Bledisloe # 3 - Saturday 31st October, ANZ Stadium

[Viking]

Yeah I agree Hodge isn’t the answer at 10. But in the absence of a standout option at 15, his boot would be useful at the back and he’s solid under the high ball.
With a midfield that’s misfiring put him in the pocket in our half and kick it long and out.
Leave him at the back when we’re on attack in their half.
Worth a try.

I like the idea of Hodge at 15. DHP was woeful. I was a big Banks Critic asking for him to be dropped for his lack of attack, but at least he defused bombs and gave us a extra 10 metre touch finders.

I wouldn't mind seeing how Maddocks goes at 15 but I'm worried about his high ball skills, I think Hodge may be a better option. Or maybe a left field option would be Tom Wright who can kick and run also.

Or maybe we just sacrifice some attack and go back to Banks. He was a big reason we got a draw in Wellington as he was so solid at the back. I feel the scoreboard would be a bit less if he played in Sydney. But its a bit of a waste if the weather is good.

 

[ACT Crusader]

League hookers and halfbacks are virtually interchangeable. The league 5/8 is more like a union 9, but one that can play 10. Ricky Stewart as an example

Most league halfbacks avoid tackling unlike hookers and locks who tackle the house down, which is what Hooper does. Also most, not all, halfbacks have decent kicking games, which I’m not sure Hooper has.

Anyway beware the league playmaker convert I reckon. Centres, wings okay, but the game has moved on a bit since Sticky picked up a Gilbert.

 

[Viking]

Everyone needs to get off Lolesio’s back. When Lolesio was announced at starting flyhalf it was because there were no other options due to our most experienced backline players being injured. White played the most woeful game I have seen from him and Lolesio didn’t have JOC (James O'Connor) or To'omua on the inside to assist with leadership and line control. If all other backs were on form Lolesio would have had a more organised game. It was a massive step up with no support. IMO he was doomed before the game stated. I think we leave him there with hope that either JOC (James O'Connor) or To'omua are fit to play at inside centre next week. Bringing in Stewart or Harrison is not going to fix the problems we had last night, it would only exacerbate them.
On a positive note, I thought Wilson, McDermott and Petaia played well considering the circumstances.

I agree. Lolesio struggled but was a huge ask. He will get another shot and he's still the best option if JOC (James O'Connor)/To'omua are injured.

I also don't understand hiding him at the back, he got caught out on defense twice which would have hurt his confidence even more. He is just as good at defending as JOC (James O'Connor) so they should have played him the same way.

Wilson and Petaia were solid but I still feel they throw away too much ball. They have lost possession by throwing an offload or spilling the pill every game now. Same with Hunter Paisami. They would all look right at home at Test if they can be more clinical in this area.

Tate was the shining light for me. He looked threatening and added some much needed spark. He was the only player that impressed.

 

[Viking]

He does actually. Prior to Lolesios performance in the final most had Harrison ahead of him.

Regardless, that backline I put out was a look to the future, nothing to lose kind of thing.

I think the fact Harrison played for a very underperforming Tahs gives most people the impression he isn't ready for test rugby. and then the fact Lolesio was part of a winning Brumbies and a great grand final performance we had the opposite thoughts.

I think the reality is their skills and form are only shades apart. Lolesio certainly deserved to start ahead (for his GF performance) but now that he has and failed miserably, maybe it's not the best idea to throw Harrison to the wolves also.

 

[TSR]

I also don't understand hiding him at the back, he got caught out on defense twice which would have hurt his confidence even more. He is just as good at defending as JOC (James O'Connor) so they should have played him the same way.

They did. O’Connor defends at the back too.

 

[Highkicks]

It was an off night, second week in a row. Agree it’s ridiculous to put players to the side after that, especially young ones on debut. The AB’s players usually lift to another level when they put that jersey on, we on the other hand had a lot of players performing well below their potential.

It really is a horrible cycle for us. These guys train incredibly hard all year, then get absolutely slaughtered game after game. They’re essentially getting punished for all their efforts, which is mentally almost impossible to overcome. I really don’t think we have a bad crop of players or have for the last 20 years. Just my take on it.

 

[Kenny Powers]

From a Paul Cully article before the Wellington test

Dave Rennie and co must be wary about pitchforking too many youngsters into the side to face the All Blacks in Wellington on Sunday.

It is unavoidable that there will be debutants, but selecting Brumbies No.10 Noah Lolesio would be putting a target on his back and the Kiwis have already indicated this year they think they can rattle him.

When the Brumbies lost to the Highlanders in Canberra at the start of the year, the Highlanders selected Sio Tomkinson at No.14 but used him at No.10 on defence, and Lolesio produced his worst game of the year after being targeted by the Samoan hitman.

Lolesio’s time will come, but James O’Connor’s time is now after taking a seven-year ‘scenic route’ journey back in to the Wallabies No.10 jersey.

 

[A mutterer]

I agree. Lolesio struggled but was a huge ask. He will get another shot and he's still the best option if JOC (James O'Connor)/To'omua are injured.

