and Weeks started their Super Rugby careers at franchises before the Reds?

Rodney Blake played for West Harbour Juniors and West Harbour after moving to Australia from Tonga at the age of 13 and attended Homebush Boys High in Sydney. He had already played for Australian schools and Australian Under 21s before playing for Sunnybank in 2004.

Laurie Weeks attended St Joseph's College in Sydney then played Colts and Grade for Sydney Uni before joining the Reds. It was in fact his determination to continue playing for Sydney Uni that was a main reason for him signing for the Rebels. This was after he had been forced to play for Uni of Queensland the previous year.
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[Train Without a Station]

So they both started their Super Rugby careers with the Reds. That's what I was getting at.

A bit off topic, I was under the impression that Weeks' connection with Rebels coach Hill was a pretty significant factor in his signing. Lucky it wasn't the Brumbies he went to. That playing for Uni would have been knocked on the head pretty quick this year by Jake White.

 

[Bruce Ross]

A bit off topic, I was under the impression that Weeks' connection with Rebels coach Hill was a pretty significant factor in his signing. Lucky it wasn't the Brumbies he went to. That playing for Uni would have been knocked on the head pretty quick this year by Jake White.

As you'd appreciate, TWaS, the reality now is that the extension of the Super season has "knocked on the head" any real chance of professional players appearing for their home clubs. White's edict is basically an empty gesture other than for fringe contracted players and those desperate enough to involve themselves with the franchise without any recompense.
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[tigerland12]

Anyone else read Eddies section in the Courier Mail today. Apparently a Wallabies team picked on form would include 90% of the Brumbies and 10% Waratahs. He's a joke

 

[RedsHappy]

Of course the biggest thing standing in the way of our Rugby Union ability is Rugby League.

Once someone invents a time machine and we can go back in time and stop rugby league from ever happening, we will be easily the best side in the world.

Yes indeedee, but the introverted, narrow-minded elitism that permitted - and encouraged - that schism, still, in the silent shadows and at the edges, haunts the modern Australian rugby system today.

 

[RedsHappy]

Eddie is right that we have the weakest conference and that in the short term the five teams hurts us. However, if you take a longer view, this will be good for the game in Australia. Ours is a competitive marketplace and having enough presence outside of the traditional places where rugby is played is key to growing the game in my view. Out here in the West, there has never been more interest in rugby than there is right now.

It could have been different though. League has been knocking on the door here and trying to claw back some ground they lost when Super League blew the game apart. Without the Force, that job would have been a lot easier for them. With the amount of Saffer and Kiwi expats who have been flooding Perth, tapping into that market has been good for the game here. The last game against the Chiefs had nary a spare seat.

So on the playing front it doesn't look great right now, but that will turn around eventually and as others have said, we have a bunch of young blokes (and a few older ones) who have the opportunity to play top line footy that that surely wouldn't have been the case with only three franchises.

TBH, there's much merit in what you say, but we have to supplement this analysis IMO with the observation that, strategically speaking, there is no point creating a variegated set of franchises all over Australia if you don't also create an integrated and competent overall code and particular franchise management capability to (a) make the whole machine commercially and financially viable and (b) enough of a winning-of-games-and-trophies system that the fan base builds in numbers and enduring loyalty. Bags of franchise expansion without strategic management quality is a recipe for danger and decline.

 

[RedsHappy]

With all due respect, the magement at the reds didn't win the title, the force probably did. I believe Eddie jones point "Jones says teams that are doing well - like the Stormers and the Highlanders - have a good work ethic and "high team cohesion" represent what the reds had due to there team being together for so many years. In reality if they hadn't lost a core group of players would they have stuck by quade for so many years? Probably not.

Eddie jones made alot of really valid points. He isn't rambling or talking out if order and to try to press this issue that the reds out thought people and sat down in 2009 and planned what happened is crap. QLD management deserve credit for the rebranding and capitalization of the teams performance, but not or the team itself, John Mitchell and the inept previous management deserve just as much credit for that

WJ, I must have heard over 100 various explanations as to why the Reds' team success built in 2010 and then broke through in 2011, but yours that this had nothing to do with the new management troika there from late 2009 but was instead principally due to the Force's poaching of earlier years etc., is perhaps the most extraordinary and could well win some kind of prize.

 

[PaarlBok]

I don't understand.

The facts are the Lions and Cheetahs are yet to notch up a win against the Bulls, Stormers and Sharks. The Sharks are yet to beat the Stormers or Bulls.

The Force have beaten the Tahs and Reds. The Rebels have beaten the Force. The Brumbies have beaten the Force.

So actually the Australia conference is much more competitive than the SA one, if anything we have reason to complain that the top SA teams get easy rides in the conference system.

You sure dont understand SA derbies. Sharks have played both away and Stormers had a nice Newlands run. SA home matches always go with good attendences. The reason why the Bulls and Stormers dont lose that easy at home because there is always 40,000 supporters with these derbies. Your empty stadia dont help your home teams at all.