Brumbies 2018

[RoffsChoice]

Halfway through the season, and the 2018 threads have begun.

EDIT: SQUAD TRACKING FOR 2018

Hooker:
Josh Mann-Rea (2019)
Robbie Abel (2019)
Folau Fainga'a (EPS) (2018)

Prop:
Ben Alexander (2018)
Scott Sio (2019)
Allan Ala'alatoa (2019)
Les Makin (2019)
Nic Mayhew (2018)
Mees Erasmus - EPS (2018)

Lock:
Blake Enever (2020)
Rory Arnold (2019)
Richie Arnold (2019)
Sam Carter (2019)
Darcy Swain (2018)

Backrow:
David Pocock (2019)
Tom Cusack (2019)
Ben Hyne (2018)
Rob Valetini (2018)
Lolo Fakaosilea (2018)
Lachlan McCaffrey (2018)
Isi Naisarani (2018)

Scrumhalf:
Joe Powell (2018)
Matt Lucas (2019)

Flyhalf:
Wharenui Hawera (2019)
Mack Hansen (2018)

Centre:
Tevita Kuridrani (2019)
Christian Lealiifano (2018)
Kyle Godwin (2018)
Jordan Jackson-Hope (2019)
Andrew Smith (2018)

Wing:
Lausii Tailiauli (2019)
Henry Speight (2018)
James Dargaville (2018)
James Verity-Amm (2018)

Fullback:
Andy Muirhead (2018)

Confirmed Gone:
Saia Fainga'a (London Irish)
Scott Fardy (Leinster)
Anthony Fainga'a (Japan)
Jordan Smiler (Suntory)
Tom Staniforth (Waratahs)
Jarrad Butler (Connacht)
Tomas Cubelli (Argentina)
Chris Alcock (Japan)
Aidan Toua (Japan)
Nick Jooste (Perth NRC)

Contract Up:
Faalelei Sione
Ryan Lonergan
Tom Banks - possibly has an option for 2018

Likely Gone:
Nigel Ah-Wong-Playing for Counties-Manukau

 

[Brumby Runner]

Given that Fardy is off o/s, I would place Jordan Smiler very near the top to be retained (assuming his contract is about to expire).

 

[mst]

I have been fantasying about a Cubelli / Powell, Hawera (10) and Lilo (12) backline! Add in Banks, TK, Henry, and we are close to a super combination. For depth I would still have a crack with JJH @10 as the back up. Dargavillle at either 12/13 as he always looks good in the rare chances he gets there. Jooste should be close and can cut his teeth at 10/12/15 as required.

Keep Smiler definitely. Same with Alcock
Run a Smiler, Alcock, Pocock 6,7,8 combo!
Keep Mayhew.
If we can get Cubelli, I say keep Roo's
Taliauli - I would give one more year to see if he can impress.

Who do we jettison?

Godwin is solid but does't provide enough.
A Smith is also questionable.
The Fainga'a's need to move on.
Toua. His bad outweighs his good. Maybe keep him as a winger?
Butler is now surplus. Doesnt offer much. (i like the bloke but).
Ah Wong - hasn't stepped up

With Vanentini in the wings the 6,7,8 combo i suggested above, either Cusak or Fakaosilea need to make way to free up room.

And, controversially (I expect it will be), I think Carter can go (i like the bloke but). The other cattle provides better and more.

Wants - A good attacking 12 that can run and distribute and brings TK in to games.

R&R suggestions - Send TK to the 7's. If he comes back half as juiced up and reinvigorated as Henry then he will be a real weapon.

 

[mst]

Halfway through the season, and the 2018 threads have begun.

Who should be our coach next year? I'd vote against either McKellar or Fisher, but who else is available?

Which players do we fight to retain? We have 27 players out of contract, and now that Hill has taken over contract negotiations, we can hopefully start working on that problem before we confirm a coach.

I would take Hill over those 2 as HC, but I think Fisher in the development / skills / and to assist with the forwards with Palmer (as the Forwards / scrum coach) could be really good. It would make McKellar surplus to requirements.

I would also keep Ryan.

 

[RugbyReg]

If an Aussie team gets cut then surely we ditch foreign imports?

Assume your 10 is a pure kiwi? Cubelli should be gone too.


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[Slim 293]

Cubelli is a great player, and it would be nice to have him around.......... but we don't need him.

At the start of the year it seemed like we'd be screwed without him but Powell has taken off, and Lonergan by all reports is doing quite well in the U20's so there's our future there with two local products.

As for foreign imports - I think every team should be able to have at least one foreign development player, but definitely we should probably look to cut down on players who don't hold any future eligibility with the Wobs.

 

[Brumby Runner]

RR and Slim - players like Hawera, if they prove to be good enough, will be eligible for the Wallabies after the resident qualifying period. If those types of players aren't to be encouraged, then where would that policy have left Henry Speight and Naivalu? As examples. There are probably quite a few more.

 

[Brumby Runner]

R&R suggestions - Send TK to the 7's. If he comes back half as juiced up and reinvigorated as Henry then he will be a real weapon.

I agree with most of what you have posted MST, but no way I'd be looking to send TK to 7s. He is our (Wallabies) premier No 13 and every week is proving to be better than Kerevi this year. But with Kerevi improving over the next year or two and Rona also coming on at 13, the competition should be enough to keep TK on his toes. And remember, it took over 12 months for Henry to come back to top form at 15s. Wouldn't like to see TK's career put on that sort of hold.

 

[Brumby Jack]

Kuridrani hasn't re-signed yet and Carter has so he won't be going anywhere.

This non contracting thing certainly is helping and the European window for signings for their next season is closing soon so I wouldn't begrudge guys looking that way due to the uncertainty.

