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Australian Schoolboys & National Championships 2012

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C

casking

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i am interested to see thoughts and opinions on why Dave Horwitz was considered a certainty for Australian honours before the NSW teams were even announced? I have seen him play twice for Scots in which he showed touches of class but nothing that screamed Australian Schoolboys. I also thought his performance on Saturday didn't deserve an Australian spot. Is he the best of a bad bunch or is there something I'm missing altogether?
 

Inside Shoulder

Nathan Sharpe (72)
As someone mentioned Jones is is Yr 11 (and is still just 16). I thought Jones was the player of the tournament. It's about time that NSW had a schools flyer; they are usually from north of the Tweed.

If G78 would stop being so modest he would tell you all about Harry Jones.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
 

Micheal

Nicholas Shehadie (39)
Does anybody know the starting lineup for this weeks Australian Schoolboys game against Tonga on Saturday?
 

stonecutter

Chris McKivat (8)
Hey Stonecutter,

Apart from Tuttle you have just about nailed the main selections including reserves. Who do you know? Your reasoning is fairly straight forward but your reckoning on the No7 position proved 100% and Orr's inclusion is from left field too. Anything else?

Once you understand whats being looked for it's not always too hard to work out. As I previously noted, selectors rarely look away from previous selections. From the NSW selections it was showing what type of player was being considered for certain positions and while I don't agree with what they were after, the selections followed the line of thinking. They are taking a punt going down the same road against NZ as Coach Deans was shown it doesn't work at the WC last year.

From what I saw over the trials there are a lot of players who were technically more correct in their positions or physically suited who didn't achieve selection and who may end up giving those who were a lesson or two over the ensuing years. Keep your heads up boys.
 

Newbie

Bill McLean (32)
Newbie,
I don't know that he was ever really rugby's to lose.

No9,

Once upon a time I would have agreed with you, but when he was selected for the Australian Junior Sevens team the other year I thought he had made his election!

Still a loss IMO because rugby should have done more (from a contractual position) to secure him, but I will say no more on the subject as we have argued the legalities pertaining to schoolboys to death earlier on this year :)
 
G

G&GR News Bot

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The 38th Novotel Australian Schools Rugby Union Championships starts on Monday, 2 July 2012 at Riverview in Sydney.

In Division I there are two teams each from Queensland and NSW, and one each from WA, Victoria and the ACT. A sixth team, Combined States, has been selected from players who were not chosen in the other teams. They play three matches in two pools, and on Finals Day the 1st, 2nd and 3rd placed teams in one pool play the corresponding teams in the other pool.

Division II comprises teams from SA, Tasmania, the NT and the indigenous Lloyd McDermott Rugby Development Team. They all play each other and the winner is decided on table points. A President’s XV is then selected from the four Div II teams and this year, on Finals Day, it will play against a visiting Tongan Schools team.

On Finals Day selectors announce Australia and Australia ‘A’ teams to play against Tongan Schools.
Like the State Of Origin in the other code, NSW will be wanting to break the winning run of Queensland, who have won the Div I competition for the past 6 years — twice by their IIs team.

NSW Schools will fancy their chances: in the NSW Ones they have 10. Horwitz, and 13. Stewart, who both started for the Oz Schools Ones last year, plus 4. Rorke and 15. McIntyre who were selected on the bench (though Rorke had to pull out). Also 8. Whitely played for Oz A Schools and the effervescent, nimble 9. Natoli played for Australia in the Commonwealth Youth Games. They also have 6. Dempsey who was like a force of nature with ball in hand in the NSW trials and was probably the best player there.

But their backline is a patchwork. McIntyre played 10 in the trials but was picked as the NSW fullback to have a big match player in the XV, yet there were likely better specialist fullbacks who were overlooked. One of these is Kellaway who was switched to the wing.

The other winger is Milne, who is a 13 this year, but that spot is taken by Stewart, who is a specialist 12. Yet Moreoa, chosen at inside centre, was the 13 for NSW Schools Under 16 last year (with Milne at 12). Confusing, isn’t it? But as they say in the classics, it should be right on the night.

