Canberra Vikings - Offical NRC Team Thread

[Slim 293]

From the article BJ posted:

The Tuggeranong Vikings provide nearly half of the Canberra Vikings' squad.

Eighteen players are from the Tuggeranong Vikings, while Royals have only three representatives.

Five players - three from the Gungahlin Eagles and two from the Queanbeyan Whites - are unavailable through injury or work commitments.

"When we named the club train-on squad, there was some discontent around how many Vikings players were in the team," McKellar said.

"As I said at the time, they've won four competitions in a row and the squad mirrors that.

"There's a couple of development players as well who have played Australian under-20s and we want to see how they step up to that high level of competition."

Those players are prop Tyrell Lomax - the son of former Raiders prop John Lomax - and hooker Connal McInerney.

Scrumhalf Michael Dowsett and lock Sam Carter will also play with NSW Country, while prop Scott Sio is with the North Harbour Rays.

Hooker Josh Mann-Rea and outside back Robbie Coleman will both miss the NRC to recover from injuries.


Read more: http://www.canberratimes.com.au/rugby-union/brumbies/aru-stops-brumbies-forward-tom-staniforth-from-playing-in-new-zealands-itm-cup-20150805-gis0t4.html#ixzz3hvqRiSUV

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

On Tom Staniforth.

http://www.canberratimes.com.au/rug...-in-new-zealands-itm-cup-20150805-gis0t4.html

I've got no issue with the ARU blocking that move. We need as much talent present and available for the NRC as possible. The fact that the Brumbies were looking to do this shows little regard for the NRC a structure we have needed for a long time and now that we have it. A structure we all have to support.

 

[Brumby Jack]

I can sort of understand in that he would likely be behind Arnold and Enever, like he is at the Brumbies. Having said that, as most of the Brumbies contracted players stay with the Vikings, they could have initially asked around the other teams to see if they needed him.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

I can sort of understand in that he would likely be behind Arnold and Enever, like he is at the Brumbies. Having said that, as most of the Brumbies contracted players stay with the Vikings, they could have initially asked around the other teams to see if they needed him.

I'm sure that if they had shopped him around they would have had takers. You just have to ask why that didn't occur to them first instead of trying to ship him off to the ITM Cup.

 

[Slim 293]

I can understand why they thought it was a good idea to have a player like Staniforth get some experience in the ITM Cup, but I think it's also quite fair for the ARU to block that move to strengthen the NRC.............

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

I can understand why they thought it was a good idea to have a player like Staniforth get some experience in the ITM Cup, but I think it's also quite fair for the ARU to block that move to strengthen the NRC.....

It does make sense from a development perspective. The ITM Cup is a long established competition of high quality. Totally understandable especially as the NRC is still in its relative infancy. We both seem to be in agreement on why he should stay.

 

[AussieDominance]

Can definitely understand the Brumbies view point as well as the ARU's why would you want one of your best young prospects being exposed to a rival franchise theoretically when you can get probably better development in the ITM cup.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

Can definitely understand the Brumbies view point as well as the ARU's why would you want one of your best young prospects being exposed to a rival franchise theoretically when you can get probably better development in the ITM cup.

Sending someone to the ITM Cup isn't exactly hiding them away out of view. The facts are even if he stayed in Canberra and played with the Vikings that doesn't guarantee he still wouldn't be approached.

 

[qwerty51]

We'll hold on a second here, no matter which ITM Cup team he is sent to would be really see much game time? He's far likely to get more game time for the Eagles. I wouldn't say the ITM Cup would be better for his development.

 

[AussieDominance]

Sending someone to the ITM Cup isn't exactly hiding them away out of view. The facts are even if he stayed in Canberra and played with the Vikings that doesn't guarantee he still wouldn't be approached.

I was more referring to the interaction he may get with different people/coaches/organisation's. If you are a Super Rugby Franchise in Australia and you don't know a fair bit about Tom Staniforth I don't think you would be doing your job.

 

[mst]

I can sort of understand in that he would likely be behind Arnold and Enever, like he is at the Brumbies. Having said that, as most of the Brumbies contracted players stay with the Vikings, they could have initially asked around the other teams to see if they needed him.

I wonder if they did consider that option? So I would presume the Brumbies are wanting to challenge Tom to get some more growth and development and also expose him to different cultures and dynamics.

He is contracted so losing him is not a worry. He is training alongside Arnold and Enever so he certainly has been challenged. He risen through the ranks and has played at the under 20's level for the Aussie team, played NRC and has had a taste of Super Rugby - so what challenge does the NRC bring him and what are the development opportunities?

The NRC is a step down (level) and back in with players and coaches that he has already been exposed to. So for me this comes back to a question of giving Australian players the best development, and when one of the Super Rugby franchise identifies that for the benefit of the player his development path is elsewhere for a few months what really is the issue?

I believe there certainly a valid argument to say if he was to play in the ITM it may provided us (sic) with a better player in the future, and open a opportunity for another player to have a shot in the NRC.

So for mine what does the ARU decision achieve for the Australian game which need to improve its depth and talent, and open up more opportunities to increase the player pool and overall depth by making Tom play in the NRC?

