Australian Rugby / RA

[Froggy]

So these guys are saying the game has been poorly administered for a number of years (hard to argue, although most of the damage precedes Castle), they want to make it great again (where have I heard that before) and have a number of capable business leaders ready to step into the fray (like who, the staff of Fox Sport)?

No mention whatever of exactly what they are going to do, or who these amazing people are who are going to do it. I mean, if someone can present me with a comprehensive, realistic, affordable plan with objectives most supporters can agree with, and some people with the proven capabilities to implement it, I'm more than happy to get on board.

But just tearing something down because we used to be captains and that was when rugby in Australia was great (notably the guy who captained Australia when we were top of the world wasn't among them) with nothing but anger at the current regime to hang your hat on is exactly the sort of mentality that creates coups in third world countries, with one brutal, corrupt, incompetent regime being replaced by another exactly the same.

 

[dru]

Yep. A failure to speak up during Clyne, shrink to greatness etc speaks volumes. Hard to read their noise now, when rugby needs some solidarity, as anything other than simple politics.

 

[Finsbury Girl]

It might end up being a choice between watching our best players in 720p or amateurs in Full HD.



A 50% reduction in the broadcast revenue from Foxtel would destroy the professional game here.

I doubt that very much. Rather it would it teach us to cut our cloth appropriately.

 

[sunnyboys]

With respect, I think that's a bit harsh on Harrison. He's a very bright guy tasked with representing his membership in pay talks with their employer.

As a consequence, there arises a natural conflict between the parties that's no-one's 'fault' and can be described more fairly than by suggesting it's simply a matey conspiracy.

So RUPA give us “root and branch transformation” and the next day the Kearns Kafer Krew give us the 11 captains of yore in the COVID coup?? And you think these things aren’t related??

 

[Ignoto]

RA on the front foot and have responded right away. An astute, measured response I think. Meeting with them could add value. Or not. But it’s good to try and be the bigger party and try to broker some kind of peace and alignment.

https://www.rugby.com.au/news/2020/04/21/rugby-au-board-meeting-wallabies-captains

Good, glad to see RA confront these blokes who claim to love our game but would prefer to get their snouts in the trough then do any form of work to assist.\

Looking at the list, can someone enlighten me whether any of them have been involved with the game (outside of commentating) since they finished playing? I genuinely have no idea if they've been coaching or assisting.

 

[Lorenzo]

The absence of Eales' signature is instructive, and is consistent with my preliminary assessment that the initiatives and action items will primarily serve to line the pockets of some of them and further inflate the egos of the remainder. For a group of people awarded numerous opportunities to speak publicly on matters rugby, I don't recall ever hearing any of them say anything particularly sensible and i don't just mean regarding the administration of the game.

This reeks of the kind of populist bullshit that appeals to causal fans that (reasonably, i guess) assume that former captains would likely have some clue about running the game at the national level. The truth is that many of these weren't especially good captains, never mind qualified to run the sport.

Personally if i was the freshly installed chairman id be more inclined to take private meetings than respond to public ambushes like this, but perhaps the games current position demands a conciliatory approach.

 

[dru]

The truth is that many of these weren't especially good captains

Balance is needed. I am greatly disappointed by the actions here. But I can't at all countenance the above comment.

 

[Joe King]

To be fair hoggy, I doubt you could of acted on behalf of the fanbase, because I doubt the fanbase would agree on what they want.

True, but a large part of the fanbase might agree on what they don't want.

 

[Joe King]

Yes, I fail to see how RA receiving more money for the broadcast rights, and fans paying significantly less to watch the games could possibly be a win...

It would be a win, but it won't solve the issue for those conserned unfortunately.

What are the concerns? all i see is Trumpesque 'make rugby great again' rhetoric without ever identifying or suggesting how.

To be honest, i wouldn't expect a bunch of blokes who spent the first 10-15 years of their careers getting their heads smacked to know.

I agree, they need to say how they expect to change things and how it would help, or at least say what process they will use to discover the answer to these questions.

But I really hope the RA don't take the attitude of your second para, otherwise the divide is just going to get wider.

