Australian Rugby / RA

[Dan54]

LOL. Not at all.

Do you know what a cargo cult mentality is? Unfortunately it afflicts some rugby viewpoints in this country, waiting for a lazy quick fix to their problems.

Of course there's scope for working together in cooperation with NZR, but ultimately they are unapologetic about that self interest. It's folly to imagine otherwise. That's business.

That is so bang on Kiap, I didn't think like was enough to show how much I agreed with it.

 

[dru]

Geez you talk some rubbish at time dru, aren't Hooper, To'omua etc meeting with NZ players on Zoom this week to work through their ideas of comps going forward?? You really got to stop this everyone against us mentality man!!

Sorry mate, Hooper and To'omua are the authorities on what sort of rugby will work in Aus?

 

[Dan54]

Sorry mate, Hooper and To'omua are the authorities on what sort of rugby will work in Aus?

Well they doing it on behalf of the RUPA, you know the players? Of course how would they know what is best, when they could come in here and ask you obviously, because you seem to be an authority on what will work here in Aus more than the ones actually involved and playing!!

 

[mst]

LOL. Not at all.

Do you know what a cargo cult mentality is? Unfortunately it afflicts some rugby viewpoints in this country, waiting for a lazy quick fix to their problems.

Of course there's scope for working together in cooperation with NZR, but ultimately they are unapologetic about that self interest. It's folly to imagine otherwise. That's business.

That is so bang on Kiap, I didn't think like was enough to show how much I agreed with it.

You are both spot on and it's like Aussie rugby always want to get to this same spot every time we have this conversation. And we are well and truly here again.

Personally, I am still fascinated as to what Aussie rugby seem to be obsessed and fixated with certain elements when it comes to opportunities.

Eg; what’s with the obsession with partnerships? Transtasman, transpacific, trasJapan, tansfuckenanyone, Transylvania......

Then the obsession with Tiers (or is it tears?). It seems to have to be second tier otherwise....well otherwise.......what? Like the people switching on their TVs right will go, oh, his is shite, that's not second tier or high enough standard and turn off the TV? There is no other rugby to watch so they will watch it! This tier thing is what lead to the "trans": obsession and it like Aussie rugby thinks it needs a penis enlargement kit as its inadequate and that magic pump will fix its problems.

So Aussie rugby does not have the encumbrance of a TV deal which could be a blessing right now as you have a blank canvas without being constrained by current deal. Travel is a nightmare so staying onshore is where it's at right now. Australia is one of the first nations who will get back to sports so we are leading the pack. We have Aussie broadcasters who we might not like but they want content now as they need it badly so doing a quick short-term deal locally would not be hard. We know most of the world is watching so we are in a super privileged position of almost having a captive worldwide audience.

We have 5 teams with enough players to almost trot out two squads so with a quick balancing formula, top up the squads and like magic we have 10 decent teams. Run the other 5 teams under the usual "A" team names or use the NRC one, whatever.. (I would be devastated watching 2x Brumbies teams play!)

But instead, we are talking and waiting for others like the NZRU who, and with all due respect, are stuck with a TV deal that in no good right now, shackled to SANZAAR but on the same search for any cash they can grab and are attractive and more popular than us. Do we really think they want to share equally?

If I was NZRU, or anyone in Rugby right now, I would be glad Aussie rugby can't get their collective shite together and would keep stalling them while I go after that captive audience both at home and O/S thats locked up and willing to watch tier 92 standard rugby as there is no other rugby to watch; and it better than nothing!

In future, yeah a Transsomeone competition could be good, but it's a few months down the road at least and it comes with some big risks around travel logistics (airlines probably won't be the same as they used to be!), the potential issue of border controls (will here be quarantine periods?)and the risk of it being closed again.....

Sorry; rant over.

Please resume the usual arguments.

 

[I like to watch]

Well they doing it on behalf of the RUPA, you know the players? Of course how would they know what is best, when they could come in here and ask you obviously, because you seem to be an authority on what will work here in Aus more than the ones actually involved and playing!!

I don’t give 2 fucks what the professional players think might be the best way forward.

there is zero doubt, that self interest will figure prominently in any solutions they put forward.

 

[Dan54]

I don’t give 2 fucks what the professional players think might be the best way forward.

there is zero doubt, that self interest will figure prominently in any solutions they put forward.

Well of course they will have their opinions on what best for them , but I not sure we going to have much rugby on TV without them! I personally was stoked when NZ players a few weeks back set up a committee, not to say how rugby would be exactly, but coming up with a list of alternatives they can see working, so appropriate bodies can take it further when time comes. Shit if we not going to engage players (working with their Rugby boards) who the hell are we going to get to suggest ideas. Funnily enough I think they in a position to give great advice! And isn't almost every idea in here involve self interest, like what that that particular poster wants?? Who do you think should be coming up with ideas??

 

[wamberal]

I don’t give 2 fucks what the professional players think might be the best way forward.

there is zero doubt, that self interest will figure prominently in any solutions they put forward.

On the probably correct assumption that they are working on the best professional competition, what on earth is wrong with a bit of self-interest? After all, they are the ones who do the work and earn the game most of its revenue???

 

[Derpus]

I don’t give 2 fucks what the professional players think might be the best way forward.

there is zero doubt, that self interest will figure prominently in any solutions they put forward.

I mean, you don't give a fuck what they want because presumably what they want is not necessarily what you want. This kind of attitude is a major reason rugby is fucked.

Never any compromise from anyone. Just endless whining.

