Disco's Wallabies player ratings Bledisloe 1

[Richo]

Barnes didn't have a good passing game last night but normally his short passing is good, even of his long balls aren't. He got a lot of bad balls from Genia, especially early, which put him on the back foot and no runners we're hitting the line at pace.

 

[liquor box]

I can't see how anyone was disappointed with A Finger.
We all knew before the game he had one KPI: stop/limit SBW.
He did a pretty good job I thought.
No one has ever accused him of being of being a threat with the ball in his hands.
Same as Horne, in what scenario was he ever going to be in a position with the ball in his hands with a teeny bit of time or space?

Quade makes Anthony look a lot better in attack (and anyone else he plays with) due to his great long ball passing, he can overlook Anthony's lack of attack by cutting him out with a face ball to the winger or others outside him (Higgers!) and use him as a hard straight running decoy, until later in the game when the opponant notices he is not getting the ball and adjusts, then the ball goes to him and he is open.
I am not convinced that QC (Quade Cooper) and KB (Kurtley Beale) will work in the same team especially against the Darkness, I think against the All Balcks I would rather AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) at 15 as I feel he is safer in defence and select Quade at 10

 

[Scott Allen]

Barnes didn't have a good passing game last night but normally his short passing is good, even of his long balls aren't. He got a lot of bad balls from Genia, especially early, which put him on the back foot and no runners we're hitting the line at pace.

Richo

Genia threw 27 passes to Barnes (11 in 1st half and 16 in 2nd) - only 1 wasn't a good pass - at 76:27 when Mealamu came through offside to tackle Genia as he passed which earned the Wallabies a penalty.

Genia threw 79 passes in the game (including those to Barnes). I rated 4 poor (5%), 1 average (1%) and 74 (94%) good.

 

[Scotty]

The only way our forwards can consistently get over the ad line is by running in close and in numbers. Genia invariably picks out the right one and his passing is outstanding. This is how a lightweight reds pack manages to get a roll on and when it happened a few times last night we looked good.

Everything else from our forwards in attack was too wide and too slow. I want fast and tight - leave the wider space to the backs.

 

[Richo]

Richo

Genia threw 27 passes to Barnes (11 in 1st half and 16 in 2nd) - only 1 wasn't a good pass - at 76:27 when Mealamu came through offside to tackle Genia as he passed which earned the Wallabies a penalty.

Genia threw 79 passes in the game (including those to Barnes). I rated 4 poor (5%), 1 average (1%) and 74 (94%) good.

Scott, I certainly have not done that much home work so I won't argue with your numbers. I do, however, recall one in particular inside the 22 in the first 20 mins that was high and wide, preventing Barnes from making a clearing kick. Thought that was Genia. Don't have Fox, otherwise I'd check. Could have been someone else.

Even if I'm wrong about some poor passes, I don't think Genia had a good game and we simply have no chance to beat the ABs if he doesn't play out of his skin. Unfair, I know, but it is what it is.

 

[Scott Allen]

Richo

Genia was really good through the whole game.

Here are the game times for the passes to Barnes in the first half, which one was the problem?

2:41
2:53
4:24
16:00
16:27
20:13
24:56
35:21
35:36
37:56
38:09

The two inside the 22 you might like to examine are at 16:00 where Genia hit Barnes perfectly but Kieran Read got through to put pressure on Barnes who threw a wild long pass to Horne and then at 16: 27 when Genia hit Barnes perfectly and Barnes threw a shocker behind Beale.

The passes from Barnes to his outside men were the issue, not the pass from Genia.

 

[Richo]

Scott,

As I said, I don't have Fox and thus don't have access to a replay. It was the Beale one, but i may not have remembered the pass correctly -- thought it was high and outside Barnes. Appreciate the effort in your correction though and am content to drop my comment that Genia didn't pass well in the game.