Also, there are rumblings that the best loosehead prop in the GPS in trials against other schools, Robertson, who had to play tighthead in the NSW trials, should be playing 1. for the NSW Ones, not 3. for the Twos.

Queensland Schools don’t have so many 2011 Oz Schools players in their team, but they have one gem who was. Their 12. Tuttle passes a long flat ball as first receiver, makes breaks with a step or by bursting through tackles, and runs with a winger’s pace. He loves to tackle also. In my eyes he was the best player of the 2011 Under 16 tournament and a few days after it was over he was called into the Oz A Schools team to play against NZ Schools. The fast 15. Placid, a thrilling runner in open play, was also a stand-out in that tournament.

The Qld front row of 1. Pleash, 2. Manu and 3. Sikimeti was a solid scrummaging unit in the Under 16 comp last year. The leg drive of Manu in tackles and the bruising running (that is, bruising to tacklers) of Sikimeti were telling factors in their tournament victory. Add 4. Korczyk who has the ball-running and -playing skills of some backrowers, energiser bunny 7. Bougoure, and cannonball 8. Fakaosilea and you have a top school pack.

Ostensibly the Combined States is a team of rejects yet if you looked at the names of the 2011 Oz Schools players who beat NZ Schools, you would see three CS players mentioned: 6. Miller, 7. Baldwin and 23. McIntyre. It is difficult to choose anybody from the 2012 team who will emulate them at this point, but it will be an excellent exercise for rugby trainspotters watching players like 5. Preen of Queensland, wanting to prove a point.

Some of the other teams are a bit of a mystery, but the trainspotters will be looking for nuggets. Not much is known about the team from Western Australia but last year six WA players played for Oz Schools, including three for the Ones. In 2011 Victoria got a starting player in the Oz Schools Ones and played well above their weight in the Under 16 tournament. Do they have a Leali’ifano this year?

The ACT have not been at their best in recent years but they have 2011 Oz Schools bench players 4. Staniforth and 13. Robinson, plus the highly regarded Narracott, in their team.
The last time the Championship was in Sydney was in 2009 and players like Tom Kingston, Luke Jones and Liam Gill were playing in it. Who of the 2012 vintage will get to their level?

TEAM LISTS:

NSW http://www.nswschoolsrugby.rugbynet.com.au/default.asp?id=194330QLD http://qrfsu.rugbynet.com.au/default.asp?id=194355
ACT (the names are not listed by jersey numbers but alphabetically by first names) http://brumbies.com.au/News/Article/tabid/1213/ArticleID/6638/Default.aspx
Victoria (you have to download a pdf) http://www.vsru.rugbynet.com.au/
Combined States http://austschools.rugbynet.com.au/default.asp?id=194390
WA Unknown

FIXTURES

NOVOTEL AUSTRALIAN SCHOOLS RUGBY CHAMPIONSHIPS 2012

ST IGNATIUS’ COLLEGE, RIVERVIEW

TAMBOURINE BAY ROAD, LANE COVE, SYDNEY


MONDAY, 2 JULY 2012 – DAY 1 MATCHES
0915 Game 1: Div 1 – ACT v QLD II Second Field
1030 Game 2: Div 1 – NSW I v VIC Second Field
1145 Game 3: Div 1 – CS v QLD I First Field
1300 Game 4: Div 1 – NSW II v WA First Field
1415 Game 5: Div 2 – NT v LMRDT First Field
1530 Game 6: Div 2 – SA v TAS First Field

WEDNESDAY, 4 JULY 2012 – MATCH DAY 2
0915 Game 7: Div2 – LMRDT v TAS First Field
1030 Game 8: Div 2 – NT v SA First Field
1145 Game 9: Div 1 – CS v NSW II Second Field
1300 Game 10: Div 1 – QLD I v WA Second Field
1415 Game 11: Div 1 – QLD II v VIC First Field
1530 Game 12: Div 1 – ACT v NSW I First Field