Let's hope that Lealiifano gets clearance to play next season too as his work has been greatly missed this year.

 

[Slim 293]

RR and Slim - players like Hawera, if they prove to be good enough, will be eligible for the Wallabies after the resident qualifying period. If those types of players aren't to be encouraged, then where would that policy have left Henry Speight and Naivalu? As examples. There are probably quite a few more.

Hence..........

As for foreign imports - I think every team should be able to have at least one foreign development player

 

[RoffsChoice]

If an Aussie team gets cut then surely we ditch foreign imports?

We're not cutting a Super side due to poor national performance; since expansion to five sides, we've won the Tri Nations, the Rugby Championship, and come second and third at two World Cups.

One of the main reasons that a team is gone is performance. You can put that down to coaching if you'd like (and you'll have a strong case), but the players need to take some blame here as well. If the ARU comes down and says "Brumbies, you can't keep Hawera, but here's Debreczeni." or "Cubelli is gone, but you can sign Louwrens.", I think most fans will be okay with that. If they say "No Mayhew, but here's Pek Cowan.", that's when it's not okay.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

We're not cutting a Super side due to poor national performance; since expansion to five sides, we've won the Tri Nations, the Rugby Championship, and come second and third at two World Cups.

One of the main reasons that a team is gone is performance. You can put that down to coaching if you'd like (and you'll have a strong case), but the players need to take some blame here as well. If the ARU comes down and says "Brumbies, you can't keep Hawera, but here's Debreczeni." or "Cubelli is gone, but you can sign Louwrens.", I think most fans will be okay with that. If they say "No Mayhew, but here's Pek Cowan.", that's when it's not okay.

No way.
Nor Garden-Chipshop.
I thought I heard them say that Mayhew is qualified for the Wallabies by dint of a grandfather - not that that, if true, should be seen as an invitation for Pek Cowan to front up

 

[Forcefield]

With the new 5 year residency all but a given, I'd wager that pathway is cut for most players. You never know when a player will thrive in a different environment with different coaches- maybe Debs would go ace at the Brumbies. Brock James was average at the Force but look how he went at Clermont.

 

[RoffsChoice]

No way.
Nor Garden-Chipshop.

You never know when a player will thrive in a different environment with different coaches- maybe Debs would go ace at the Brumbies. Brock James was average at the Force but look how he went at Clermont.

We really do have a pedigree of developing talent here in Canberra, or at least getting the best out of what is already there. Debreczeni has all the physical and mental attributes, now he just needs the skills, and we can give him that.

Agree on Chipshop. Any Wellington NPC fan knows just how much trouble he is; I'm amazed the Rebels went anywhere near him.

I thought I heard them say that Mayhew is qualified for the Wallabies by dint of a grandfather - not that that, if true, should be seen as an invitation for Pek Cowan to front up

Mayhew was just the example (apologies to Pek Cowan). If he's Wallabies eligible, these injuries to Sio and Slipper (and now Daley, apparently) are his gateway to a gold jersey.

 

[mst]

What has the Brumbies done to deserve Debreczeni?

Mayhew does qualify.

No players should be pushed on to teams.

Lets get back to the Brumbies 2018.

 

[Brumby Runner]

Does anybody have a consolidated list showing the current contract status of the squad members? Would be a good starting point for further discussion.

 

[eastman]

I agree with most of what you have posted MST, but no way I'd be looking to send TK to 7s. He is our (Wallabies) premier No 13 and every week is proving to be better than Kerevi this year. But with Kerevi improving over the next year or two and Rona also coming on at 13, the competition should be enough to keep TK on his toes. And remember, it took over 12 months for Henry to come back to top form at 15s. Wouldn't like to see TK's career put on that sort of hold.

How exactly has Kuridrani showed that he is the premier 13 in this country and better than Kerevi? It wasn't against the Blues, Rebels or Hurricanes. An ability to use his big frame to score close range tries doesn't make him so. I thikn Kerevi has a bigger upside, just needs to fix his reads in defense.

 

[Slim 293]

He's the Wallaby incumbent and was in excellent form for them in their most recent tests..........

His Soup form this year hasn't been too bad overall, but yes he's been average with along with a number of other players in recent weeks.

Still, he should retain the 13 jersey for the Wobs first test......... and that discussion is probably for another thread.

 

[RoffsChoice]

Does anybody have a consolidated list showing the current contract status of the squad members? Would be a good starting point for further discussion.

According to Wiki, these are the players who are out of contract at the end of the year:

• Ben Alexander
• Les Makin
• Nic Mayhew
• Faalelei Sione
• Robbie Abel
• Saia Fainga'a
• Josh Mann-Rea
• Blake Enever
• Chris Alcock
• Tom Cusack
• Jordan Smiler
• Rob Valetini
• Jarrad Butler
• Ben Hyne
• Tomas Cubelli
• De Wet Roos
• Wharenui Hawera
• Nick Jooste
• Isaac Thompson
• Anthony Fainga'a
• Jordan Jackson-Hope
• Tevita Kuridrani
• Andrew Smith
• Nigel Ah Wong
• James Dargaville
• Lausii Taliauli
• Tom Banks
• Aidan Toua

 

[RoffsChoice]

To put it another way, this is the team we could make with contracted players:
1. Scott Sio
2. -
3. Allan Ala'alatoa
4. Rory Arnold
5. Sam Carter
6. Tom Staniforth
7. David Pocock
8. Lolo Fakaosilea
9. Joe Powell
10. Christian Lealiifano
11. Henry Speight
12. Kyle Godwin
13. -
14. -
15. -

Who of those contracted players shouldn't be starting? Who fills the gaps?