Knox took Cranbrook apart with a similar score to the one Scots put on them. The Knox forwards were completely dominant, scoring most of the tries, 2 to Van Zyl, 1 each to JWL, Basson and Lacinski. Price, Williams and Watson were the backs who scored. Swinton was sent off and needs to watch against getting a reputation amongst the Referees. JWL has been carded for high tackles several times and needs to breed that out of his play if he is to stay in Union. Bosch had an outstanding game putting on points with his boot. Summerhayes didn't have a good game and was outclassed and also eclipsed by Makas who is undoubtedly Cranbrook's best forward.
CAS Rugby 2014
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Knox took Cranbrook apart with a similar score to the one Scots put on them. The Knox forwards were completely dominant, scoring most of the tries, 2 to Van Zyl, 1 each to JWL, Basson and Lacinski. Price, Williams and Watson were the backs who scored. Swinton was sent off and needs to watch against getting a reputation amongst the Referees. JWL has been carded for high tackles several times and needs to breed that out of his play if he is to stay in Union. Bosch had an outstanding game putting on points with his boot. Summerhayes didn't have a good game and was outclassed and also eclipsed by Makas who is undoubtedly Cranbrook's best forward.
Being a Waverley parents, I have only seen Cranbrook and Knox play against us and I am of the opinion that Knox is the best side. They are strong and skilful across the park with very few weaknesses. They can adapt to different situations. Cranbrook, while very well drilled, struggle if something is not going to plan.
Snort
Nev Cottrell (35)
There are lots of posts now about how Knox is a better side than Cranbrook. I don't have a dog in this fight, but I'm enough of a simpleton to think that over the course of three months and 10 games, the best team is the team that wins the most games. And, incidentally, "Waverley parents", if Knox adapt so well to difficult situations, how did they lose to Waverley, a fate Cranbrook twice managed to avoid?
In your opinion.
Inside Shoulder
Nathan Sharpe (72)
have you just got back from Gaza?
Depending on the result against Aloys this week, I doubt anyone associated with a Cranbrook premiership, if that's the way it pans out, will be red faced. Should Cranbrook win, perhaps Knox will look back on their 2014 performance at Queens Park and be red faced for years to come. Winners tend to remember their triumphs, losers tend to dwell on "what ifs".
Are you stalking me?
oldboy59
Stan Wickham (3)
Any standouts from either team ??
Kilgore Trout
Herbert Moran (7)
that goes without saying - if Cranrook beat Aloys they win the shield and no opinions will be entered into. Cranbrook will be worthy winners if that is the case. Their reputation has not been enhanced though by having Knox put 52 points on the board in the return clash. The ten game comp is better because it reduces the home and away factor. Under the 5 game format Cranbrook would still have won the comp.
Whilst Cranbrook were given a rugby lesson on Saturday, Knox will remember the Waverley game as their lost title bout. Correct me if I'm wrong someone, but I think Knox have now had 4 trips to Queens Park in succession without a victory. The Knox coaching staff by next year may finally remind the boys of the perils of 'death valley', and get them in the right head space.
Re next year I thought many of Knox's best on the weekend were the younger members. Big guns JWL, CW and Price did their bit as usual but my best were Basson (4), Chapman (8) and Bosch (11) - all year 10 and 11 boys.
Re next year I thought many of Knox's best on the weekend were the younger members. Big guns JWL, CW and Price did their bit as usual but my best were Basson (4), Chapman (8) and Bosch (11) - all year 10 and 11 boys.
RugbyFan14
Herbert Moran (7)
Puzzling discussion about who "deserves" to win the Henry Plume Shield. Of the 3 recent Barker wins only 1 season was undefeated. No thought of them not "deserving" it. If Cranbrook beat Aloys they will have 9 wins from 10 games and win the shield. That is how it is, and how it should be.