 

[Joe King]

RA on the front foot and have responded right away. An astute, measured response I think. Meeting with them could add value. Or not. But it’s good to try and be the bigger party and try to broker some kind of peace and alignment.

https://www.rugby.com.au/news/2020/04/21/rugby-au-board-meeting-wallabies-captains

Well done RA. What a refreshing response, and another reason to think we have the right board in place.

 

[Joe King]

Rugby Australia chairman Paul McLean saw the letter on Tuesday and said he had already spoken to some of the group.

“I have been in contact with a member of the group today and have offered to arrange a meeting with the full board as soon as is reasonably practicable," he said.
"These are respected former Wallabies captains and the board would value their input as we work through the challenges that Rugby has faced over the last few years and that have been amplified by the Coronavirus pandemic. The board is also prepared to work with the group to provide them access to the information requested in the letter.
“The board had commenced the process of establishing a review group to investigate a whole of rugby review that includes professional rugby, semi-professional rugby, and community rugby.
"The board would welcome the input of the signatories of the letter into the review process. It is intended that input for the review would be sought from a wide range of stakeholders including current and former players."
"Now is the time for us to come together in the interests of the entire Rugby community.”

https://www.rugby.com.au/news/2020/04/21/rugby-au-board-meeting-wallabies-captains

 

[Derpus]

But I really hope the RA don't take the attitude of your second para, otherwise the divide is just going to get wider.

Yeah - you get the feeling they want RA to take up that position rather than be conciliatory. Conciliation doesn't fit with their table banging tone.

 

[sunnyboys]

Good move by the board. Get the fellas in for a chat.

Wonder how many of them will actually front up for the face to face. Here’s some scenarios of how this can play out:
1. They refuse to meet - board says the group are unwilling to join in with the collective efforts underway
2. They come in and have no ideas - board says we met them but they have no ideas
3. They come in and are unwilling to share their ideas - again, seem as not wanting to join the collective effort
4. They come in and will only share ideas if board and/or CEO stand down
5. They come in and share their ideas - and board asks them to join the collective efforts already underway - if they do, uprising subdued - if they don’t they are seen as uncooperative and power hungry

Smart move by the board

 

[Lorenzo]

My first question for Phil Kearns would be: how is he able to reconcile his supposed passion for the health of the game whilst contemporaneouly working for an organisation that never stops shitting on the sport for its own commercial ends? Why has he not used his (supposed) considerable corporate nous to convince Delaney et al to negotiate in good faith?

 

[Joe King]

Sorry for so many posts...

but I really hope the proposed review is open, transparent, and truly inclusive of the offended party, and that something really great comes out of all this - a renewed vision, with an agreed-upon strategy and structures for the whole game, which satisfy fans and players at every level of the game, and do actually work to make Australian rugby as good as it can be.

I don't know what the solution is, but there is no point trying to get the offended party to just get over it, or slander their characters in the hope that it shames them into silence. It doesn't work. The issue just festers away in the background and the division only grows.

I think this is an opportunity for the RA board to do something different, and show they are not the ARU of the past. And wouldn't it be great if it was possible for them to somehow truly address the issues underlying the divisions within Australian rugby, and for the past captains party to go from wanting the RA to 'move out of the way' to truly appreciating the board through this process and what results from it?!

Wouldn't it be good if out of this crisis there was a real re-set for rugby in Australia, and everyone was unanimously excited about it - because it sounds like RA actually thinking about this!

 

[Rebels3]

If listening to the podcast from the Force guys (rugby wrap I think) last week with NFJ is anything to go by, I don’t think there is any clear plan outside generating greater influence for ‘club rugby’ and a return to traditional pathways. The Force guys did quite well with the interview but NFJ didn’t give a convincing performance. On the pathways discussion NFJ was complaining about how they are poor, which Mitch Hardy corrected him on several misconceptions he had and that they are pretty good these days as he’s seen what’s happened with his son through identification/pathways.

Twice he was asked about where he sees WA in his vision and twice he danced around it. He also mentioned strange things like how he didn’t need to go to the gym to be a good player, etc.

