Canberra Vikings - Offical NRC Team Thread

[TOCC]

Vikings don't sponsor a dominant club team, they are the dominant club team.. Vikings Group is a not for profit organisation whose primary objective is to encourage the growth of Rugby Union in Tuggeranong and the clubs are just a means to achieve this objective.

The issue is in them sponsoring and holding naming rights over the NRC team, but as discussed above, as an organisation they were willing to bankroll the venture, so it's a bit hard for the Brumbies to dictate otherwise.

If someone else is willing to front up the cash and accept financial liability of the NRC team then sure, change the name, but as long as the Vikings are providing the money and resources, they can't exactly be forced to change.




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[Ozee316]

They should be allowed naming rights on one team and jersey sponsor on the other. The issue will never go away in my eyes until they accept they can't have naming rights of those two teams.

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[Caputo]

I think most people would argue Penca should of been there while perry was in town, wasn't from the right club though! You can't tell me Penca wouldn't of had more impact coming off the bench in that grand final, perry might be a bit better over the ball but when Canberra needed points in the last 20 minutes I know who is better at bending the defensive line!

My opinion is to disagree because of the composition of the Back row. I believe Rowan Perry provided more balance to the team as a Reserve.

If you look at Canberra Vikings team for 2015 there was a reliance on Brumbies for the Back row in Jordan Smiler at 6 (VC), Jarrad Butler at 7 © and Ita Vaea at 8 with Reserves of Oakman-Hunt twins and Perry. Most games had Vaea being replaced by Perry with Butler moving to 8.

The accusation that Perry was from the right club is wrong. Perry performed well for Aust 20 in 2014 and my hazy memory is that he was chosen on the bench for the Brumbies but was an unused substitute.

Looking forward I would think that the Brumbies would probably have three Back rowers in 2016 in their NRC team.

In the mix maybe Ben Hyne signed from Brisbane for preseason, seems to be too small for Lock in Super Rugby so may fight for 6. Also I think they may consider EPS player Michael Wells. Post Olympics the return of Tom Cusack. Also if there is a standout for the ACT U20 at No 7 maybe Dean Paragali.

There may be a chance that the Brumbies maybe hunting a replacement for Pocock and use the NRC as an audition for a couple of fellas from over the border.

Before we look at JID form I could throw in Kamikamica or the yank (Coyle).

 

[kiap]

They should be allowed naming rights on one team and jersey sponsor on the other. The issue will never go away in my eyes until they accept they can't have naming rights of those two teams.

It's not really a matter of what they're "allowed". If the Vikings pay the piper then they can call the tune.

The Brumbies are free to ... not take their money ... and it sounds like they might be doing just that. No problem.

But one thing people may not be aware of (even some Brumbies supporters) is that Canberra Kookaburras/Vikings bills have been paid by the Vikings going back nigh on twenty years.

The ACTRU's share went belly up before. That's why the Vikings got the team in the first place.

 

[No.8]

Tuggeranong Vikings (who are the major backer of the NRC Side ) - are prob one of the richest if not richest Rugby Clubs in Australia - with more money than some Super Rugby sides - so for them not to back the NRC team just wouldn't be viable - I believe its a good thing they are a backer as it prob just wouldn't happen if they were not there....but it is somewhat arrogant I feel to take the NRC side 100% in the Vikings direction i.e jersey vikings colours, name vikings, coach vikings, lets be honest prob picking their players over some due to them being Vikings.... of course if you are putting the money in you need to get something - and I honestly believe they would have a bigger backing/make more money (or at least break even) if they were more neutral as alot of Canberra fans from other local clubs are supporting other NRC Teams due to the fact that Tuggeranong Vikings wont let go of anything regarding the NRC Vikings.

Possibly call them the Canberra Vikings Griffins - change the jersey to the Griffins jersey and away you go....

 

[Ozee316]

Just let the Vikings be the main jersey sponsor on the NRC team but change the name.

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[No.8]

My opinion is to disagree because of the composition of the Back row. I believe Rowan Perry provided more balance to the team as a Reserve.

If you look at Canberra Vikings team for 2015 there was a reliance on Brumbies for the Back row in Jordan Smiler at 6 (VC), Jarrad Butler at 7 © and Ita Vaea at 8 with Reserves of Oakman-Hunt twins and Perry. Most games had Vaea being replaced by Perry with Butler moving to 8.

The accusation that Perry was from the right club is wrong. Perry performed well for Aust 20 in 2014 and my hazy memory is that he was chosen on the bench for the Brumbies but was an unused substitute.

