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CAS Rugby 2016

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CatchnPass

Vay Wilson (31)
I reckon the boys playing the footy don't give a rats as to the coaching/skiing/so soshal circles - they are all trying their best to play as well as they can and become good young men. Ski, surf, socialise as and where you want, they don't give a shite - it's all left out on the pitch for them.
 

BRUMBIEJACK

Larry Dwyer (12)
I reckon the boys playing the footy don't give a rats as to the coaching/skiing/so soshal circles - they are all trying their best to play as well as they can and become good young men. Ski, surf, socialise as and where you want, they don't give a shite - it's all left out on the pitch for them.

To a degree. The game is the game & u play as you are coached & resourced. This is nothing about the players for the aforementioned reason. My point is the broader one of pitting professionally coached teams with large cohorts to draw from being matched against teacher/coaches drawing from smaller cohorts & expecting us to compare like with like. All schools could choose to select their players, then allocate a teacher-coach and let the lest team win. Some still do, Knox don't. So in some respects the competition is part redundant as soon as one school decides to professionalise. That's fine but don't expect everyone else to let it slide without comment as to the point of it. The Knox coach will likely go back on Monday to the video analysis & plan next week's match, while the Waverley & other coaches will go back to lesson plans and the banality of their real profession.
My comment re the advert for the Thredbo ski trip in the luxurious senior school centre is nothing about having a chip, but more about the unreality of these privileged lives and the apparent unwillingness of such schools to place an emphasis on service to others. But that's for a different thread. Let the Knox rolling maul dominate the CAS season. Good for the school and great for Australian schoolboy rugby. And it will definitely bring the crowds back if the sell-out at Warrawee (also being facetious here) is any indication. Still, it will guarantee the rugby coach the next year's contract (which is the real measure of success). Where's the apres ski by the way ? It wasn't mentioned on the advert.
 

Snort

Nev Cottrell (35)
I don't mind the professional coach. I mean, you don't want maths taught by someone without a maths degree. The mismatch of resources and player numbers is a problem but one we won't resolve as long as schools remain in their traditional associations.
 
R

Runpasstackle

Guest
To a degree. The game is the game & u play as you are coached & resourced. This is nothing about the players for the aforementioned reason. My point is the broader one of pitting professionally coached teams with large cohorts to draw from being matched against teacher/coaches drawing from smaller cohorts & expecting us to compare like with like. All schools could choose to select their players, then allocate a teacher-coach and let the lest team win. Some still do, Knox don't. So in some respects the competition is part redundant as soon as one school decides to professionalise. That's fine but don't expect everyone else to let it slide without comment as to the point of it. The Knox coach will likely go back on Monday to the video analysis & plan next week's match, while the Waverley & other coaches will go back to lesson plans and the banality of their real profession.
My comment re the advert for the Thredbo ski trip in the luxurious senior school centre is nothing about having a chip, but more about the unreality of these privileged lives and the apparent unwillingness of such schools to place an emphasis on service to others. But that's for a different thread. Let the Knox rolling maul dominate the CAS season. Good for the school and great for Australian schoolboy rugby. And it will definitely bring the crowds back if the sell-out at Warrawee (also being facetious here) is any indication. Still, it will guarantee the rugby coach the next year's contract (which is the real measure of success). Where's the apres ski by the way ? It wasn't mentioned on the advert.

Waves got pumped by 45 points by a team taught by a full time school teacher. Accept the lose and move on.
 