 

[Hugh Jarse]

Isn't it a mindset thing? We need to get Australian Rugby people believing that the NRC is on a par with the ITM cup, not lower.

I can understand that the Ponies wanted to send him to ITM cup for further development purposes, but they may also have tried to do that so that the Vikings would not have to come up against Tom in the NRC if he was playing with another franchise. He would have a fair amount of inside knowledge on the strengths and weaknesses of the Vikings players that could give a bit of an advantage to the franchise he is with. If he is with the ITM Cup overseas, that threat is not there.

 

[Train Without a Station]

I can't believe it. MST is actually trying to say that the Brumbies attempting to send a Super Rugby contracted player to play in the ITM Cup instead of the NRC is good for Australian rugby.

Now if every team went down this route, how do you think the NRC would improve?

 

[mst]

I can understand that the Ponies wanted to send him to ITM cup for further development purposes, but they may also have tried to do that so that the Vikings would not have to come up against Tom in the NRC if he was playing with another franchise. He would have a fair amount of inside knowledge on the strengths and weaknesses of the Vikings players that could give a bit of an advantage to the franchise he is with. If he is with the ITM Cup overseas, that threat is not there.

Um, doesn't he have the same competition weekly at the Brumbies for selection? Its a bit of a moot point when you think most Aussie players know each other pretty well, especially when it comes to Super Rugby players playing against each other in the NRC.

From what I understand, the reason he was not selected for the Vikings was they were expecting him not to play the NRC and had already selected a replacement player.

 

[Hugh Jarse]

I thought he missed out because there is a cap on the number of Super Rugby Players allowable in a NRC Franchise, and given the numbers in Brumbieland who were around for NRC, someone had to miss out.

Sending Tom to ITM Cup when you can't use him for the local NRC Franchise may be really good for his individual player development, and pre NRC no one would have batted an eyelid. Now that we have a fledgeling NRC, it does send a bad message about the perceived standard of play and development in NRC compared to ITM cup. For NRC to succeed, everyone must get behind it and support it. Sending a contracted player to an overseas finishing school just doesn't look right.

 

[Train Without a Station]

From what I understand, the reason he was not selected for the Vikings was they were expecting him not to play the NRC and had already selected a replacement player.

Pretty foolish by them really. All Australian Super Rugby Player Salaries are covered by the ARU in their grant for the teams. They effectively pay all players, the money going via their franchise.

Contracts were adjusted to include the NRC in their Super Rugby contract. So effectively they asked the ARU to pay him whilst he goes and plays in another country's competition.

 

[Hugh Jarse]

When Beau Robinson was "seconded" to the Bay of Plenty Steamers ITM Cup team whilst still contracted to the Reds (Pre NRC) a year or three back, I believe that there was an arrangement which saw the NZ team pay the equivalent of his Reds wages to the Reds for his services.

I think that means that ARU and QRU were not out of pocket while he was playing in another countries competition.

Before the ARU put the kibosh on Tom playing ITM cup, I reckon that the Brumbies staff would have negotiated a similar arrangement.

 

[Train Without a Station]

And I'm sure with the Brumbies doing this for the good of Australian rugby, they probably were going to forward that money directly back to the ARU too.

 

[mst]

I can't believe it. MST is actually trying to say that the Brumbies attempting to send a Super Rugby contracted player to play in the ITM Cup instead of the NRC is good for Australian rugby.

Now if every team went down this route, how do you think the NRC would improve?

So, to clarify, you saying its a stupid idea to use the opportunity to enhance the skill level of an young contracted Super Rugby player who later can raise the bar in the NRC, and in doing so not use the chance to give another emerging talent a chance to be seen potentially adding to the talent pool and adding more competition at the player level?

Um - you know about inbreeding don't you? With that logic we could go down the US route of calling it a Aussie only World Championship. Even the Kiwi's and Saffa send players O/S for experience and development, so its doesn't do much for our credibility.

So I do support him going. With more spots open for new players, while those young contacted Super Rugby player play one development season in the ITM or Currie to enhance their skill level and raise the bar in the NRC the next season I cant see why you wouldn't support for the benefit of the game here.

So by your rational Tom runs round in the NRC and stays at about the same performance level as before and its rinse and repeat next year.
Should Tom not improve what would be the benefit? The Brumbies assessed he need further development not available here at this time. So how does this improve the quality of players and standard of the game?

It just brings in to question how going forward Super Rugby clubs will need to manage contracts and developing players if the ARU are going to be an impediment at the cost of player development with no substantial benefits for the NRC.

 

[Train Without a Station]

Please explain all the NZ and SA players who have been sent to player overseas for "experience" instead of playing in their ITM or Currie Cup?

How many Super Rugby games did Tom play this year? 0. Considering he's spent the entire year playing club rugby how would he stay the same playing NRC? Was he a star at that level in 2014? No.

Considering Tom only started 6 of the 8 games, preferred in 2 to the not contracted Tim Cree and the yet to debut in Super Rugby Rory Arnold, I think you're delusional one eye Brumby defending daze if you think Tom Staniforth is beyond the NRC in player development.