Blues vs Stormers - R12 - 03 May 13

[Rassie]

Actually DeVillers has been a disappointment in attack for the Boks for a few years. He is a "solid" option with good game awareness. I have always felt the Bok backline would be better with someone more dynamic. Perhaps this year Serfontein will replace him?? No, probably not.

You do not get more dynamic than De Villiers. But it all depend who you partner him with. Look at Fourie and De VIlliers? Ran holes through the Aussie defense

 

[johnshailer]

Agree about the De VIlliers part but the Blues kicked 6 penalties and the Stormers scored 2 tries? Confuse on who got the uninspiring attack?

In reality the game was decided by a dubious breakdown penalty. Assistant referee had adjudged that the ball had come off a Stormers player off a kick, when really it was Rene Ranger that it came off. It was quite clear on television, and was an unforgiveable mistake at a key moment of the game. Again Stormers have been unlucky with the calls and that is what can make or break a season due sides being so close. Did Blues deserve to win it? Well what do they normally say when you only score by kicks and fail to score a try in NZ?

The Stormers were reffed out of the game! Bekkers disallowed try; in the last quarter high tackle on Habana ignored and shortly afterwards the Stormers penalised for a similar incident; Stormers penalised for marginal forward pass and shortly after blatant forward to Saili ignored in front of the posts; Ali Williams allowed to come down side of the rolling maul; Shreuder penalised for not feeding a collapsing scrum; and the crucial lineout throw-in decision against Jangies. I am a Waratahs supporter and no great fan of Bok sides, but we need to have neutral refs for all games - there are plenty available. The Bulls suffered similar problems on their recent tour - eg dubious penalty on the bell to get the Reds home!

 

[Rassie]

Ok I'll slow it down a little.

To suggest that any player can be continuously lucky over a 12 year career is absurd. The guy knows how to get himself into the right place at the right time.

So good getting himself into the right positions, hard straight runner, good on defense. That's it. Limited, but super effective.

Is it what we need for the Boks? No.

Are we getting there?

Blue Bulls test 101

What you think about Naas Botha? Did he kick and drop anything away?

 

[Rassie]

The Stormers were reffed out of the game! Bekkers disallowed try; in the last quarter high tackle on Habana ignored and shortly afterwards the Stormers penalised for a similar incident; Stormers penalised for marginal forward pass and shortly after blatant forward to Saili ignored in front of the posts; Ali Williams allowed to come down side of the rolling maul; Shreuder penalised for not feeding a collapsing scrum; and the crucial lineout throw-in decision against Jangies. I am a Waratahs supporter and no great fan of Bok sides, but we need to have neutral refs for all games - there are plenty available. The Bulls suffered similar problems on their recent tour - eg dubious penalty on the bell to get the Reds home!

Rule 1 subsection 14 paragraph 16 states thou shall not blame the referee for thy bad place kicking. If they kicked better they would have won. Its done and dusted. Lets move on rather

 

[Blue]

Blue Bulls test 101

What you think about Naas Botha? Did he kick and drop anything away?

I really have no idea what you are asking me.

 

[Rassie]

I really have no idea what you are asking me.

What are your thoughts about Naas Botha when he was still playing?

 

[Brisbok]

While you're at it Blue, how do you think a combination of Fourie du Preez and Naas would go with Os du Randt and Bismarck in the front row, Matfield and Etzebeth as the locks and Andre Joubert at fullback?

 

[FrankLind]

Rassie, you are making no sense. I am sure there is a point in there somewhere. What is it?

 

[Rassie]

Rassie, you are making no sense. I am sure there is a point in there somewhere. What is it?

My point is perception and misconception mate. Players may have looked one dimensional or taunted of being weak in certain areas where actual facts suggest otherwise.

Normally that is created by opposition supporters from North and South rivals to brand players and kick start a bandwagon. Best example of a bandwagon was the Naas Botha one. There is another one that is the JdV one.

 

[Brisbok]

There is another one that is the JdV one.

I think you'll find that the original post on JdV being one-dimensional was from an Australian fan who follows the Force. Nothing to do with a North/South rivalry and the poster probably isn't even aware that the rivalry exists. Blue disagreed and basically suggested that JdV was a far better player than what the poster had suggested. Now you are turning it into a North vs South argument?

 

[Rassie]

I think you'll find that the original post on JdV being one-dimensional was from an Australian fan who follows the Force. Nothing to do with a North/South rivalry and the poster probably isn't even aware that the rivalry exists. Blue disagreed and basically suggested that JdV was a far better player than what the poster had suggested. Now you are turning it into a North vs South argument?

I am not talking about Blue mate. You get two sets up Blue Bulls fans in the modern day. I am just trying to find out with which type of Blue Bulls Fan I am having a conversation with.

It is the Internet and everyone is a stranger to one another and it is wrong and not very polite to generalize. If you look I said normally.

You must understand and probably as you are aware of its hard to having a rugby convo with some supporters of the South African sides. The North and South ones I do try to avoid because I want to hear about my ma se goeters.

So I have this way I thought up personally to find out if they class as one of those. You can do it with WP fans as well.

Like you said he knows nothing about the North vs South rivalry so I will take your word for it. But I am new here so I do not know much about the users here or their habits. I am still learning that.

 

[Blue]

What are your thoughts about Naas Botha when he was still playing?

I don't know if you are trying to relate those days to the present because it won't make sense.

Naas was my Grade one Phys Ed teacher in Pretoria. It was the year after he made the Bulls starting team.