Wayne McLean

Peter Burge (5)
I have to agree. If you are a professional coach you are passionate and believe in a game played beautifully to inspire and excite young men to play the running game! The fact is Waverley played all the exciting rugby! They electrified the match and comp with a beautiful 20 min passage of play ! Unfortunately not having their captain DrewMorris definitely had a material effect in the outcome.Knox bombed tries but Waves attack and defence was ferocious! They are an essential part of the education for North boys who will
have stingers tomorrow from head to toe. Great game to watch! For mine the 13 & 12 & 1 & 8 from Waves and 9 & Mohi were awesome. But Knox had that lineout, some good collision work from 4 and 5, 8 - 7 finished well with a big game and 1 and 13 as an individual is good ( but not as sharp as previous years ) but 15 who is ridiculously talented and bombed a try with a one hander was very classy and could go pro ! Ironic that his speed provides time and space when he was so reluctant to work on it. The 204cm Frost will be a Wallaby in time.Running and passing skills whilst not perfect are better than most in this position and with consistent training his career in the short term is assured!
 

oldandslow

Herbert Moran (7)
Aloys v TGS - short & uncomprehensive report

Aloys hosted Trinity on a perfect day for rugby. Overcast, cool but not cold and nary a breath of wind.

Aloys scored early, with their skipper Matthew Dainton (10) selling the dummy and going through a huge gap to score under the posts. Following a scuffle after the try, both the open side flankers received red cards.

Despite each team being reduced to 14 players, it remained a tight affair. Trinity looked well on top, with better drive through the forwards and, in contrast to rounds 1 and 2, more preparedness to throw it wide and involve their backline, but tenacious Aloys defence and simple handling errors robbed momentum. However, eventually the wight of possession overcame Aloys and Joshua Weston (11) held onto a pass that was behind him and over his head and went over out wide.

7-5 to Aloys at half-time.

Despite the low score, Trinity looked the better side and likely to run over Aloys and that happened in the second half, as the dominant forward pack made meters and Aloys were incapable of containing a Trinity back line enjoying fast ball, with Trinity running in seven second half tries.

Jordan Morris (12) ran riot, scoring himself and setting up an outstanding try for Byron Hollingworth-Dessent (14), after Morris broke from inside his 22, stormed up over halfway and then grubber kicked for his winger, who has winged feet.

Trinity's hard running and tackling prop, James Wayland (1) had a huge work rate in attack and defense, making excellent meters with every carry and scored two tries himself, before being rewarded with an early shower once the game was in the bag. Impressively, Wayland showcased another dimension to his game, being an astute passing game. Several times Wayland took the ball to the line and found an outside or inside runner, often Liam Rasch (6) or Sipu Titavake (8), who are themselves excellent ball runners.

Ryan Longville (15) was also un-containable, his improbable footwork routinely bamboozling would be defenders, so that his kick returns put Trinity back on front-foot attack.

Aloys were plucky in the first half, but they came up against a Trinity team that for the first time this season put all the pieces together. Their powerful ball runners worked as a team, with passes and pop balls rather than just one out running, the halves moved the ball wide quickly and with purpose and that gave the very fast back line room to move.

For Waverley, Dainton (10) was always a threat (although he was injured and went off during the second half), and Todd Gillman (2) deserves enormous credit. Despite a scrum that was always being backwards, he nevertheless continued to cleanly strike and deliver the ball back quickly. Those who've been there will understand what bravery and commitmentthat takes when your scrum is being pushed backwards.

For Trinity, it was the usual suspects. Wayland (1) was devastating with ball in hand and also revealed an ability to pick out runner before contact, as well as to offload in the tackle, Morris (12) made plenty of line breaks and was hard in defense, Rasch (6) and Tuitavake (8) were a powerful presence and Longville (15) is consistently one of the best players on the paddock.

It was good to see Trinity click in the second half. Had they performed like that last week, holding the ball and letting their backline have it more often, they would have given Waverley a run for their money.

Next week will be a big game, with Trinity hosting the Knox juggernaut, which will be an entirely different challenge. Trinity will be keen to build on this performance, which was outstanding in the second half, but will know they still need to eliminate the handling errors that held them back in the first half. They have a platform to go forward from, but will know that they might come back to reality quickly against the consistent, disciplined and skillful Knox team.
 