Looking forward I would think that the Brumbies would probably have three Back rowers in 2016 in their NRC team.

In the mix maybe Ben Hyne signed from Brisbane for preseason, seems to be too small for Lock in Super Rugby so may fight for 6. Also I think they may consider EPS player Michael Wells. Post Olympics the return of Tom Cusack. Also if there is a standout for the ACT U20 at No 7 maybe Dean Paragali.

There may be a chance that the Brumbies maybe hunting a replacement for Pocock and use the NRC as an audition for a couple of fellas from over the border.

Before we look at JID form I could throw in Kamikamica or the yank (Coyle).

Heard Paragali is a good prospect - looks like he will be a total unit in a season or 2.

Can't see Coyle coming close - he was playing 2nd's for Eagles...not to be rude but there are prob some better 2nd/3rd graders running around than him...but could be proven wrong!

 

[Ozee316]

I must admit something in this thread. I'm a Kiwi. But I love rugby and can't wait until NRC is regularly broadcast. When I first heard the name Vikings I thought it was a great name for the team. It links nicely to the Canberra Raiders league team name and is distinctive. The jerseys are also distinctive. It will really be a shame to lose all that. I'd like to see the Vikings keep the name for the NRC team and simply change the name of their rugby club team.

I know about their history as a club. It's just they have to choose. They could restructure and start supporting more clubs with their money rather than just Tuggarong. And be jersey sponsors on more clubs but only the team name of NRC.

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[Ozee316]

I frankly think once they started to represent all the clubs in the NRC they now have a duty to financially support more clubs financially not just one. It is not done in most other places like that.

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[kiap]

I must admit something in this thread. I'm a Kiwi. But I love rugby and can't wait until NRC is regularly broadcast. When I first heard the name Vikings I thought it was a great name for the team. It links nicely to the Canberra Raiders league team name and is distinctive. The jerseys are also distinctive. It will really be a shame to lose all that. I'd like to see the Vikings keep the name for the NRC team and simply change the name of their rugby club team.

Bulldog determination there, Ozee316.

But I reckon there could be some middle ground on the colours. And as a Kiwi, you might even be predisposed to these. When the Canberra club was first started, it played in the Sydney comp in 1995. Colours were black and white with blue and gold hooping:

Incidentally, the first ever Canberra Rugby Club also played in black and white back in 1927.

So if there is a pressing need to get rid of the red jersey, they could revert to something like this; their original colours at foundation which include the ACT's blue and gold. Keep the present black shorts, and perhaps have black socks with a red top as some token towards the Vikings for paying for their existence for the best part of two decades.

If only to not have yet another team in predominantly blue/gold.

I know about their history as a club. It's just they have to choose.

Nah. As the gift horse providers in this case, they do not.

It's the Ponies who have to choose.

The Viking Group may have a rugby focus, but they have also spread to other sports.

 

[No.8]

The Tuggeranong Vikings/Vikings Group would pull out of the NRC Team long before they ever changed their name - prob more likely the Brumbies change their name than the Vikings lol...

I do like the jersey design above ^^^

 

[mst]

Tuggeranong Vikings (who are the major backer of the NRC Side ) - are prob one of the richest if not richest Rugby Clubs in Australia - with more money than some Super Rugby sides - so for them not to back the NRC team just wouldn't be viable - I believe its a good thing they are a backer as it prob just wouldn't happen if they were not there..but it is somewhat arrogant I feel to take the NRC side 100% in the Vikings direction i.e jersey vikings colours, name vikings, coach vikings, lets be honest prob picking their players over some due to them being Vikings.. of course if you are putting the money in you need to get something - and I honestly believe they would have a bigger backing/make more money (or at least break even) if they were more neutral as alot of Canberra fans from other local clubs are supporting other NRC Teams due to the fact that Tuggeranong Vikings wont let go of anything regarding the NRC Vikings.

Possibly call them the Canberra Vikings Griffins - change the jersey to the Griffins jersey and away you go..

IIRC the Canberra Vikings are one (or two) of the NRC franchise to be breaking even / making a profit.

It begs the question that if Viking group are "neutral spending" on the NRC allowing for funding to be retained or added to the JiD and grassroots (by all NRC partners), why would financially "challenged" JiD teams (I believe some are on life support) wanting change when the Vikings funding provides a NRC team, and extra exposure / advertising / promotion to the game for no cost to them?

It also suggest that if I am correct that the NRC team is revenue neutral or even profitable even with the current level of dissatisfaction, it is conceivable that the Vikings could cut the "dead weight" loose and go it alone.