THURSDAY, 5 JULY 2012 – MATCH DAY 3
0915 Game 13: Div 2 – NT v TAS Second Field
1030 Game 14: Div 2 – LM v SA Second Field
1145 Game 15: Div 1 – CS v WA First Field
1300 Game 16: Div 1 – ACT v VIC First Field
1415 Game 17: Div 1 – NSW II v QLD I First Field
1530 Game 18: Div 1 – NSW I v QLD II First Field

SATURDAY, 7 JULY 2012 – FINALS DAY
0900 Division II Sevens Knock out
1 v 3 2 v 4 W v W Third Field
0900 Division I: 4th v 4th Second Field
0900 Division I: 3rd v 3rd First Field
1015 Division I: 2nd v 2nd First Field
1130 President’s XV v Tongan Schools First Field
1300 Division I: 1st v 1st First Field
1415 Players move to Championship Presentation Ramsay Hall
1430 Championship Presentation Commences
1545 Championship Presentation Concludes
Briefing of ASRU Teams

Continue reading...
 
G

G&GR News Bot

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The 38th Novotel Australian Schools Rugby Union Championships are over and the dominance of Queensland Schools was broken. After 6 years of Queensland victories (two by its IIs team) NSW I beat Qld I in the Final and NSW II beat Qld II in the match that decided 3rdand 4th place.

For the first time in 12 years the Division I and Division II Championships were run together. Formerly the Div II Championships were held earlier, but because of the Global Financial Crisis the extra costs of having separate tournaments could not be afforded. Whilst that meant that a few of the best Div II players could not be considered for the Div I Combined States team, as has happened in the past, it made for a cracking week of rugby and added to the drama.

Division II

On Day 1 the indigenous Lloyd McDermott Rugby Development side unveiled their ceremonial dance in front of the Northern Territory team before the opening whistle. Whilst it was not exactly a haka, and wasn’t intended to be, it was well done and got a huge hand from the crowd on the main ground.

When the game started the Lloydies scored a smart try but then it was one way traffic for NT and they got a big lead. But the Lloydies came back and the score zig-zagged, but the indigenous lads won 36-25.

On Day 2 there was another bit of drama. The NT were recovering from their Day 1 disappointment leading SA 23-0 at oranges but SA must have got the mother of all pep talks at the break and won 29-23.

That was the curtain raiser for Day 3 and the virtual final because the Lloydies and SA were both undefeated. After being tied up 5-5 at oranges SA was 12-10 ahead, then disaster for the indigenous lads: a clearing kick near the dead ball line was kicked right into the guts of a SA player who fell down with it and scored. 19-10.

But with a couple of minutes to go the Lloydies went under the posts to be just 17-19 down. Then, on the bell, a Lloydie ran up the field near touch and when challenged cross kicked to a team mate. It was just him and the ball and.. bounce, bounce and the next bounce skidded in the wet, and he knocked on the low ball. Game over. The lad was crestfallen as SA won. But well done them: they won 3 out of 3.

A President’s XV was picked from the four Div II teams and they played the visiting Tonga Schools team on Day 4. This was a wonderful innovation and they acquitted themselves well before going down 13-36.

Division I

The form guide was right for a change and NSW I played Qld I in the Final and ditto for the 3rd/4th game for the IIs. There was a bit of a scare on Day 3 when Qld I were challenged by NSW II but they held onto win 13-10

NSW II 37 Qld II 22
This game was virtually over at oranges by which time NSW winger, 16 year old Harry Jones, arguably the player of the tournament, had 3 tries to his name, and the score was 34-5. Qld came back with 3 tries after the break but it wasn’t enough.

NSW I 26 – Qld I 7
The Blues got a shock when Qld flyhalf Greene cross kicked early right on the money to fullback Placid charging through. He leapt higher than the stationary NSW winger, caught the ball and scored.

That was as good as it got for the guys in red because NSW winger Kellaway stepped the try scorer for his own 5 pointer. NSW was getting on top but at only 7-8 behind at oranges Qld were well in the game.