Snort

Nev Cottrell (35)
I wasn't at Knox v Waverley, but surely the only appropriate reaction to that game is to congratulate both sides for putting on a great contest? History lesson: when I was at school Waverley won most sports (except swimming) more often than not - especially Rugby, cricket and athletics. Why? Well, under Brother Murphy's watch, it's approach and attitude was more "professional" than the other schools. It was often whispered that this involved more than one visit to the dark side but in the end, so what? Because you had the challenge of beating them and it was deeply satisfying when you did. I don't remember saying, when we lost, "we lost, but we're better than them because we don't import" (or whatever - fill in your bleat of choice). My point? If you're around long enough you get to see it all come around again. I've seen Waverley dominant. I've seen Knox pumped 12-73 by Trinity, just five years ago. Really you have two choices - you can enjoy the Rugby in front of you, or whinge. What no-one gets to do is impose their own school's priorities on every other school.
 

lenny

Stan Wickham (3)
I wasn't at Knox v Waverley, but surely the only appropriate reaction to that game is to congratulate both sides for putting on a great contest? History lesson: when I was at school Waverley won most sports (except swimming) more often than not - especially Rugby, cricket and athletics. Why? Well, under Brother Murphy's watch, it's approach and attitude was more "professional" than the other schools. It was often whispered that this involved more than one visit to the dark side but in the end, so what? Because you had the challenge of beating them and it was deeply satisfying when you did. I don't remember saying, when we lost, "we lost, but we're better than them because we don't import" (or whatever - fill in your bleat of choice). My point? If you're around long enough you get to see it all come around again. I've seen Waverley dominant. I've seen Knox pumped 12-73 by Trinity, just five years ago. Really you have two choices - you can enjoy the Rugby in front of you, or whinge. What no-one gets to do is impose their own school's priorities on every other school.


Couldn't agree more with the sentiment about congratulating both teams. Waverley on a magnificent first half and Knox for the second half comeback. Who would I pay money to watch is a no brainer. Free running backs, big hits and a desire to move the ball wide and create opportunities...Waverley. No doubt the Knox rolling maul with big forwards is effective and can suck the life out of a game but that Northern hemisphere style of rugby can work, so well done to Knox they play to their strengths and that's not to say they didn't move the ball wider on the odd occasion. On a bigger stage that rugby has limited future and you would have to agree the kiwi super teams bending the line, pass and catch style is a winner already proven by the Blacks at the highest level possible and is awesome to watch. To even compare the Waverley style to top level rugby is a compliment to the coaches.
The law makers will agree one day that the rolling maul is illegal on so many levels and finally wipe it out of the game but for now it stays.
Personally I really don't care whether a school has a full-time coach or not. Money doesn't make a good coach that's been proven and I'm not suggesting the Knox coach is not worth his fee. What I am suggesting is many of the school teacher/coaches are very very good. Some of the better coaches in the world have a teaching background and if we can have a coach or two with the ability of the Waverley pair the school is an absolute winner on both fronts. Let it go and enjoy what they bring. Waverley lost but not because of the coaches. They lost because they scored less than Knox through loss of concentration, missed tackles and an opposition that knows how to win. What they do have now is a massive belief in their ability which now needs a 70 minute focus. Well done to both sides and coaches a great spectacle. Look forward to the next contest.
 

Dontreachyoungbloods

Allen Oxlade (6)
My 2c on the the Knox/Waverley game…

I thought it was a great game of rugby. Yep, two very different halves, but a great game nonetheless. Particularly impressive was the spirit in which the game was played. These teams don’t like each other for sure, but I felt they played with respect for the opposition. Nice to see. A few more random thoughts…

- Waverley played with tremendous commitment in the first half – from 1 to 15 they obviously had a game plan that they stuck to very well. I thought their forwards really hunted as a pack. The backs are very impressive and the Knox defence was really tested – I was disappointed Mohi didn’t get a bit more ball as he looks very exciting.