My father' company was a sponsor at Loftus so we spent a lot of time at the stadium and got close to the teams at training.

Needless to say if you were 7 years old a and that close the Bulls you were convinced that Naas was indeed the second coming.

Awesome player in his day and there has still not been a better kicking 10 in the world to this day. The team perfectly cpompensated for his defensive incompetence. The trophy cabinet spoke volumes.

But I think I hit a nerve with you with my comments on JdV and you are trying to somehow counter with an argument about a Bulls flyhalf in the eighties.

If that is the case I really have not a clue what you are on about.

PS I would not use "creative" and "JdV" in the same sentence but that does not imply that he isn't a great player, which he is. Creativity is not why he is so good though. He is part and parcel of the problem that the Stormers are the most incompetent team when it comes to converting possession and pressure into points. They have this amazing inability to finish teams off when they have them on the rack. It cost them the trophy last year and it just carreid on this year. Having aa rash and bash 12 is not helping. Neither van Aswegen or JDV are effective distributors.

 

[Blue]

While you're at it Blue, how do you think a combination of Fourie du Preez and Naas would go with Os du Randt and Bismarck in the front row, Matfield and Etzebeth as the locks and Andre Joubert at fullback?

No. Go look at their star signs.

Venus completely fucks it up. Had it comes into Saturns moon a day earlier yes but sadly no chance.

 

[Blue]

I am not talking about Blue mate. You get two sets up Blue Bulls fans in the modern day. I am just trying to find out with which type of Blue Bulls Fan I am having a conversation with.

It is the Internet and everyone is a stranger to one another and it is wrong and not very polite to generalize. If you look I said normally.

You must understand and probably as you are aware of its hard to having a rugby convo with some supporters of the South African sides. The North and South ones I do try to avoid because I want to hear about my ma se goeters.

So I have this way I thought up personally to find out if they class as one of those. You can do it with WP fans as well.

Like you said he knows nothing about the North vs South rivalry so I will take your word for it. But I am new here so I do not know much about the users here or their habits. I am still learning that.

I still don't know what that has to do with my perception of JdV .

So drumming up rivalries from the 80's makes no sense.

I want the Stormers to do well. It gives me the shits that they are stuck with a backline coaching team that has proven itself to be utterly incompetent other than on defense.

 

[Rassie]

I still don't know what that has to do with my perception of JdV .

So drumming up rivalries from the 80's makes no sense.

I want the Stormers to do well. It gives me the shits that they are stuck with a backline coaching team that has proven itself to be utterly incompetent other than on defense.

I am not muttering on about the 80 I do not get into arguments with some BB fans due to the reason they can't look past the gates of Loftus and I try to avoid those. Don't if you live in SA or not but they still peed of that Spoes is not captain instead of JdV so the bandwagon starting rolling everytime with a new story. He don't do that he don't do that he does that too much on and on. Provincialism is there and it will probably always be there until centralized contract system is used.

Stormers do the best with what they go. They got 2 inside centers, playing a youngster on loosie, a loosie on hooker and the third choice flyhalf who is basically a stop gap. Then instead of losing every loosie this year they lost the wings and backup is thin. You must understand the Stormers do not get as much as Lotto money and grands as the Bulls did and what they get they pump into development for the region because its a big region with a huge amount of schools. So there is no money to go to Grey and stick a Bulls contract in his lunch box. The Bulls do that with their Lotto money. Feel kind of sorry for them as they are seen as one of the last pillars of the Afrikaner. That is why the Baberton daisy disappeared and that is why they play away in a different strip so on so on.

Also you must remember SA style needs to readjusted every time we win something due to the IRB for some reason adjust the laws every time that happens. Probably a coincidence I don't know probably not can't say. But I do know without space the world best attacking back line would useless and that can only be done by your tight five and your loosies. At the moment the tight five is doing ok or Bekker was doing ok but the quick recycles and speed to collisions is not there. Putting Jantjies on 10 will not do anything as its suicide to spread the ball when its slow.

Luckily the Kiwi's have shown a weakness as in their quest to play the perfect Harlem Globe Trotter rugby they somehow forgot to teach their players how to defend a maul legally.

But lets not take credit away from the Blues defense which is still well drilled but the Stormers did cross the Wipe wash twice their opponents none. They still lost.

I would like to see Coetzee moving Habana to 13 though and I would like them to go search for a new good 10 with all that money that will be freed up when Habana goes. Even if they have to go and get Ebershon back from Australia

 

[Blue]

I think they should invest in Jantjes and look for another youngster but they should clean house and get a a new coaching team.

With the roster the Stormers have had for the last few years they have totally under performed.

Coetzee and Fleck are not cutting it on attack. Time to get someone who does.

 

[Blue]

DHL STORMERS:15. Joe Pietersen, 14. Gio Aplon,13. Juan de Jongh, 12. Jean de Villiers (captain), 11. Bryan Habana, 10. Gary van Aswegen, 9. Dewaldt Duvenage, 8. Duane Vermeulen, 7. Rynhardt Elstadt, 6. Siya Kolisi, 5. Andries Bekker, 4. Eben Etzebeth, 3. Frans Malherbe, 2. Deon Fourie, 1. Steven Kitshoff.
Replacements: 16. Scarra Ntubeni, 17. Pat Cilliers, 18. Don Armand, 19. Nizaam Carr, 20. Louis Schreuder, 21. Elton Jantjies, 22. Gerhard van den Heever.

 

[PaarlBok]

Great to see Ysterbeth starting.