Brumbies v Waratahs, Rnd 7 2020 GIO Stadium Sunday 15 Mar 16:05

[fatprop]

I get a sense that Simmons has good leg extension and is lighter than most other locks.
Hence he can explode into the air and get lifted quicker. This plus his ability to call the right lineout option makes him particularly valuable.

To me it is a misnomer that locks are generally "lifted" I think a better description is that they are held at the top of their leap, the "lifters" then provide stability to hand off the ball or set a maul

 

[formerflanker]

To me it is a misnomer that locks are generally "lifted" I think a better description is that they are held at the top of their leap, the "lifters" then provide stability to hand off the ball or set a maul

If that were true, the olden days before lifting would have seen players going up as high as they do now.
That didn't happen.
The leaper gets going with explosion off the ground, and the "lift" takes place shortly thereafter and to the extent of the lifters' arms.
Props who squat before the lift are trying to get the lift going earlier.
That's why you often see so many locks as part of the lifting pod - their height and length of arm puts the jumper into the stratosphere.

 

[Brumby Runner]

I get a sense that Simmons has good leg extension and is lighter than most other locks.
Hence he can explode into the air and get lifted quicker. This plus his ability to call the right lineout option makes him particularly valuable.

For all his lineout capability, Simmons was outjumped yesterday by Cadyrn Neville on at least two occasions close to the Brumbies line. I'm pretty sure Rob hadn't been replaced.

 

[Derpus]

Hooper again busy and Harrison showed that he is promising but still behind Lolesio. In summary, none of the Tahs outplayed their Brumbies counterparts.

To be honest BR the only difference i see between Harrison and Lolesio is the team hey are playing for.

Both are willing to run at the line, both are capable distributors, both have a reasonable kick out of hand (Lolesios dead ball aside) and off the tee and both put a shift in defensively.

Wallabies looking good at 10.

 

[Derpus]

To me it is a misnomer that locks are generally "lifted" I think a better description is that they are held at the top of their leap, the "lifters" then provide stability to hand off the ball or set a maul

Shit how high can you jump on the spot? I get about half a meter haha

 

[KOB1987]

Just can't fathom why the Brumbies aren't last on the ladder. Their defense has so many holes in it.

You are clearly missing the point of my post, but the irony of that moment was still delicious.

Usually when the Tahs aren't going so well I move on to support the best performing other Aussie team at the time, but unfortunately I won't get to do that this season. We will now be subjected to a lifetime of hearing about how 2020 was the year that the Brumbies 'could have, should have, would have' taken home the Super Rugby title.

 

[Rob42]

I watched the first half live, but only now caught up on the second half. Funny how the score is so similar to the Chiefs game, yet I feel much more positive after the Brumbies game. Perhaps with the score, I was expecting a similar shambles, but it wasn't.

The bamtamweight Tahs pack got over the gain line consistently, was very effective in the scrum, and their defence against the Brumbies rolling maul was very pleasing. They need to get the ball out faster when they're going forward though - seemed a few too many delays there, not sure if that's the scrum-half or the support players. Matt Cockbain might be pretty good.

Their attack was generally direct, and only a few penalties for holding on in the tackle - a real improvement there.

You can't ignore 47 points conceded, but the defensive issues looked like miscalculations from young players rather than the effort issues that occurred against the Chiefs. Mark N (Nawaqanitawase) definitely needs to improve that part of his game. And the Brumbies took every one of their opportunities.

I know the pandemic is Much Bigger Than Sport - but what a shame we don't get to see these young Australian teams develop over this season - something really good is building at the Reds, the Brumbies, and perhaps even the Tahs.

 

[Hawko]

I watched the first half live, but only now caught up on the second half. Funny how the score is so similar to the Chiefs game, yet I feel much more positive after the Brumbies game. Perhaps with the score, I was expecting a similar shambles, but it wasn't.

The bamtamweight Tahs pack got over the gain line consistently, was very effective in the scrum, and their defence against the Brumbies rolling maul was very pleasing. They need to get the ball out faster when they're going forward though - seemed a few too many delays there, not sure if that's the scrum-half or the support players. Matt Cockbain might be pretty good.

Their attack was generally direct, and only a few penalties for holding on in the tackle - a real improvement there.

You can't ignore 47 points conceded, but the defensive issues looked like miscalculations from young players rather than the effort issues that occurred against the Chiefs. Mark N (Nawaqanitawase) definitely needs to improve that part of his game. And the Brumbies took every one of their opportunities.

I know the pandemic is Much Bigger Than Sport - but what a shame we don't get to see these young Australian teams develop over this season - something really good is building at the Reds, the Brumbies, and perhaps even the Tahs.