- I find Knox an interesting team. There’s no doubt there are some very talented footballers in the squad, but as a team they rarely get the machine running at anything about 70% except for small bursts. There are comments about their discipline and structure, but for me that’s their weakness. Their ball security around the ruck is lacking way too often: they secure the ball but just before it’s released they’ll back off and a committed and hungry opponent (like Waverley in the first half yesterday) will force a turnover or error. At scrums too they’ll push until the ball is under the lock’s feet, then seem to back off at a critical time

- Another thing about the rucks is their speed of clearance. Bosch is a very good player – he reminds me of a small Luke Burgess, but just as Burgess had many strengths, his weakness was that he’d often crab away from the back of rucks rather than deliver a quick pace and give his backs more space. And that Knox backline is really good. The individual brilliance of Armstrong and Stocks is something to watch but it’s too often just that: individual. I sometimes wander what the structural approach is of the Knox backs as I’m often confused by the way they play.

- A couple more comments about Armstrong. I’ve worried in the past if he goes it alone too much. This season his game seems much more mature and he’s picking his spots well. I’m still amazed at the balance he has through impact.

- I though Tyzac Jordan played a brilliant game for Waverley. I’d read all the comments about him so it was nice to see him live up to the hype. Outstanding decision making, whether it be pass, kick or run. Hope that injury he picked up late isn’t too bad.

- The comments about the rolling maul I find interesting. It was most prevalent in the later stages of the game where Knox were trying to keep it tight once they’d got the lead. Seemed a smart tactic against a team that can score from anywhere I would have thought?

- Oh, and the Silvertails v Fibros like comments about Knox and Waverley are amusing. We are talking about private schools in Sydney that all have good facilities and coaches. It really comes down to the boys on the field. For example, the hunger Waverley played with in the first half was down to them, not their coaches or facilities.
 

oldandslow

Herbert Moran (7)
So, what do we know about the teams after 3 rounds? My rough thoughts below, in order of how they're tracking.

1. Knox - still the one to beat, but Waverley pushed them and the competition has a long way to go, so they'll be keen to keep improving.
2. Waverley - great back line, but lack the forward power compared to some of the other sides as both Knox and Trinity's packs out-muscled them. But with Tyzac Jordan playing out of his skin and plenty of skill and pace out wide, they have plenty of points in them and look like the most exciting attacking side in the comp. Will be keen to play the full 70 minutes on the return fixture against Knox and will need to win that if they want to lift the Henry Plume Shield for the first time since 2009.
3. Trinity - got it together against Aloys in the second half after starving their backs of possession through rounds 1 and 2. Plenty of forward power and also a potent backline, but the inexperienced halves may be the weak link.
4. Cranbrook - After a touch up by Knox in round one have bounced back with a pair of wins over Aloys and Barker, but have a tough assignment at Queens Park next week.
5. Aloys - play with plenty of courage and are always dangerous with Dainton steering them from 10, but depth and stamina is looking like a problem. Held on bravely in strong first half performances against both Waverley and Trinity but got touched up by both of them in the second half.
6. Barker - signs of life against Cranbrook this week, after being held tryless by Trinity and Knox, but it's shaping up as a long, hard season for the boys from Hornsby.



Next week's matches should be interesting:

Trinity v Knox: the visitors the clear favourites, but they'll be matched in the forwards and come up against a Trinity side that clicked into gear in the second half against Aloys. Knox should win it, but it might be closer than people think.

Barker v Aloysius: The two weakest sides go head to head. With this being the best chance for either of them to take their first win, expect a cracking game. I'm tipping Aloys to take the points.

Waverley v Cranbrook: After going oh so close against Knox, Waverley will be keen to get their season firing again. Cranbrook have two wins on the trot, but Waverley's back line will be too potent for them. I'm expecting plenty of tries with Waverley to win by more than 20.
 

SonnyDillWilliams

Nev Cottrell (35)
Not sure of the injury status of the various waverley players ... But I'd be looking at bringing tadg murphy in for the cranbrook match

I know he is only 1 match back from injury... But I have massive wraps on him

If I picked the team I'd always be looking for blokes that are going to do close to 30 good things in a match ... You have 8 piggies that do that and you have a formidable pack ...