Still, to my mind, Genia did not have a good game. His quick tap decision was poor, as was his speed at the base of the ruck. But probably on the latter you'll tell me it was all the forwards fault for not realigning fast enough, or Barnes for not organizing the backs. Fair enough. My feeling is that those responsibilities are to be shared and that Genia needed to take what was available more quickly rather than wait for everyone to get organized.

As I said, it's not like he was shithouse. Just didn't have a good game by his standard, even if he passed pretty well.

 

[p.Tah]

IIRC the issue with Genia's passing last night wasn't where he passed it to but rather the amount of time he took to pass it from the back of the ruck. He waited until everyone was in position before he passed. The ABs defense had plenty of time to realign and then they rushed and put enormous pressure on Barnes and the other backs or they caught the forwards who were punching it up well behind the gain line. This meant that at nearly every ruck our forwards had to run backwards to enter the ruck to clean out, hence why we got pinged for not releasing or Genia repeated the slow service at the next breakdown. This isnt entirely Genia's fault. It's a direct result of the forwards being dominated, but I wish Genia would speed up his delivery from the back of the ruck. You can't always wait for everyone to be perfectly positioned.

The ABs on the other hand, rarely left the ball at the back of the ruck to allow our defense to align. Their ball was quick, we weren't in position and that's why they scored or made the breaks.

 

[Scott Allen]

Seriously guys, you need to watch a replay! Genia is either waiting for forwards to realign or Barnes to waive his arms around telling players where to go.

Of the 79 passes Genia threw in the game, only one was slowed down by him when players were in position and don't get me wrong, he shouldn't have slowed that down. The Wallabies need quick ball if they are to complete.

 

[Richo]

Seriously guys, you need to watch a replay!

...snip...

The Wallabies need quick ball if they are to complete.

Won't disagree with you there.

 

[p.Tah]

Seriously guys, you need to watch a replay! Genia is either waiting for forwards to realign or Barnes to waive his arms around telling players where to go.

Seriously Scott, I have twice! Hence why I said 'he waited until everyone was in position before he passed...I wish Genia would speed up his delivery from the back of the ruck. You can't always wait for everyone to be perfectly positioned'.

It's a catch 22 (so to speak). At the break down the ball is slow to get to Genia. The next phase doesn't get over the gain line. The forwards need to run back to go through the gate or align in the back line etc. Waiting for everyone to align and 'start' again wasn't working because the ABs were quick off the mark, we kept getting the same result. I wished Genia sent the ball out quicker, even if everything wasn't perfect, more often on Saturday night.

 

[liquor box]

I think Genia gives great ball, but has anyone noticed if Barnes stands closer to Genia than QC (Quade Cooper) does? One think that helps the Reds is that QC (Quade Cooper) stands quite wide, this allows Genia to throw a longer ball and to QC (Quade Cooper) and then he can also throw a long ball that allows for 30m+ width in two passes. The main benefit is that it also means that there is a bigger hole for Genia to snipe through.

I realise that Genia does need to wait for his team to be ready, but it is frustrating to watch him stand there waiting. Is there no chance for "playing what is in front of you) and have KB (Kurtley Beale) come up from 15 to take a quick ball and make the defence think? It is getting a really one dimensional look to it.

 

[What2040]

Disco, our forwards have needed to do your second point for ages. They almost never do. It is a glaring difference to the ABs. If they did that, even Barnes would look more threatening in attack.

But those 2 tries by ABs came off set pieces - our defence out wide was shit - our attack just as bad

 

[cyclopath]

But those 2 tries by ABs came off set pieces - our defence out wide was shit - our attack just as bad

I agree with your conclusions, but I am at a loss as to what they have to do with the quoted post of mine?

 

[Ruggo]

Barnes didn't have a good passing game last night but normally his short passing is good, even of his long balls aren't. He got a lot of bad balls from Genia, especially early, which put him on the back foot and no runners we're hitting the line at pace.

Barnes really needs to take the ball to the line. He is very timid in this aspect of the game. This is a big problem for the runners. I don't know if it is a confidence issue or what but NZ played him like a fiddle. Our 10 needs to play close to the line and that will bring our runners into the game, with less time and space for the opposition.