 

[KOB1987]

I’m sorry Castles detractors felt offended by me paying a complement to her, but I will give credit where I think it’s deserved even if it offends some people.

I’m just going to let this lie. I didn’t suggest anyone was offended, and for the record you didn’t pay her a complement, you made a sarcastic jibe. Which was the point of my post, but evidently that’s going straight over your head to try to better your own argument.

 

[Aurelius]

Suspect both Australia and New Zealand would really, really struggle without each other. It is in neither's best interest to see the other fall over. From a viewer point of view, is there anything a New Zealander or an Australian loves more than getting one over on each other? Watching England get demolished would have to be a close second..

Yeah, John Key had a quote a few years ago that New Zealanders wouldn't get rich selling each other cappuccinos, and by the same token just playing rugby among themselves indefinitely wouldn't be sustainable especially if Europe continues to offer better pay.

 

[I like to watch]

On the probably correct assumption that they are working on the best professional competition, what on earth is wrong with a bit of self-interest? After all, they are the ones who do the work and earn the game most of its revenue???

Maybe cos what’s good them them, is not necessarily good for the overall health of the game?

 

[I like to watch]

I mean, you don't give a fuck what they want because presumably what they want is not necessarily what you want. This kind of attitude is a major reason rugby is fucked.

Never any compromise from anyone. Just endless whining.

It’s logical to assume that the marquee players will have to head O/S to maintain their current wages, and that those that remain will be looking at significantly lower payments.

im certain the players won’t be suggesting any plans that dramatically reduce total player payments.

so where’s their value add in the discussion?

 

[Derpus]

It’s logical to assume that the marquee players will have to head O/S to maintain their current wages, and that those that remain will be looking at significantly lower payments.

im certain the players won’t be suggesting any plans that dramatically reduce total player payments.

so where’s their value add in the discussion?

They are talking about playing games at the end of the year not renegotiating the just signed RUPA agreement. What are fucking talking about?

 

[Dan54]

Maybe cos what’s good them them, is not necessarily good for the overall health of the game?

Disagree, what is good for them is the game being a good product isn't it? Or is that not good for the game?
See in my work I a subby, and figure the better job I do ,the more houses the builder will sell and the main reason I like that is that means I earn more! It works that way for most people!

 

[Rugbynutter39]

Self interest of course always at play so it is more showing how 1+1=3

But then again different parties maybe do different maths.

Of course it would be better if oz and nz could work together to successfully develop a healthier, more financially stable competition but that yes requires each to sort out their own back yard as well as collaborate effectively on how together could create a better competition. But they are not mutually exclusive considerations. Oz pro rugby is in shambles but if could sort it out financial windfalls much greater than what nz could offer. Nz got its pro rugby generally pretty sorted but will always be constrained by small size of population and hence financial constraints. Oz and wider Asia pacific market offers growth opportunities but yes they would need others to sort out themselves (not just oz as PI team for example would need support early on eg world rugby) but equally nz would have to step up and concede on a couple of things if they wanted to make things like this work e.g. allowing all black to choose players playing in the competition which includes for teams outside of nz.

Self interest will only get you so far but shared interest will get you much further. The latter was what the world rugby nations championship was about imo and was opportunity lost because self interest blinded the bigger picture shared interest.

 

[Adam84]

I’m just going to let this lie. I didn’t suggest anyone was offended, and for the record you didn’t pay her a complement, you made a sarcastic jibe. Which was the point of my post, but evidently that’s going straight over your head to try to better your own argument.

Well i did pay her a complement which you seemed to have missed, i brought up the story of her calling Rennie after she had resigned and encouraging him to come and coach Australia. My /s was about her positive action.

It seems to have hit a mark with you so I’m sorry you felt that was a cheap shot, it or believe anyone else would have done it. My intent was to highlight a positive departing story about castle.

 

[Rebelsfan]

any one know whats happening with the bledislo in Melbourne? Are we thinking it might go ahead? Without crowds?

 

[KOB1987]

Well i did pay her a complement which you seemed to have missed, i brought up the story of her calling Rennie after she had resigned and encouraging him to come and coach Australia. My /s was about her positive action.

It seems to have hit a mark with you so I’m sorry you felt that was a cheap shot, it or believe anyone else would have done it. My intent was to highlight a positive departing story about castle.

It’s all good, it didn’t really hit a mark with me, I was just having a bit of difficulty trying to get my point across. It doesn’t really matter, as I’ve said I agree it was a good way for her to leave on a positive note, it wasn’t really about that. I’ve stated I’m impartial, so will leave it here.

 

[gel]

Disagree, what is good for them is the game being a good product isn't it? Or is that not good for the game?
See in my work I a subby, and figure the better job I do ,the more houses the builder will sell and the main reason I like that is that means I earn more! It works that way for most people!

No, what is good for them is ensuring that they maximise their earning potential for the brief period of time where they are able to.

There's plenty of ways they could benefit themselves short term to the longer term detriment of the game.

Your subcontracting business on the other hand has to continue for a long period of time - ideally as long as you are willing to work. Therefore you need to look after those stakeholders in balance with your own business needs.

 

[Dan54]

No, what is good for them is ensuring that they maximise their earning potential for the brief period of time where they are able to.

There's plenty of ways they could benefit themselves short term to the longer term detriment of the game.

Your subcontracting business on the other hand has to continue for a long period of time - ideally as long as you are willing to work. Therefore you need to look after those stakeholders in balance with your own business needs.

I understand what you saying and agree with your sentiments, but geez man I hope I have retired form work before most of these bloody players, I 65