At the risk of being overly harsh ...you are have a few waverley forwards that would be 3rd xv at gps schools and their work rate/ skills are secondary to their courage and commitment

Anyway Waverley don't want to take cranbrook lightly , they have been a bogey team in recent years

On that knox rolling maul that I saw them do against joeys , must confess it is a bit of a bore ... But it's part of the game , and Waverley will need to work out a way to counter it for rd 2 ... Altgh there is a lot of rugby to be played before

The return match
 
S

sidelineview

Guest
Not sure of the injury status of the various waverley players . But I'd be looking at bringing tadg murphy in for the cranbrook match

I know he is only 1 match back from injury. But I have massive wraps on him

If I picked the team I'd always be looking for blokes that are going to do close to 30 good things in a match . You have 8 piggies that do that and you have a formidable pack .

At the risk of being overly harsh .you are have a few waverley forwards that would be 3rd xv at gps schools and their work rate/ skills are secondary to their courage and commitment

Anyway Waverley don't want to take cranbrook lightly , they have been a bogey team in recent years

On that knox rolling maul that I saw them do against joeys , must confess it is a bit of a bore . But it's part of the game , and Waverley will need to work out a way to counter it for rd 2 . Altgh there is a lot of rugby to be played before

The return match


I think Murphy is a bit of a way off playing a full game for any team just yet. I dont think he will get a call up for the 1sts for a while. He's an outstanding player but will need a bit of match fitness under his belt.
I thought young Moretti really stood up yesterday against the big Knox forwards. A young player like that could have easily been intimidated but he didn't take a backward step. His defence was strong and his ball skills very good. His one handed offload for the final pass to winger Carr on the inside for the first try was pretty to watch.
 

davidjjones

Frank Row (1)
having watched the Waverley v trinity match I don't know how you could say that Waverley were outmuscled by trinity.Their forwards more than held their own which was reflected in the scoreline.
one player who rarely gets a mention is the number 4 for Waverley who has consistently outplayed his opposite in all 3 matches this year.
 

oldandslow

Herbert Moran (7)
having watched the Waverley v trinity match I don't know how you could say that Waverley were outmuscled by trinity.Their forwards more than held their own which was reflected in the scoreline.
one player who rarely gets a mention is the number 4 for Waverley who has consistently outplayed his opposite in all 3 matches this year.


Mate, you're entitled to your view, but the TGS pack smashed them. The difference in that game was Tyzac Jordan and the very classy Waverley outside backs. If you put that backline behind a dominant forward pack it would be devastating. As it is, even with an average pack they are dangerous.

Can't see any of the Waverley pack making the rep teams but their back line will be heavily represented.
 

Kilgore Trout

Herbert Moran (7)
[quote="BRUMBIEJACK, post: 844953,
My comment re the advert for the Thredbo ski trip in the luxurious senior school centre is nothing about having a chip, but more about the unreality of these privileged lives and the apparent unwillingness of such schools to place an emphasis on service to others.

Really ? the "unreality" of these privileged lives ; no question that these kids are privileged but what is unreal about their situation. Your comments sound like sour grapes. For game of thrones fans ... Knox is the House of Lannister and Waverley is run by the chief sparrow.

I was at the game and sure Knox scored two tries from rolling malls but also scored several via the backline and bombed another when a scintillating run by the fullback ended up in a dropped ball over the line.
It was a great game despite all the whining and played in a fine spirit- much less niggle than in the KvB game.
For me the turning point was a strong tackle made about ten metres into the Knox half after a quick tap by Waverley. The unfortunate pass recipient was driven back metres and the Knox crowd came to life.

Your comment about the ski trip is off topic and contrary to the spirit if not the rules of the site.
 
S

sidelineview

Guest
Rules are rules but the rolling maul should be banned and hopefully will be one day. This is a contentious issue because it is difficult to officiate and it's boring which doesn't promote running rugby.
It is legalised obstruction and shepherding.
The sooner the better.
 
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