Bulls vs Waratahs, 2011R16

[qwerty51]

It was similar to Deysel, hopefully it's only 2 weeks. Pat shouldn't have to answer to anything.

 

[cyclopath]

Simply because Burgess cannot pass to hit a moving target. Even his passes to static targets go above the shoulder or behind the player. All of that was executed with almost perfect ball. The pigs did a huge job and Burgess had an enormous amount of relatively fast clean ball and he was well protected around the rucks in general, and still the passes were not accurate. This is his fundamental skill and he is poor at it.

It is really an indictment on Hickey that Burgess who has been in the Tahs starting side for so long has not improved in this aspect. It also shows that Burgess' is there not for his skills in passing and definitely not kicking from hand, but for his defence. I still rate Burgess as perhaps the best defending 9 in the world, it is just a pity that he has not capacity feeding a backline in motion.

The lack of speed as you put it is a bit of a falalcy, the fact that they were static 15 metres behind the gain line made the Bulls look faster than they were. The fact that the passes from Burgess made the receiver reach up or back for the ball almost every time slowed them even fruther.

Burgess actually was not that bad last night. He varies from game to game, and some games he is more direct, less stepping before passing so the ball is released faster. I thought he was like this last night.
Qwerty's point about the differences between the Reds and Tahs execution is spot on. Barnes and Hangers start too far back and move too slowly forward at times, compared to Cooper. It aint all Burgess.

 

[vidiot]

Just watched the replay this arvo on fox. Waratahs gave it a good shake, can't doubt their effort. They did seem to move the ball laterally a lot and not especially fluently without threatening, apart from Beale who was truly superb.

A +1 for the impact of injuries. But sack Bowen. The backline should, even if they don't do anything more than catch and pass, catch and pass out in front, and get their depth right.

 

[Gnostic]

I didn't think I ever said it was all Burgess. The post talks about Burgess lack of passing skill to hit a moving target, and also about the depth and all moves being 10-15 metres behind the advantage line. Also the lack of any line threat let alone break from anybody except Beale. But hey if you want to focus on the Burgess part of the post go ahead.

Do you think if Burgess could pass a ball in front of a player who was already moving forward it would make Barnes, Carter et al a bit quicker than them recieving the ball flat footed as well as 15 metres behind the gain line? Can't blame everyone else except Burgess.

 

[cyclopath]

I didn't think I ever said it was all Burgess. The post talks about Burgess lack of passing skill to hit a moving target, and also about the depth and all moves being 10-15 metres behind the advantage line. Also the lack of any line threat let alone break from anybody except Beale. But hey if you want to focus on the Burgess part of the post go ahead.

Do you think if Burgess could pass a ball in front of a player who was already moving forward it would make Barnes, Carter et al a bit quicker than them recieving the ball flat footed as well as 15 metres behind the gain line? Can't blame everyone else except Burgess.

Apologies, it must be the number of times you mentioned Burgess and his passing that drew my attention.
Final part? Well I think he can, and did. But doesn't always. So I guess that is as close as I will come to agreeing with you on this.

 

[qwerty51]

I've watched it again and yeah the pack were excellent, in fact I'd say they outperformed the Bulls pack. Shame about the backs. I honestly can say with Drew there we would've won that game by a bit but we need to work on our depth to prevent relying heavily of these types of players.

 

[Red Rooster]

Has anyone wondered that the rising injury toll is a result of the bulking up they did in the off season. I accept that an impact injury is an accident but the soft tissue injuries, like Turners hamstring might have deeper causes. I would imagine that if you just add 10 kgs to someone that you body becomes more stressed in such a short space of time - any thoughts?

 

[No4918]

Pull your head in no4198. Shep put himself through the ringer for you lot in that epic scrumathon against the tahs. Pretty sure the others would have done worse, but whatever the case the bloke has been much better than terrible.

Are you serious? Go back to the threads following games he has played to see how well he has done.