Backers like TV, players like opportunity, supporters like watching games. Not all NRC franchise are equal or inclusive of local provinces / clubs / competitions. It's arguable that ACT Rugby and especially the JiD clubs are lucky that they are being involved and considered - even if its only in a small way.

 

[Whitehead]

Have to agree mate - I think Penca should of been in the 23 - lets hope this year they give him a real crack - prob no more deserving player in act rugby at the moment - of course only looking from the outside but seems to be a real General at Qbn and his leadership I think would of made a big impact in the Vikings side.

I can see your a Qbn man - any news on how they are looking for this season - new players/players left - the islander No.8 and No.5 were insane last year - don't know how at least the no.8 missed out on Vikings selection - are they still around?

No 8 is OJ Noa, came from Melbourne last season and has trained with brumbies over the offseason, will be back! No 5 Tai Valeni I don't think will be playing this season, given he was unlucky not to take out the MacDougall last year!

 

[Whitehead]

IIRC the Canberra Vikings are one (or two) of the NRC franchise to be breaking even / making a profit.

It begs the question that if Viking group are "neutral spending" on the NRC allowing for funding to be retained or added to the JiD and grassroots (by all NRC partners), why would financially "challenged" JiD teams (I believe some are on life support) wanting change when the Vikings funding provides a NRC team, and extra exposure / advertising / promotion to the game for no cost to them?

It also suggest that if I am correct that the NRC team is revenue neutral or even profitable even with the current level of dissatisfaction, it is conceivable that the Vikings could cut the "dead weight" loose and go it alone.

Backers like TV, players like opportunity, supporters like watching games. Not all NRC franchise are equal or inclusive of local provinces / clubs / competitions. It's arguable that ACT Rugby and especially the JiD clubs are lucky that they are being involved and considered - even if its only in a small way.

I agree that ACT rugby need the Vikings involved as they have a very successful business and that can only help given the financial situation at the brumbies and other local clubs! Not many people not involved with Vikings would agree with me but I don't mind too much it actually being called the Canberra Vikings, the problem I have is them pretending it is a team that is representative of the best players in the ACT as it is clearly biased in selecting Tuggeranong players. I guess they don't have an obligation to pick players from other clubs but if they are after support from the broader rugby community locally then they need to pick a team and squad that represents the best of local rugby!

 

[No.8]

IIRC the Canberra Vikings are one (or two) of the NRC franchise to be breaking even / making a profit.

It begs the question that if Viking group are "neutral spending" on the NRC allowing for funding to be retained or added to the JiD and grassroots (by all NRC partners), why would financially "challenged" JiD teams (I believe some are on life support) wanting change when the Vikings funding provides a NRC team, and extra exposure / advertising / promotion to the game for no cost to them?

It also suggest that if I am correct that the NRC team is revenue neutral or even profitable even with the current level of dissatisfaction, it is conceivable that the Vikings could cut the "dead weight" loose and go it alone.

Backers like TV, players like opportunity, supporters like watching games. Not all NRC franchise are equal or inclusive of local provinces / clubs / competitions. It's arguable that ACT Rugby and especially the JiD clubs are lucky that they are being involved and considered - even if its only in a small way.

I do agree with this - without the Vikings Canberra Rugby could be very much like a country rugby comp - they have given alot to the sport over the last 30 yrs and this can not be taken away from them - my previous statements were more thinking (or typing) out aloud more than anything...I guess it would be "nice" to see a true ACT side run out on the field and feel possibly this would receive more backing/a wider audience etc...

As Whitehead said though it would simply be nice to see the inclusion of more players from other sides - i.e OJ Noa and Valeni from Qbn just to name 2 - these guys were standouts in nearly every game they played last season (I know Noa was out due to injury part of the season) but I believe was the standout No.8 and Valeni was a standout lock (played alot like a 6) - I think the inclusion of Penca also broke down some of the walls when it came to being a Vikings side. I know its hard when you have a large % of Brumbies in the side but possibly this year a bigger/wider inclusion of club players will be selected.

 

[No.8]

No 8 is OJ Noa, came from Melbourne last season and has trained with brumbies over the offseason, will be back! No 5 Tai Valeni I don't think will be playing this season, given he was unlucky not to take out the MacDougall last year!

Good to hear Noa will be back for you guys - as mentioned above (when not injured) was a real standout. Not good to hear about Valeni - but hopefully you guys can recruit/bring some boys up that will make a good impact...

Would like to see Qbn go all the way this year...seems to be a side that is building...