Agree there should be some serious soul searching at Knox. After i saw them demolish Barker in Round 1, i thought they had the side to win easily - they were brilliant in attack and well drilled in defence. In Round 2 Cranbrook were clinical against Barker but only scored 2 tries to 1 (plus 5 penalties to superboot, aka Renton). At that point it looked like all Knox.
This age group has always been close. In u13's through u16s it was won by Trinity, Knox, Barker, and Cranbrook respectively. Cranbrook are well drilled and coached and have converted it into a great season. Knox brought in some stars in Yr11 and a high profile coach and produced a team with great potential that has been unstoppable at times.
And yet in Round 5 Knox only managed 12 points against Cranbrook and in Round 6 only 10 points against Waverley. In their other 7 games Knox have averaged 52 points scored. Brilliant mostly, but stumbling at times. Congratulations to Cranbrook on a good season so far (remembering it is not over). Knox can lament over what might have been, but this does not diminish the achievement of Cranbrook.
Agree there should be some serious soul searching at Knox. After i saw them demolish Barker in Round 1, i thought they had the side to win easily - they were brilliant in attack and well drilled in defence. In Round 2 Cranbrook were clinical against Barker but only scored 2 tries to 1 (plus 5 penalties to superboot, aka Renton). At that point it looked like all Knox.
This age group has always been close. In u13's through u16s it was won by Trinity, Knox, Barker, and Cranbrook respectively. Cranbrook are well drilled and coached and have converted it into a great season. Knox brought in some stars in Yr11 and a high profile coach and produced a team with great potential that has been unstoppable at times.
And yet in Round 5 Knox only managed 12 points against Cranbrook and in Round 6 only 10 points against Waverley. In their other 7 games Knox have averaged 52 points scored. Brilliant mostly, but stumbling at times. Congratulations to Cranbrook on a good season so far (remembering it is not over). Knox can lament over what might have been, but this does not diminish the achievement of Cranbrook.
RugbyFan14
Herbert Moran (7)
Michael Farley
Frank Row (1)
Well said RugbyFan
As they say in Palestine, "Que?"
BigKev
Stan Wickham (3)
I thought I'd offer my two cents on the 'best team' debate. In my subjective opinion Knox is the best side in the comp. I believe if Knox and Cranbrook played each other an odd number of times Knox would take the majority. Of course, there is no greater objective unit of measurement than number of wins and losses, thus Cranbrook have taken their opportunities and are prime to win the Henry Plume Shield. Good on them, lesson learnt for Knox.
On the topic of 'what ifs' and rueing performances, Aloysius has turned a 0/5 first round to be 3/4 on the return. Someone earlier mentioned the 5 round format used until 2009. If this system was conveniently implemented at the halfway mark of this season, Knox would have immediately lost to Waverley in rnd 1 and this Aloys vs Cranbrook showdown would be a playoff for a shared premiership with Knox, how great are hypotheticals! The other reason I brought up this Aloysius resurgence, and likewise that of Waverley, is the area of CAS selections. I wonder how differently representative teams would be if selected after the tenth round? We'll never know, but lesson learnt for Aloys on their slow start to the season.
Really looking forward to this weekend, the added drama of a premiership on the line in the already fiery 'rivalry' round.
On the topic of 'what ifs' and rueing performances, Aloysius has turned a 0/5 first round to be 3/4 on the return. Someone earlier mentioned the 5 round format used until 2009. If this system was conveniently implemented at the halfway mark of this season, Knox would have immediately lost to Waverley in rnd 1 and this Aloys vs Cranbrook showdown would be a playoff for a shared premiership with Knox, how great are hypotheticals! The other reason I brought up this Aloysius resurgence, and likewise that of Waverley, is the area of CAS selections. I wonder how differently representative teams would be if selected after the tenth round? We'll never know, but lesson learnt for Aloys on their slow start to the season.
Really looking forward to this weekend, the added drama of a premiership on the line in the already fiery 'rivalry' round.