I also don't understand hiding him at the back, he got caught out on defense twice which would have hurt his confidence even more. He is just as good at defending as JOC (James O'Connor) so they should have played him the same way.

Wilson and Petaia were solid but I still feel they throw away too much ball. They have lost possession by throwing an offload or spilling the pill every game now. Same with Hunter Paisami. They would all look right at home at Test if they can be more clinical in this area.

Tate was the shining light for me. He looked threatening and added some much needed spark. He was the only player that impressed.

hope lolesio doesnt read any forums or social media after a huge baptism by fire. he didnt have a great game, but neither did simone outside him and with white spraying his passing every where he had no support either side. simone was poor and i think a couple of his defensive misreads lead to tries, definitely more pressure on the players outside.

up front we seem to be focused on winning the scrums, and not losing our own lineouts - but not really contesting theirs. hard to really make much of some of the performances when the defensive systems seemed to be very different from previous games. we certainly didnt bring the same kicking game as previously. seemed like hooper played ok, but was covering a lot of ground defensively. LSL (Lukhan Salakaia-Loto) and philips looked good on a couple of runs, slipper made some nice tackles.

i'm ok with wilson and jp trying to do too much, a cooler head and clinical execution will grow over time. daugunu needs to pull his head in and stop talking silly stuff and eliminate the silly stuff from his game.

for the 4th game, would have to think that rennie takes the game plan back to basics particularly if he is going to make more changes and experiment with players.

 

[Viking]

They did. O’Connor defends at the back too.

All 10's drop back on occassion. I feel Lolesio did it twice as much as JOC (James O'Connor). Maybe I'm wrong.

 

[Viking]

It was an off night, second week in a row. Agree it’s ridiculous to put players to the side after that, especially young ones on debut. The AB’s players usually lift to another level when they put that jersey on, we on the other hand had a lot of players performing well below their potential.

It really is a horrible cycle for us. These guys train incredibly hard all year, then get absolutely slaughtered game after game. They’re essentially getting punished for all their efforts, which is mentally almost impossible to overcome. I really don’t think we have a bad crop of players or have for the last 20 years. Just my take on it.

I disagree. I think there is a clear difference in the level of basic skills across the board from our players compared to the AB's. Maybe a bad crop is a little harsh but we certainly don't have a solid crop to work with. Coach after coach it's the same result - which is a pretty good indicator the coach ain't the problem, the players are.

 

[TSR]

Everyone needs to get off Lolesio’s back. When Lolesio was announced at starting flyhalf it was because there were no other options due to our most experienced backline players being injured. White played the most woeful game I have seen from him and Lolesio didn’t have JOC (James O'Connor) or To'omua on the inside to assist with leadership and line control. If all other backs were on form Lolesio would have had a more organised game. It was a massive step up with no support. IMO he was doomed before the game stated. I think we leave him there with hope that either JOC (James O'Connor) or To'omua are fit to play at inside centre next week. Bringing in Stewart or Harrison is not going to fix the problems we had last night, it would only exacerbate them.
On a positive note, I thought Wilson, McDermott and Petaia played well considering the circumstances.

Agree 100% that people need to be realistic in their expectations of Lolesio.

I did think at half time that this test that debunked the old truism that forwards win matches, backs decide by how much.

Not to say our forward pack was great in the first half - but all the damage was being done in the backs. DHP unfortunately had a shocker and that was the worst half of football I think I’ve seen Petaia play. White was ordinary. I love Daugunu, but he had a shocker too and all the rest had their poor moments. The ABs just had to keep kicking the ball downtown and let our backs hand it back to them one way or another. It’s very tough to be a forward in those circumstances.

 

[TSR]

I disagree. I think there is a clear difference in the level of basic skills across the board from our players compared to the AB's. Maybe a bad crop is a little harsh but we certainly don't have a solid crop to work with. Coach after coach it's the same result - which is a pretty good indicator the coach ain't the problem, the players are.

I agree there is a gap, but I remain confident the current crop of guys are the best group we’ve seen for 30 yrs. But they need time. They’ll have some good results and some ordinary ones, but if we can keep this crop together and this coaching group I remain very confident they’ll be much better in 2 yrs.

 

[Cancelled Account]

I think the fact Harrison played for a very underperforming Tahs gives most people the impression he isn't ready for test rugby. and then the fact Lolesio was part of a winning Brumbies and a great grand final performance we had the opposite thoughts.

I think the reality is their skills and form are only shades apart. Lolesio certainly deserved to start ahead (for his GF performance) but now that he has and failed miserably, maybe it's not the best idea to throw Harrison to the wolves also.

I think it’s important to establish our future flyhalf options going into the next World Cup, because many are getting confused with a structured flyhalf and a ball running/defensive inside centre.
My take:
FLYHALF
JOC (James O'Connor) - for now
Lolesio - for now. Not strong enough in defence for inside centre
Will Harrison
Carter Gordon
Mason Gordon

INSIDE CENTRE (Back up flyhalf)
Matt To'omua
JOC (James O'Connor)
Reesjan Pasitoa
Irae Simone
Bayley Kenuzle (?) Needs to find his legs
Hamish Stewart (?) 2021 will be the year to prove himself

Ben Donaldson would be my wild card depending on 2021. Moving him to fullback would be my suggestion.

