Australian Schoolboys & National Championships 2012

[motherof3]

I've heard that Andrew Kellaway is in the Australian U18 sevens team...anyone aware who else is in the team?

Apparently the team will be competing in the Youth Olympic Games in early 2013

I didn't think they would name the team this early. How did you come to hear about Andrew Kellaway?

 

[DodgeBallTragic]

I didn't think they would name the team this early. How did you come to hear about Andrew Kellaway?

U18 Australian 7's team, that would have to have a few boys from the investec 7's schoolboys finals wouldn't it? such as: LMRDT, Riverview, Scotts...? Or will they just utilize there NGS players? Be interesting to see if there are any Indigenous boys from that winning LMRDT 7's team, they should feature in any future national 7's teams....just naturals they are made for the 7's concept.

 

[CTPE]

I didn't think they would name the team this early. How did you come to hear about Andrew Kellaway?

Apparently it's a squad rather than a team. I haven't seen a list of players but heard from a Scot's parent that Andew Kellaway and a number of other gun schoolboys are in it. The reason they are focusing on schoolboys is that to be a member of the team youi have to be U18 at 1 January 2013?

 

[Freddo Frog]

That will rule out most Yr 12 players as they almost all turn 18 during their last year at school, so they'd be looking at Yr 11's. Kellaway is definitely in the squad, but as far as I'm aware no team has been announced yet.

 

[Next Marshall]

early predictions for a 15?

Henry Clunies ROSS for australian schoolboys fullback

 

[motherof3]

Apparently it's a squad rather than a team. I haven't seen a list of players but heard from a Scot's parent that Andew Kellaway and a number of other gun schoolboys are in it. The reason they are focusing on schoolboys is that to be a member of the team youi have to be U18 at 1 January 2013?

Thanks CTPE, maybe if someone knows where we can find a list of the squad or a link to more info about the Aus 7's they could let us know.

 

[rugbyfan]

Clint Gutherson has signed with Manly for the next 4 years. He was the fullback in NSW 1's last year. He also played in the Commonweath 7s. What also made me laugh was reading that after he had signed he was offered a deal by the ARU.

Does anyone else find it frustrating how these players earn spots in their respective state and national sides over their fellow competitors from other schools, only to leave the code to go to Rugby League? I mean its robbing these shadow players from having the opportunity to make a name for themselves and get involved in higher class rugby. I know that coaches and fellow forum'ers can argue that each state and national team want to pick their best possible team, but can't argue that isn't it future depth that Australian Rugby is searching for? It just seems that we are nursing these players who have the intention of going to League even before they leave school, only to be left seeing their backs when they walk away from our game.

 

[lily]

I dont have a problem with it. If you bar them then they will never return. Remember that many will. Case in point is Sione Ala who played ISA then went to the Sea Eagles 20s and now is the leading point scorer in the Shute Shield.

 

[I like to watch]

A poor choice to make your point Lily, it's not like he would have been bombarded with offers to play elsewhere this year.
He only played ISA 2's and didn't make the top 15 at School.
He has hardly taken away someones chance to make a name for themselves when playing ISA 2's.

 

[lily]

I'm aware that Alex Franklin and Josh Griffiths were ahead of him at school and in ISA selections. I used him as an example because of what he has done this year. He would also be on better coin playing with Narraweena than the Marlins.

 

[no9]

I dont have a problem with it. If you bar them then they will never return. Remember that many will. Case in point is Sione Ala who played ISA then went to the Sea Eagles 20s and now is the leading point scorer in the Shute Shield.

I agree with not barring them. I think its more about asking for them to decare their intentions. The league clubs have no problem asking young players to sign a document of allegiance (contract) that precludes them playing other codes so why couldn't rugby produce a document that commits a young player to a rugby pathway that extends to 12/24 months beyond their school committments have completed if they want to be considered for state and national selection. This might just make those who really have no intention of continuing in the game to consider their intentions without stopping them playing for clubs or schools.

 

[Nusadan]

Can put a clause in these documents to reimburse AFRU etc, for costs of supporting these players prior to them being taken up by the league clubs...it could easily be in the $10k area which would make them to think about it twice before committing to a tour with the Australian schoolboys to Europe playing union...the league clubs would baulk at paying these kind of monies on the players' behalf should these players are approached/signed up in the aftermath of the tour.

 

[CTPE]

I agree with not barring them. I think its more about asking for them to decare their intentions. The league clubs have no problem asking young players to sign a document of allegiance (contract) that precludes them playing other codes so why couldn't rugby produce a document that commits a young player to a rugby pathway that extends to 12/24 months beyond their school committments have completed if they want to be considered for state and national selection. This might just make those who really have no intention of continuing in the game to consider their intentions without stopping them playing for clubs or schools.

The ARU took some positive steps in this area late last year when they selected their NGS squads by omitting some players who would have been expected to be there but weren't selected because they held current contracts with League teams.

 

[Newbie]

I agree with not barring them. I think its more about asking for them to decare their intentions. The league clubs have no problem asking young players to sign a document of allegiance (contract) that precludes them playing other codes so why couldn't rugby produce a document that commits a young player to a rugby pathway that extends to 12/24 months beyond their school committments have completed if they want to be considered for state and national selection. This might just make those who really have no intention of continuing in the game to consider their intentions without stopping them playing for clubs or schools.