 

[Scotty]

Seriously guys, you need to watch a replay! Genia is either waiting for forwards to realign or Barnes to waive his arms around telling players where to go.

Of the 79 passes Genia threw in the game, only one was slowed down by him when players were in position and don't get me wrong, he shouldn't have slowed that down. The Wallabies need quick ball if they are to complete.

And when they get slow ball, and use the 3 pod that you have highlighted, try and play the damn thing a little closer to the ad line. The stand so damn deep that there almost no chance of them getting over the ad line.

With three forwards to pass to, running the play a little closer will give the defense a harder job to choose who is going to get the pill, and therefore less chance a big gang tackle on the guy that does.

 

[Scotty]

I think Genia gives great ball, but has anyone noticed if Barnes stands closer to Genia than QC (Quade Cooper) does? One think that helps the Reds is that QC (Quade Cooper) stands quite wide, this allows Genia to throw a longer ball and to QC (Quade Cooper) and then he can also throw a long ball that allows for 30m+ width in two passes. The main benefit is that it also means that there is a bigger hole for Genia to snipe through.

I realise that Genia does need to wait for his team to be ready, but it is frustrating to watch him stand there waiting. Is there no chance for "playing what is in front of you) and have KB (Kurtley Beale) come up from 15 to take a quick ball and make the defence think? It is getting a really one dimensional look to it.

I think they stand the same distance away, it is just the QC (Quade Cooper) stands more shallow, but further across the field, while Barnes stands deeper but not as far across. Barnes does not seem to have the ability to play the ball close to the line - probably a lot to do with his pass being a fair bit slower than Cooper's.

I hope that Genia and Cooper are the playmakers this weekend, and they take control of our attack - no matter what the coach says!

 

[Bullrush]

Typical Marto bullshit. Horne and Fainga'a tackled well, a core duty, but brought little else, which we all kind of knew beforehand. We need something more, but I am not sure where we will get it at the moment. Tapuai needs fast-tracking.

When I first joined this forum a few years ago, a lot of the guys here were saying the exact same thing about Horne. I questioned then, 'Who is Rob Horne?'. I remember reading posts that basically said once Horne comes back, the mid-field will be fixed.....this is no exaggeration at all.

I've said this before but Aussie fans really need to just let guys play and see how they actually perform first before thinking that they are the player to fix whatever problem/position the Wallabies have. How many Tests has Taps played?? I'm not saying he won't be good but geez.....can you just let him actually play first?

 

[cyclopath]

When I first joined this forum a few years ago, a lot of the guys here were saying the exact same thing about Horne. I questioned then, 'Who is Rob Horne?'. I remember reading posts that basically said once Horne comes back, the mid-field will be fixed...this is no exaggeration at all.

I've said this before but Aussie fans really need to just let guys play and see how they actually perform first before thinking that they are the player to fix whatever problem/position the Wallabies have. How many Tests has Taps played?? I'm not saying he won't be good but geez...can you just let him actually play first?

Yeah, I don't mean chucking him straight into the Test team, having just been injured. As I have posted quite a few times, he looks the most likely to step up, from what I've seen of him. Horne looked promising a few years back, then was basically injured, and has not come on as much as I thought, and others thought too.
Fast-tracking was a poor choice of words on my part, I admit. He too nees to have some injury free time.

 

[Scotty]

When I first joined this forum a few years ago, a lot of the guys here were saying the exact same thing about Horne. I questioned then, 'Who is Rob Horne?'. I remember reading posts that basically said once Horne comes back, the mid-field will be fixed...this is no exaggeration at all.

I've said this before but Aussie fans really need to just let guys play and see how they actually perform first before thinking that they are the player to fix whatever problem/position the Wallabies have. How many Tests has Taps played?? I'm not saying he won't be good but geez...can you just let him actually play first?

I think you might be referring to Tahs fans in reference to Horne. I personally have never seen anything to justify the hype (many were talking about him as the 'next great wallaby centre').

Now Taps on the other hand .........