I, too think that there was a lot to like in the Tahs game, and had the game ended up 25-18 that would have been a good reflection of the overall to-and-fro.

There is one other issue that has not been addressed in the thread at all that was extremely significant: At around the sixty minute mark the penalty count was 12-1. Now I am not saying that the Tahs did not deserve to be penalised 12 times in 60 minutes, most of those decisions were absolutely fine with me. But to suggest that the Brumbies only committed one penalisable offence (a scrum offence) in 60 minutes is absolutely ludicrous! At the same time as he whitewashed the Brumbies breakdown and maul work, the Tahs were getting regularly pinged. Now I expect an avalanche of Brumby fans reporting that yes, indeed the Brumbies breakdown work was so good that they didn't offend once in 60 minutes, but it just doesn't wash.

In that 60 minutes not one Brumby throw was called not straight, despite the ball going straight down the line of the Brumbies players and not in the centre of the lineout almost every time. There were multiple forward passes ignored, often 2 or 3 in the one movement. On balance they went about 3:1 the Brumbies way. The Brumbies second try had a blatantly forward pass that was ignored by everyone in the refereeing team. That try caused a major change in game momentum.

Shortly after the yellow card to Dempsey someone must have got a message to Rasivenghe. The previously blameless Brumbies had no less than seven penalties awarded against them in less than 20 minutes. From angels to sinners in the blink of an eye.

Rasivenghe's performance had a major impact in the match outcome. Clearly after 60 minutes the Tahs were beaten and trying to play catch-up. They gave away a couple of tries trying for the miracle ball and running in their 22. The 7-0 penalty count their way didn't help their cause, it only allowed Rasivenghe to say he'd obviously been fair because the penalty count ended up close. But he hadn't.

This is not Rasivenghe's only bad performance this year. Bad referees are a blight on the game and in our game where the decision on whether and who to penalise can be very marginal, if a referee is not constantly reviewing his own performance in game he can leave supporters seething and totally turned off. Those few supporters that are left!

Our season was gone anyway, thanks to Gibson and Hore, so I am under no illusions that the referee ruined our season. But the outpouring of rubbish about how good the Brumbies were was just not justified. They got regularly opened up like a can of sardines by a team full of newbies and has-beens. They are definitely not the assumptive champions they are being portrayed as and Australian rugby is not yet, in my opinion, on the rise. Its still bumping along on the bottom. When the best tight head in Australia got dominated in the first quarter by a first-year just out of U-20's, we have a long way to go.

 

[Rob42]

I, too think that there was a lot to like in the Tahs game, and had the game ended up 25-18 that would have been a good reflection of the overall to-and-fro.

There is one other issue that has not been addressed in the thread at all that was extremely significant: At around the sixty minute mark the penalty count was 12-1. //.

Yeah, I think 25-18 might have been generous to the Tahs, given how the Brums took their chances cf the Tahs. But yeah, the refereeing was very frustrating, that forward pass in the second B try was rank.

I don't think I can agree that Aus rugby is bumping along the bottom though - there are some genuine international-class players in our teams who are being seriously challenged by newcomers - like AAA.

And that game was enjoyable to watch! Not so much of the usual grind of kick to scrum to knock-on to scrum to penalty to lineout error and back to scrum.

 

[Slim 293]

I, too think that there was a lot to like in the Tahs game, and had the game ended up 25-18 that would have been a good reflection of the overall to-and-fro.

There is one other issue that has not been addressed in the thread at all that was extremely significant: At around the sixty minute mark the penalty count was 12-1. Now I am not saying that the Tahs did not deserve to be penalised 12 times in 60 minutes, most of those decisions were absolutely fine with me. But to suggest that the Brumbies only committed one penalisable offence (a scrum offence) in 60 minutes is absolutely ludicrous! At the same time as he whitewashed the Brumbies breakdown and maul work, the Tahs were getting regularly pinged. Now I expect an avalanche of Brumby fans reporting that yes, indeed the Brumbies breakdown work was so good that they didn't offend once in 60 minutes, but it just doesn't wash.

In that 60 minutes not one Brumby throw was called not straight, despite the ball going straight down the line of the Brumbies players and not in the centre of the lineout almost every time. There were multiple forward passes ignored, often 2 or 3 in the one movement. On balance they went about 3:1 the Brumbies way. The Brumbies second try had a blatantly forward pass that was ignored by everyone in the refereeing team. That try caused a major change in game momentum.

Shortly after the yellow card to Dempsey someone must have got a message to Rasivenghe. The previously blameless Brumbies had no less than seven penalties awarded against them in less than 20 minutes. From angels to sinners in the blink of an eye.