 

[Highkicks]

I disagree. I think there is a clear difference in the level of basic skills across the board from our players compared to the AB's. Maybe a bad crop is a little harsh but we certainly don't have a solid crop to work with. Coach after coach it's the same result - which is a pretty good indicator the coach ain't the problem, the players are.

Wasn’t suggesting the coach is the problem. The mental side is the biggest issue for me, maybe I’m imagining but within the first 5 minutes it was obvious we had not turned up and they had. Sure I don’t think we have the caliber of players the AB’s do across the park but I don’t think we’re 40 points off either. Most of the guys starting had good super seasons where they weren’t regularly making the errors they did this game.

Halves is certainly an area we are developing though. I really doubt there was anyone, who on debut, in last nights game would have played well at 10. As mentioned above Cruden had a poor debut in a much better team. It’s a very difficult situation for us.

 

[Viking]

I think it’s important to establish our future flyhalf options going into the next World Cup, because many are getting confused with a structured flyhalf and a ball running/defensive inside centre.
My take:
FLYHALF
JOC (James O'Connor) - for now
Lolesio - for now. Not strong enough in defence for inside centre
Will Harrison
Carter Gordon
Mason Gordon

INSIDE CENTRE (Back up flyhalf)
Matt To'omua
JOC (James O'Connor)
Reesjan Pasitoa
Irae Simone
Bayley Kenuzle (?) Needs to find his legs
Hamish Stewart (?) 2021 will be the year to prove himself

Ben Donaldson would be my wild card depending on 2021. Moving him to fullback would be my suggestion.

Kerevi coming back at some stage would disrupt the second playmaker at 12 option. Then we will really need a second playmaker at fullback. Maddocks and the Red's player (forgot his name) are probably the options there. Maybe Hodge.

 

[Dctarget]

From a Paul Cully article before the Wellington test

Dave Rennie and co must be wary about pitchforking too many youngsters into the side to face the All Blacks in Wellington on Sunday.

It is unavoidable that there will be debutants, but selecting Brumbies No.10 Noah Lolesio would be putting a target on his back and the Kiwis have already indicated this year they think they can rattle him.

When the Brumbies lost to the Highlanders in Canberra at the start of the year, the Highlanders selected Sio Tomkinson at No.14 but used him at No.10 on defence, and Lolesio produced his worst game of the year after being targeted by the Samoan hitman.

Lolesio’s time will come, but James O’Connor’s time is now after taking a seven-year ‘scenic route’ journey back in to the Wallabies No.10 jersey.

Good pick up.

 

[Cancelled Account]

Kerevi coming back at some stage would disrupt the second playmaker at 12 option. Then we will really need a second playmaker at fullback. Maddocks and the Red's player (forgot his name) are probably the options there. Maybe Hodge.

Kerevi. Yes yes and yes.
There is a young kid in the QLD Development squad, Mac Grealy who I see as our future Wallabies fullback, but he’ll need to get some game time in late 2021 to make the cut for the Wallabies squad Workd Cup team. I wouldn’t want to rush him like we have done with this year’s Wallabies squad and I don’t agree with coaches starting fullbacks out on the wing. It’s two completely different positions.

 

[Quick Hands]

The players sang the nation anthem with pride and passion (probably the best of any Australian sporting team for a while)and tried their guts out on the field.

They played their best but weren't good enough; too many pushed passes, too many poor kicks under pressure and too many basic little errors which put them back under pressure again and again. These habits are learnt over time during the player development phase, not in a few weeks in the national team. (I think Rennie is a good coach, but note that he hasn't come through an RA coach development process - QED)

Talking of changes is just shuffling the deck chairs on the Titanic. This is what 20 years of chaotic mismanagement and lack of strategic direction looks like. It has resulted in dysfunctional player and coach development systems and processes. This all needs to be fixed before anything other that what we have witnessed over the past few games and few years is going to happen.

The players are a product of the system which has developed them and any potential replacements will have the same strengths and weaknesses.

 

[Viking]

Kerevi. Yes yes and yes.
There a young kid in the QLD Development squad, Mac Grealy who I see as our future Wallabies fullback, but he’ll need to get some game time in late 2021 to make the cut for the Wallabies squad Workd Cup team. I wouldn’t want to rush him like we have done with this year’s Wallabies squad and I don’t agree with coaches starting fullbacks out on the wing. It’s two completely different positions.

I agree, DHP and Banks are usually solid fullbacks but both are horrible wingers.

 

[Kenny Powers]

Kervei is not the answer. Did improve his defensive skills to a minimal acceptable standard at an international level. Has gone to Japan to play in a competition that would not be testing and improving his defensive weaknesses he will have gone backwards in this area.

You go to Japan for the money not to test yourself and develop your skills.