 

[mst]

I agree with both of you No.8 and Whitehead that it would be great if it was more balanced in representation etc and other players given a shot.

I think you can compare this to the the early feelings about the Wallabies under Cheika and his "preference" for Tahs in the team. Many were not happy about his selections but it was his right to choose who he wanted.

Personally I think that the damage has already been done, but also believe that some of the damage done has been shooting oneself in the foot by those not happy with the setup.

Already the Vikings have been knocked off the No.1 spot in the JiD. This shows that there is more than one team and set-ups outside of the Vikings that can be successful on the field. The interesting part is the player movements now being driven by the NRC team that is pushing some Vikings / Brumbies fringe players out to seek other opportunity and other clubs talent having the door opened (as you both mentioned above). All of this is happening irrespective of the whining and background political crap.

So, IMHO, if those in ACT rugby just shut up and stopped the political crap, sucked it up and got behind this concept for the next two years the "natural forces" that goes with the NRC team, such as player movements, and the focus of JiD teams being on the JiD and their own teams instead of; and I cannot say it any other way than "fucking colour of a jersey!!!" may change the landscape significantly and this whole debate may be coming from better positioned JiD teams and competition, and a more ""ACT inclusive" Canberra Vikings team.

For what its worth I think OJ Noa and Penca will get a run and so will more talent from outside of the Vikings.

 

[Slim 293]

I haven't seen any evidence of bias in the Vikings' selections for the past two seasons, so I don't feel like commenting further on that allegation right now..................

Generally, I think the traditional ACT colours would be warranted, but considering the over saturation of blue and gold in the NRC I'm glad we have the red and black to stand out, and would prefer to stick with it (although I would generally oppose it)...............

But I do like Kiap's recommendation, and think if there's a way of integrating the two colour schemes without looking shite that it would be ideal...........

As for the Vikings name - as a Tuggeranong supporter I would personally prefer a different team name to separate the two, although it is a strong team name and while the Vikings continue to prop up the team it's their prerogative..............

I just hope that the Brumbies/ACT Rugby don't risk the financial stability of the Canberra NRC team by shunning the Vikings money to placate the old boys club.

 

[Whitehead]

I haven't seen any evidence of bias in the Vikings' selections for the past two seasons, so I don't feel like commenting further on that allegation right now......

Generally, I think the traditional ACT colours would be warranted, but considering the over saturation of blue and gold in the NRC I'm glad we have the red and black to stand out, and would prefer to stick with it (although I would generally oppose it).....

But I do like Kiap's recommendation, and think if there's a way of integrating the two colour schemes without looking shite that it would be ideal.....

As for the Vikings name - as a Tuggeranong supporter I would personally prefer a different team name to separate the two, although it is a strong team name and while the Vikings continue to prop up the team it's their prerogative......

I just hope that the Brumbies/ACT Rugby don't risk the financial stability of the Canberra NRC team by shunning the Vikings money to placate the old boys club.

No evidence of Tuggeranong bias is selections? Isaac Thompson played second grade, a second grade team who couldn't win the Comp yet got picked most weeks at nrc level! There were two colts players in the squad, again a Colts team that didn't even win the comp! Ask any observer of jid rugby from the past 5 years who would the best player in that time is and a fair few would say Penca, yet he gets 30 minutes all season! We have a dominant forward pack all season and Penca is the only one in the squad! Royals win the comp and have one player in it, really, should I continue?

 

[Ozee316]

I agree with the complaints regarding selections and in such cases perception of bias can be as important as bias itself.

We all already know this has been solved and the Bramber assistant coach will coach the NRC Vikings this season. Will there be any strings being pulled in the background to produce further unfair selections? We can only wait and see but for now head coach being impartial was a crucial step. We don't need to keep relitigating it.

As for the jerseys, practicality does matter unfortunately and other NRC teams have unholy mismatched jersey/short/sock combinations trying to include all feeder clubs into their final outfits. Compared to Currie Cup or ITM Cup teams they look like technicolour dream coats some of them. The red of the Vikings is on this basis a legitimate color to include in the Jersey, even more so because other NRC teams don't have red. Other Canberra club colors could be included into socks or shorts. You just cannot have 12 colors on a jersey nor can every region be the same colour. 4-5 colors at most with 2 main ones and I suggest Red be one of them. Not anything to do with money but practicality, distinctiveness, style. How about Red+yellow or Red+black. Then you can take a look at the Canterbury Crusader jerseys. Try Red+grey that looks good. Socks and shorts can include other club colors or Canberra colors.



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