NSW got more reward for their better play after the break: a quick switch found Qld short of numbers and a 2nd Kellaway try; then a break by inside centre Moeroa and his well timed pass saw Stewart score the 3rd try for NSW.

Congratulations to the ASRU for running a slick tournament with the added load of the Div II matches, and well done to St. Ignatius at Riverview for the hospitality. Nor could there be too many complaints about the match officials: they performed admirably.

Continue reading...
 

Lee Grant

John Eales (66)
i am interested to see thoughts and opinions on why Dave Horwitz was considered a certainty for Australian honours before the NSW teams were even announced? I have seen him play twice for Scots in which he showed touches of class but nothing that screamed Australian Schoolboys. I also thought his performance on Saturday didn't deserve an Australian spot. Is he the best of a bad bunch or is there something I'm missing altogether?

No you are not: the flyhalf candidates were not stellar; nor have they been for some years.

Obviously the selectors thought the same because they selected just one specialist flyhalf for the main team and one for the A team: Horwitz and Greene. NSW I fullback McIntyre will back up Horwitz, but I have no clue who will do the same for Greene. Has Tuttle ever played 10 for Nudgee?


Horwitz played well for GPS this year but he should be judged on the more difficult games against Queensland.

The early posts on this thread about who was likely to play for Oz Schools mentioned Horwitz based on his starting for Oz Schools 12 months ago v. England. As I said earlier: he is not a rainmaker and McIntyre could well be starting the "test" v. Tonga with the 10 jersey instead. This would leave a spot for the thrilling ball runner, Placid at the back.

However Horwitz, whilst he may not be a Quade, Kurtley or a Bernie, is a steady as you go all round flyhalf and a better tactical kicker than McIntyre is when he plays at 10.

Starting next Saturday v Tonga, the selectors should be looking at players in all positions that will be most suitable for playing NZ in September. Therefore they could pick McIntyre at fullback after all, because as well as being good in broken play, he is also an excellent custodian. He's the guy you will want at the back when Kiwis are launching raids at you, not Placid, who won't get the attacking possibilities he shines with anyway against the boys in black.

Therefore a steady Horwitz at 10 with his tactical kicking, and a steady but also an attacking McIntyre at 15, could be the go starting from next Saturday. They will be looking at the Oz A side on Wednesday also to see what fellows look like Kiwi-slayers.

But I digress.
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Brian Westlake

Arch Winning (36)
Well then the tournament would be well suited for Joeys, as they have arguably the best field in Sydney, possibly NSW and Australia. If you need more reliable sources, ask the Wallabies, they frequently train at Joeys during the wetter parts of winter due to the pristine condition of their fields, rain, hail or shine, along with a grandstand that can hold possibly 2000 people. In addition, they are supposed to have best boarding facilities of any school in Australia. As far as I am concerned, Joeys provide all of the required criteria to host the championships
Now now young Tom, do you think Mr Rawlings wants his fields ripped up before the season has kicked off? For the whole two home games? If that happens what will you play on next year?
 

Brian Westlake

Arch Winning (36)
Tomasi where were you?

I had my note paper, pen and runners ready to ferry my observations to you but you didn't seem to be there! There was one bloke with a cap on standing under the scoreboard but he was more half back size and wasn't wearing Souths gear. There were another couple in chairs and a few more in front of them close to the touchline one of which was wearing a blueish jacket but he didn't look big or Samoan!!

NSW 26 def QLD 7

PS you were right about O'Connor - (although standing on the scoreboard side you probably didn't see him demolishing Tarr in the second half on Thursday) - today however Pleash absolutely took him apart in the scrums.
I noticed you standing next to a fairly big couple of likely lads down on the sideline CTPE. Were they your minders? Both of the blokes had been here all week. Who were they?
 

Newbie

Bill McLean (32)
Will you pleae stay out of Uncle Lees Cream Sherry? Dizlecksia is not gud with acohol

:D Brian why do I have this notion that the teachers never got tired of beating you when you used to school :D

And for the record I'm in Port Macquarie at the ASSRL Championship, and may of had a few reds, but purely in moderation!
 
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