With respect to your comments i think the rugby gods have listened as this year will be an interesting scenario for the 'DUAL CODIES' as I now refer to them (a new phrase for the Macquarie dictionary perhaps ... lol).

As fate would have it the 'Australian Secondary Schools Rugby League Championship' ('ASSRL') is being held in Port Macquarie from 8-13 July where NSWCCC will be defending their title. Custom and practice connotes that both the NSWCHS and NSWCCC teams will go into camp in the week preceding the ASSRL Championship (NSWCCC actually go into camp on 4 July).

As it stands the Australian Schools Rugby Championship is being held from 2-8 July. I know this will not effect the GPS and CAS players vying for selection in the NSW school teams, however there are some talented 'DUAL CODIES' from the CHS and CCC system that have a chance of being selected. As such they will have to make an important election this year! Some that I know of are:

Fabian Natoli - Manly SG Ball 2011-12, NSWSRU II VX 2011, Australian U/18 Sevens Rep 2011.
Tepai Moeroa - Parra SG Ball 2012, NSWSRU U/16 2011, NSWRL U/16 2011
Clint Gutherson - Manly SG Ball 2011-12, NSWSRU I VX 2011, Australian U/18 Sevens Rep
Taane Milne - Roosters SG Ball 2012, NSWSRU U/16 2011, Australian RL U/15 2010
Michael Morgan - Bulldogs SG Ball 2012, NSWSRU U/16 2011, NSWRL U/16 2011, NSWCCC RL U/18 2011

The reason why I have suggested these lads is due to the stage they are at in their league careers. Presently each has a decent chance of making Australian RL Schoolboys team in 2012, and given that is a standard term in most junior rugby league contracts for a bonus payment ranging from $3000-$5000 for making either of the NSWCHS, NSWCCC, or QSSRL U/18 team; and again for selection in the Australian Schoolboys team there are some fairly big carrots on offer!

With respect to last year's ASSRL Championship Gutherson did not seek selection in the NSWCHS U/18's however I believe this will now change. Milne I believe made it to the penultimate step in the NSWCHS league selection trials. Moeroa didn't seek selection in NSWCIS U/18's (which he easily would have made). Natoli and Morgan both competed at NSWCCC trials but only Morgan made it through.

In addition most of the lads above are now training with their respective team's Toyota Cup squad. I believe Gutherson has actually trained with the Manly first grade squad, such is his profile and talent. I do know that he is shoe in for the NSWRL U/18 'State of Origin' team this year. It is interesting to note that both Gutherson and Natoli made the NSWRL U/16 State of Origin team in 2010.

2012 will definitely not be a 'have your cake and eat it year' for the above lads!

Regards,
Newbie

 

[no9]

With respect to your comments i think the rugby gods have listened as this year will be an interesting scenario for the 'DUAL CODIES' as I now refer to them (a new phrase for the Macquarie dictionary perhaps ... lol).

As fate would have it the 'Australian Secondary Schools Rugby League Championship' ('ASSRL') is being held in Port Macquarie from 8-13 July where NSWCCC will be defending their title. Custom and practice connotes that both the NSWCHS and NSWCCC teams will go into camp in the week preceding the ASSRL Championship (NSWCCC actually go into camp on 4 July).

As it stands the Australian Schools Rugby Championship is being held from 2-8 July. I know this will not effect the GPS and CAS players vying for selection in the NSW school teams, however there are some talented 'DUAL CODIES' from the CHS and CCC system that have a chance of being selected. As such they will have to make an important election this year! Some that I know of are:

Fabian Natoli - Manly SG Ball 2011-12, NSWSRU II VX 2011, Australian U/18 Sevens Rep 2011.
Tepai Moeroa - Parra SG Ball 2012, NSWSRU U/16 2011, NSWRL U/16 2011
Clint Gutherson - Manly SG Ball 2011-12, NSWSRU I VX 2011, Australian U/18 Sevens Rep
Taane Milne - Roosters SG Ball 2012, NSWSRU U/16 2011, Australian RL U/15 2010
Michael Morgan - Bulldogs SG Ball 2012, NSWSRU U/16 2011, NSWRL U/16 2011, NSWCCC RL U/18 2011

The reason why I have suggested these lads is due to the stage they are at in their league careers. Presently each has a decent chance of making Australian RL Schoolboys team in 2012, and given that is a standard term in most junior rugby league contracts for a bonus payment ranging from $3000-$5000 for making either of the NSWCHS, NSWCCC, or QSSRL U/18 team; and again for selection in the Australian Schoolboys team there are some fairly big carrots on offer!

With respect to last year's ASSRL Championship Gutherson did not seek selection in the NSWCHS U/18's however I believe this will now change. Milne I believe made it to the penultimate step in the NSWCHS league selection trials. Moeroa didn't seek selection in NSWCIS U/18's (which he easily would have made). Natoli and Morgan both competed at NSWCCC trials but only Morgan made it through.