 

[Rebels3]

So these guys are saying the game has been poorly administered for a number of years (hard to argue, although most of the damage precedes Castle), they want to make it great again (where have I heard that before) and have a number of capable business leaders ready to step into the fray (like who, the staff of Fox Sport)?

No mention whatever of exactly what they are going to do, or who these amazing people are who are going to do it. I mean, if someone can present me with a comprehensive, realistic, affordable plan with objectives most supporters can agree with, and some people with the proven capabilities to implement it, I'm more than happy to get on board.

But just tearing something down because we used to be captains and that was when rugby in Australia was great (notably the guy who captained Australia when we were top of the world wasn't among them) with nothing but anger at the current regime to hang your hat on is exactly the sort of mentality that creates coups in third world countries, with one brutal, corrupt, incompetent regime being replaced by another exactly the same.

Spot on.

I’m happy to support someone if they can show a clear and obvious plan with identification of issues, why they are an issue and how it will be fixed.

 

[Kenny Powers]

How much has the Board of Rugby Australia listened in the past?

At the most recent AGM they gave themselves a 72% performance rating!

https://www.news.com.au/sport/rugby...t/news-story/5080f6c6007c9dfc8d3ca62cb8e99582

How did they land on 72% and it also looks like it is a metric for handing out bonuses.

Plenty of grass roots rugby volunteers out there has anyone ever done or been asked to do a survey? I have never been contacted in the past when involved as a volunteer at club level?

I think Rugby Australia are being rightly criticised for ignoring the grass roots as there is no involvement in their magic 72% performance metric.

 

[half]

In a post lock-down and travel ban world what will sporting boards try and do.

My guess is try and return to today's normal. Most sporting boards are inefficient, bloated and poorly managed. But if you have media saturation as opposed to a near media blackout then your job is a little easier.

Under revenue deals over the past or say since the late 70's early 80's has been the development of mega managements across teams and the governance models with huge management structures.

RA has been the kind would say poorly run for a long time. IMO the key reason for this especially in the Super Rugby time has been there is no real separation of powers. Not enough stakeholders get a say. Many don't like the talk of the Shute Shield on this forum. But consider a traditional well respected rugby competition was cast aside like a used oily rag yes for a better and more professional competition but it was the manner of we have the power and can. Sadly for rugby it did not work.

The above issue and its one of hundreds if not thousands is brought about by no real separation of powers between major stakeholders with key stakeholder groups. In RL the NRL clubs have a huge say and behind many of the NRL clubs are their leagues clubs.

Rugby needs a new governance model to select the board, otherwise its replacing like with like as it has been for decades.

My suggestion is you need PLEASE THESE ARE NOT CAST IN STONE AND CAN BE ADDED TO you need say 65% of the vote to be elected to the board. Further each voting group must have at least one woman in the voting group.

Who can vote.

Players Union 3 votes
NSW Union 3 votes
QLD union 3 votes
ACT Union 2 votes
Club Rugby 2 votes [Sydney / Brisbane competitions]
Other Unions 2 votes
Country Rugby 2 votes
Officials 3 votes i.e. refs, lines-people
Women's game 3 votes
Former Wallaby Captains 4 votes
Super Rugby or whatever professional teams we have 5 votes.

That's 32 votes across 11 stakeholder groups. You need 21 votes to get a seat meaning no power block can get their people in.

The idea is this group could elect a board to develop rugby, not try and protect their own positions and power-bases.

That's my idea to fix the board.

 

[Dan54]

How much has the Board of Rugby Australia listened in the past?


Plenty of grass roots rugby volunteers out there has anyone ever done or been asked to do a survey? I have never been contacted in the past when involved as a volunteer at club level?

I think Rugby Australia are being rightly criticised for ignoring the grass roots as there is no involvement in their magic 72% performance metric.

Kenny, I have been a volunteers at clubs for quite a few years (and sometimes a bit higher), and in many positions whether coaching, managing ,administration etc, both here and in NZ. I will say RA (or NZRU) never asked me my opinion, neither really did I expect them to, if I ever believed strongly enough about something I took it to club committee (or JAB,or provincial rugby union etc) and expressed my concerns and if the club or whatever agreed it would be taken up to next level. I truly think this is correct way for information/views to be forwarded to RA etc.