Rasivenghe's performance had a major impact in the match outcome. Clearly after 60 minutes the Tahs were beaten and trying to play catch-up. They gave away a couple of tries trying for the miracle ball and running in their 22. The 7-0 penalty count their way didn't help their cause, it only allowed Rasivenghe to say he'd obviously been fair because the penalty count ended up close. But he hadn't.

This is not Rasivenghe's only bad performance this year. Bad referees are a blight on the game and in our game where the decision on whether and who to penalise can be very marginal, if a referee is not constantly reviewing his own performance in game he can leave supporters seething and totally turned off. Those few supporters that are left!

Our season was gone anyway, thanks to Gibson and Hore, so I am under no illusions that the referee ruined our season. But the outpouring of rubbish about how good the Brumbies were was just not justified. They got regularly opened up like a can of sardines by a team full of newbies and has-beens. They are definitely not the assumptive champions they are being portrayed as and Australian rugby is not yet, in my opinion, on the rise. Its still bumping along on the bottom. When the best tight head in Australia got dominated in the first quarter by a first-year just out of U-20's, we have a long way to go.

Kearnsey, is that you?

That last paragraph is especially salty.........

 

[Viking]

So sick of ref blaming. They aren't gods. There are 50/50 calls 100 times in each game. Get over it.

Go play Rugby 08 on xbox if you want black and white reffing.

 

[Viking]

Anyways, did I see Valetini used in a line early on? I hope this continues.

Neville was pretty epic in this game too. Might have put his foot ahead of Simmons in the running for a gold jersey (if Rennie really is choosing on super xv form, and not so much test level experience).

 

[Hawko]

So sick of ref blaming. They aren't gods. There are 50/50 calls 100 times in each game. Get over it.

Go play Rugby 08 on xbox if you want black and white reffing.

You're telling me that if it had been 12-1 the other way you'd have been fine with it? How can a team be penalised once in the first 60 minutes and seven times in the next 20? Are your precious Brumbies a 60 minute team who then turn to illegalities in the last 20? No. If you asked the Brumbies coaches off the record, they'd tell you that they'd had a huge leg-up but they'd had been on the other end in other games too.

The 50-50 calls in games between similar teams usually go 50-50, not 12-1. I said up front the Brumbies were the better team and deserved to win. My post was not sour grapes, my language on here might be perhaps colourful but I sought to be objective. I was appalled at the refereeing. I also reacted to "the brumbies played great, the tahs were rubbish from start to finish" that fills the previous pages.

Watch the game again.

And in reply to Slim, you've been reading my posts on here for years. You know I'm not him and never will be.

 

[Slim 293]

The 50-50 calls in games between similar teams usually go 50-50

Similar teams.........?

 

[Brumby Runner]

Hawko, it seems to me that with some referees, including Rasta, there is a very strong inclination to penalise teams defending in their own 22m area. That might be just a reflection that most teams are more likely to infringe in that area.

The Brumbies had the better of ball possession and attack in opposition 'red zone' earlier in the game, so consistent with the above theory the penalties in that period were heavily weighted against the Tahs. I haven't seen any rational comment yet that any or some of those penalties weren't warranted.

When the Tahs finally put some football together and were attacking in the Brumbies 'red zone' the flow of penalties went heavily in the Tahs favour. All looks very consistent to me, even if I think some referees are more prone to allow things to go unchecked in other areas of the field while being unduly pedantic perhaps once the ball gets into a 'red zone'.

 

[Derpus]

Just as an example BR - it was three redzone penalties and a card for the tahs verse 6 for the Brumbies.I Dont think blindly favouring the attacking team makes you a great ref.

That said, Brumbies clearly the better side on the day and throughout the year.

 

[RoffsChoice]

You generally don't end up on the wrong side of a 10-1 penalty count after an hour without having poorer discipline.​

I think Rasta was a bit whistle happy in both 22s in this game, and not consistently either. I don't think very highly of him as a ref. It feels like a lot of refs have given up on being good after the world cup.

 

[Up the Guts]

I usually quite like refs cutting down on the gamesmanship stuff but it kind of irked me when Rasta was getting basic calls wrong and then proceeding to get on the high horse about Powell hollering and the Tahs passing it into retreating players etc.

 

[Tomikin]

I wonder why Wright didn't start, Muirhead was solid but Wright looks so dangerous with ball in hand.

Ryan Lonergan's goal kicking is very handy too. Not easy kicks too and he's 100%.

Muirhead had a massive game.. he craved up, but its rotation..

 

[Tomikin]

To be honest BR the only difference i see between Harrison and Lolesio is the team hey are playing for.

Both are willing to run at the line, both are capable distributors, both have a reasonable kick out of hand (Lolesios dead ball aside) and off the tee and both put a shift in defensively.

Wallabies looking good at 10.

You back watching Super I thought you just came and bitched at the end that all was crap and watch Highlights ?