 

[darkhorse]

Has anyone wondered that the rising injury toll is a result of the bulking up they did in the off season. I accept that an impact injury is an accident but the soft tissue injuries, like Turners hamstring might have deeper causes. I would imagine that if you just add 10 kgs to someone that you body becomes more stressed in such a short space of time - any thoughts?

Yeah its true. When you put on weight quickly your more susceptible to injury. The tendons and ligaments need time to adjust. It's like growing pains, often the bones and muscles outgrow the ligaments and tendons.

I think it is a major concern for young players. Some players debut at 90kg, 100 kg or whatever in their teens and most people think they'll be fine. However, often it overlooks the fact that most of them have put on 10kg in the space of a couple of months. I think rob horne is a classic example. He put on 2 or 3 inches when he left school, then debuted at 19. He is only 85kg now when he is 6ft1 with a huge frame. He really isn't that heavy for how tall or wide his shoulders are and could do with a little bit more bulk (I say that cautiously because I don't want him to become like Turner & Tuqiri, but he is a center).

I believe this is the basis of Robbie Deans wanting JOC (James O'Connor) to stay on the wing at test level. Inside has a greater demand on the body than wing does for many reasons (wing has more one-on ones, focus on beating the man not making the gain line, center needs to straighten the attack). Test level clearly has a higher demand on the body than super rugby.

Robbie is probably just looking out for his future. I'm not sure I would do the same though. The wallabies would be a great deal better with JOC (James O'Connor) at 12. If this is the reason, he is being almost self-destructively altruistic.

 

[Bowside]

It was similar to Deysel, hopefully it's only 2 weeks. Pat shouldn't have to answer to anything.

I didn't even think he did anything wrong. He was just stupid to lead with the head. I hazard a guess at saying that probably happens numerous times every weekend in club rugby, and nothing comes of it.

 

[fatprop]

I didn't even think he did anything wrong. He was just stupid to lead with the head. I hazard a guess at saying that probably happens numerous times every weekend in club rugby, and nothing comes of it.

I think he means Douglas, who could have a case to answer

On the game, the Tahs did pretty well and werne't emabarassed

I guess Tiles will start next week with Baxter

Tetera Faulkner has signed for the Force, but is in the Tahs academy,, good prop

 

[rugbysmartarse]

Oconner gets off, Douglas 2 weeks. When was the last red card for striking result in no suspension?

 

[qwerty51]

Well done SANZAR you finally did something right.

Douglas 2 weeks and Pat 0 are the two correct decisions.

 

[Hawko]

Well done SANZAR you finally did something right.

Douglas 2 weeks and Pat 0 are the two correct decisions.

Maybe I could agree with you if Deysel got 4-6. But to say Douglas's infraction was the same as Deysel's is stretching credibility beyond reasonable limits.

 

[qwerty51]

I initially thought Deysel's was much worse but Douglas has hit Oliver high and held on (penalty in itself for not releasing..) with a tight squeeze around his neck. Oliver's body was somewhat contorted.

 

[inthestands]

I initially thought Deysel's was much worse but Douglas has hit Oliver high and held on (penalty in itself for not releasing..) with a tight squeeze around his neck. Oliver's body was somewhat contorted.

Olivier still managed to pull Douglas' arm off him... Deysel had one arm clenched in the other like an MMA hold

 

[Gagger]

Has anyone wondered that the rising injury toll is a result of the bulking up they did in the off season. I accept that an impact injury is an accident but the soft tissue injuries, like Turners hamstring might have deeper causes. I would imagine that if you just add 10 kgs to someone that you body becomes more stressed in such a short space of time - any thoughts?

Kinda makes sense, but what's the ratio of soft tissue vs others and is it any different to last years or other teams? The head knocks have stood out more I guess

 

[ChargerWA]

Pro Legoete stood down from this weeks games and possibly next weeks. Cold comfort to Tahs supporters who were hamstrung by a shit decision.

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