True lets see how this weekend pans out. No point speculating when the games haven't even been played yet. The knox/barker clash will be a good one regardless and i'm sure the stakes will be high at the cranbrook/aloys game.
Although watching cranbrooks professional super rugby style of taking the points at any opportunity makes washing my hair a far more entertaining and viable alternative.
Although watching cranbrooks professional super rugby style of taking the points at any opportunity makes washing my hair a far more entertaining and viable alternative.
Interesting note on the 5 round format... I think the longer season definitely benefits the larger schools, as depth is a big factor at different stages of the season. Schools like Barker and Knox should be expected to be consistent through the 10 rounds, whereas smaller schools like Aloys and Waverley can only really perform if the actual 1st XV are on the paddock.
On the note of CAS selections, it hasn't been reported here that R.Vevers A13 scored a hatrick on the weekend and looked a class above the competition. It is a shame that players like Vevers and Patterson, W12, who have shown strong form late in the competition will not get another shot at higher representative honours.
RugbyFan14
Herbert Moran (7)
There are some persistent myths about depth. Waverley are actually fielding more rugby teams this year than Barker (25-24).
On the question of school numbers, here is some actual data on total 2013 enrolments from the MySchools web site:
Knox 2304 (K-12)
Trinity 1988 (K-12)
Barker 1599 boys (K-12)
Cranbrook 1411 (K-12)
Waverley 1304 (yrs 5-12)
St Aloysius 1245 (yrs 3-12)
Some surprises perhaps? - Knox the biggest by a very wide margin. Trinity second biggest - 389 bigger than Barker. Cranbrook only 188 boys smaller than Barker - spread out over K-12 is about 14.5 boys per year group.
Given Cranbrook and Barker start at K and Waverley start in Yr5 it may be that Waverley have more boys in high school than Cranbrook (certainly) and Barker (possibly)?
On the question of injuries, Barker have had a dream run of very few injuries in recent years. This year it all caught up - a long list of injuries right through the opens (only fielding 6 open teams this weekend versus 7 for most of the season). Not looking forward to this weekend at Knox.
benson 13,
In the game v Cranbrook,one of Waverley's Coaches was calling out to the player to "stop kicking and keep the ball in hand"......so no,I don't think it was part of the team game plan.
the same player chip kicked 6 times (fact) last match v Aloys and this was frustrating his team mates....and plenty of supporters.One of these chip kicks almost resulted in points to Waverley......the other 5 simply gave possession back to Aloys.
ps....you say you're a Knox parent and a Waverley old Boy ? Interesting.....
You also must watch a lot of Waverley games and seem to highlight the same 3 - 4 players who are in Yr 11/10 and also play League with Roosters ?
# Thought Waverley's 10 was strong last Saturday - he tried to spark the Attack and his Defense was very good.I felt for him late in the game as he was out on his feet but still 'mopped up ' up a lot of missed tackles from team mates.
In the game v Cranbrook,one of Waverley's Coaches was calling out to the player to "stop kicking and keep the ball in hand"......so no,I don't think it was part of the team game plan.
the same player chip kicked 6 times (fact) last match v Aloys and this was frustrating his team mates....and plenty of supporters.One of these chip kicks almost resulted in points to Waverley......the other 5 simply gave possession back to Aloys.
ps....you say you're a Knox parent and a Waverley old Boy ? Interesting.....
You also must watch a lot of Waverley games and seem to highlight the same 3 - 4 players who are in Yr 11/10 and also play League with Roosters ?
# Thought Waverley's 10 was strong last Saturday - he tried to spark the Attack and his Defense was very good.I felt for him late in the game as he was out on his feet but still 'mopped up ' up a lot of missed tackles from team mates.
S
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Waverley's 10 is 15 years old, a year 10 student and a Harold Matts Roosters player.
and the player in question did kick too much; it was frustrating. Hopefully that problem is rectified for next Saturday.
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