In addition most of the lads above are now training with their respective team's Toyota Cup squad. I believe Gutherson has actually trained with the Manly first grade squad, such is his profile and talent. I do know that he is shoe in for the NSWRL U/18 'State of Origin' team this year. It is interesting to note that both Gutherson and Natoli made the NSWRL U/16 State of Origin team in 2010.

2012 will definitely not be a 'have your cake and eat it year' for the above lads!

Regards,
Newbie

While I'm bouyed by this scenario I feel it is more good fortune than good management that the moons have aligned in this way. I'm also wary of our amateur officials giving way to allowing certain players the opportunity to negotiate releases from league camps to play rugby, especially as this years State titles are in Sydney. It also doesn't fully address the issue of abandoning rugby once their school committments have ended. I would be far more comfortable with a stronger committment to the opportunities they are provided with that could be declared null and void if they don't gain representation prior to leaving school.

I'm not about denying anyone the opportunity to succeed but it shouldn't deprive someone else of that opportunity if the original selection has no intention of furthering themselves in the game. If rugby has to play hard ball with some of these kids then so be it, League has made it clear what their expectations are for a long time. If reports are true as to where some of your listed players are now attending school then I'm sure that there will be pressure applied to represent the GPS over league. This won't stop the NRL clubs from locking away the players with silent deals to be enacted the day they leave school but a valid contract committing to rugby beyond that time will cause them to think hard or to act earlier and also ask the player for a binding committment.

It will be interesting to watch the choices made this year and how many loopholes can be exploited.

 

[Newbie]

... ...If rugby has to play hard ball with some of these kids then so be it, League has made it clear what their expectations are for a long time. ... This won't stop the NRL clubs from locking away the players with silent deals to be enacted the day they leave school but a valid contract committing to rugby beyond that time will cause them to think hard or to act earlier ...

No9,

What you say is correct, emphatically so! However until the ARU and/or NSWRU pull their proverbial fingers out and start acting, and when I say act I mean in a legal sense, rugby will continue to hone the skills of current prodigies but only for the benefit of league!

The problem the ARU and other rugby entities face is they would be contracting with minors. This makes the 'Quid Pro Quo' somewhat more elusive as they, unlike their league counterparts, are not too willing to put some money into the pockets of such rugby/rugby league prodigies.

As any legal professional will tell you, contracting with minors is somewhat precarious. For mine the ARU does not put enough emphasis on the value of their training programs such as the NGS. At the very minimum they should be putting a price on a development fee, whereby any participant defecting to league would attract a repayment of this fee.

Obviously the above suggestion would need to be refined, however as you have previously stated it will at least present a viable impediment to a departure to league.

Regards,
Newbie

 

[no9]

Unfortunately for rugby when the game went professional only the players and coaches evolved out of amateurism and the decision makers stayed in the 90's when we were winning world cups. Not paying attention to the smallest details is why we've not really come close since 03. Sad isn't it.

 

[Grandstand]

I believe the Aussie under 20 squad has been announced. Anyone have the details?

 

[p.Tah]

I believe the Aussie under 20 squad has been announced. Anyone have the details?

Australian squad: Allan Ala'alatoa, Curtis Browning, Lindsay Crook, Steven Cummins, Thomas Cusack, James Dargaville, Allan Faalavaau, Con Foley, Nicholas Frisby, Liam Gill (capt), Kyle Godwin, Malietoa Hingano, Lewis Holland, Jed Holloway, Oliver Hoskins, Sam Jeffries, Silatolu Latu, Apolosi Latunipulu, Matthew Lucas, Leslie Makin, Sean McMahon, Benn Melrose, Maile Ngauamo, Pettowa Paraka, Sam Reiser, Hugh Roach, Christopher Sautia, Ulupano Seuteni.

http://news.smh.com.au/breaking-new...er-of-aust-u20-rugby-side-20120502-1xydp.html

Refer to the U/20 thread.

 

[Lee Grant]

These were posted on a new thread started today. To avoid duplication of threads the posts were transferred here.

Light

Predictions, players to watch, coaches and all things Aus. Schoolboy related.

As you all know this competition has been dominated in the past by QLD, a team that looks very vulnerable and quite unknown at this point in 2012. Mainly because the GPS season hasn't started but there will no doubt be AIC boys putting their hands up for QLD I and II spots.

Not too many players returning from last years team but it would be good to get some indication of where they are at if anyone knows.

Knockers

From QLD:
Jack Tuttle (Nudgee College) Oz Schools A 2011
Francois Postal (Nudgee College) Combined States
Jack Cornelson (Brisbane Grammar) QLD II
Dan Preen (Ipswich Grammar) QLD II
Sam Greene (Brisbane Grammar) QLD I
Andrew Manu (St Edmonds College) QLD II
Gareth Kallell (BBC) Combined States
Darcy Eason (Churchie) QLD II
Monty Ioane (Churchie) Combined States
Nigel Tanuvasu (now at Churchie) Victorian Schoolboys

Brad Wilkin will be a good shot as a flanker having received player of the tournament at the National U16s.

Empire

Add Tom Staniforth from Canberra Grammar/last years schoolboys team.
.