Australia v South Africa - Perth - 6 September 2014

[The_Brown_Hornet]

I agree JB, it's concerning.

 

[Bairdy]

• AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) is a ball-hogging has-been that should be dumped for the youngest, most inexperienced outside centre we can find.
• JOC (James O'Connor) is still a twat;
• Pocock is the better openside than Hooper;
• Hooper is a centre/winger
• Hodgson should be the starting Wallabies openside;
• Rob Simmons gives away penalties in between trundling to lineouts.
• Palu is anonymous at test level. Bringing Higgers in is the answer.
• Foley is keeping the 10 jersey warm for Quade;
• Dan Palmer - the greatest scrummaging tighthead Australia has ever produced to have not fulfilled his potential at test level - needs to be brought over from Grenoble quick smart to establish a scrum school.

Anything else that hasen't be glossed over in this match thread?

 

[Hugh Jarse]

Yes.

• John O'Neil is responsible for the Global Financial Crisis.
• Dingo Deans was a NZRFU plant with a mission to set Australian rugby back 10 years.
• There are better former Wallaby players running around in NH rugby that must urgently be parachuted back into the Wobs.
• There are athletes currently playing Greco-Roman Rugby who would walk into the Wobs squad.
• Unpaid Interns are running the show at ARU.
• Our game plan is to play what is in front of us.
• Wallabies can't play in the wet.
• Too many <select one of (Reds, Waratahs, Brumbies)> in the squad.
• The lack of <select one of the 5 Aust Franchises> in the squad shows a bias from ARU against <insert posters home franchise> and a clear indication that they have no intention of growing the game in <insert location of posters supported franchise>.

 

[lewisr]

Looks like he's still playing silly buggers.

http://www.smh.com.au/rugby-union/u...ite-queensland-reds-deal-20140902-10bipq.html

Not a good sign.

Jesus fucking Christ.

Why can't we just produce consistently brilliant players, always in top form with an excessively impressive skill set for their position who also just respect their team, country and grass roots upbringing (read: aren't complete dickheads)? Is that such a big ask? The kiwis seem to have no problem doing it!

Argh, so disappointing, was hoping he might've actually learnt a thing or two but this makes it look like he's still caught up in "brand O'Connor".

 

[Hugh Jarse]

Jesus fucking Christ.

Why can't we just produce consistently brilliant players, always in top form with an excessively impressive skill set for their position who also just respect their team, country and grass roots upbringing (read: aren't complete dickheads)? Is that such a big ask? The kiwis seem to have no problem doing it!

Argh, so disappointing, was hoping he might've actually learnt a thing or two but this makes it look like he's still caught up in "brand O'Connor".

Ummm. Zac Guildford and one of two other kiwis have struggled to keep their dickheadedness under control especially when there is grog about.

 

[USARugger]

@JoeBlow

I may be wrong but I think Cottrell is still injured or recovering from surgery. I'd also like to see him involved once he's healthy again, though. Could be a future for him at 6 if he keeps playing like he did this year.

 

[Brumby Runner]

• AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) is a ball-hogging has-been that should be dumped for the youngest, most inexperienced outside centre we can find.
• JOC (James O'Connor) is still a twat;
• Pocock is the better openside than Hooper;
• Hooper is a centre/winger
• Hodgson should be the starting Wallabies openside;
• Rob Simmons gives away penalties in between trundling to lineouts.
• Palu is anonymous at test level. Bringing Higgers in is the answer.
• Foley is keeping the 10 jersey warm for Quade;
• Dan Palmer - the greatest scrummaging tighthead Australia has ever produced to have not fulfilled his potential at test level - needs to be brought over from Grenoble quick smart to establish a scrum school.

Anything else that hasen't be glossed over in this match thread?

It may have escaped some people's attention, but Dan is back in Canberra. Get him over to Perth quick smart and you can forget all the other matters!

 

[Train Without a Station]

Mate if it was up to you you'd still have Horan and Little in the centres. Jeeeeeeeeeeeeez

Scrubber. I just have this insane view that a players age, or past ability is irrelevant and all that's relevant is how well he performs compared to the alternatives and that if he's better he should be picked.

Let me give you a list.

• Joe Stanley (Aged 30 - 1987);
• Buck Shelford (Aged 29 - 1987);
• Murray Pierce (Aged 30 - 1987);
• John Drake (Aged 28 - 1987);
• Bob Egerton (Aged 28 - 1991);
• David Campese (Aged 29 - 1991);
• Michael Lynagh (Aged 28 - 1991);
• Nick Farr-Jones (Aged 29 - 1991);
• Simon Poidevin (Aged 31 - 1991);
• Rod McCall (Aged 28 - 1991);
• Andre Joubert (Aged 31 - 1995);
• Hendrik Le Roux (Aged 28 - 1995);
• Joel Stranksy (Aged 28 - 1995);
• Francois Pienaar (Aged 28 - 1995);
• Hannes Strydom (Aged 30 - 1995);
• Kobus Wiese (Aged 29 - 1995);
• Balie Swart (Aged 29 - 1995);
• Tim Horan (1999 - Aged 29);
• David Wilson (1999 - Aged 32);
• John Eales (1999 - Aged 29);
• Andrew Blades (1999 - Aged 32);
• Michael Foley (1999 - Aged 32);
• Richard Harry (1999 - Aged 32);
• Jason Robinson (2003 - Aged 29);
• Will Greenwood (2003 - Aged 31);
• Matt Dawson (2003 - Aged 31);
• Lawrence Dallaglio (2003 - Aged 31);
• Neil Back (2003 - Aged 34);
• Richard Hill (2003 - Aged 30);
• Martin Johnson (2003 - Aged 33);
• Percy Montgomery (2007 - Aged 33);
• Butch James (2007 - Aged 29);
• Danie Russow (2007 - Aged 29);
• Victor Matfield (2007 - Aged 30);
• Bokkies Botha (2007 - Aged 28);
• John Smit (2007 - Aged 29);
• Os Du Rant (2007 - Aged 35);
• Corey Jane (2011 - Aged 28);
• Conrad Smith (2011 - Aged 30);
• Ma'a Nonu (2011 - Aged 29);
• Piri Weepu (2011 - Aged 28);
• Richie McCaw (2011 - Aged 31);
• Jerome Kaino (2011 - Aged 28);
• Brad Thorn (2011 - Aged 36);
• Kevin Mealamu (2011 - Aged 31);
• Tony Woodcock (2011 - Aged 30).

That list is World Cup winning XV players who were over 28 at the time of the final. That's just the starting players. I haven't even looked at the bench.
What that least tells me is as time passes, more and more players over 28 are the players you need.
Let me give you another list.

• Joe Rocococko (2003 - Aged 20);
• Mils Muliaina (2003 - Aged 23);
• Doug Howlett (2003 - Aged 25);
• Leon MacDonald (2003 - Aged 25);
• Aaron Mauger (2003 - Aged 22);
• Jerry Collins (2003 - Aged 23);
• Richie McCaw (2003 - Aged 23);
• Ali Williams (2003 - Aged 22);
• Chris Jack (2003 - Aged 25);
• Greg Somerville (2003 - Aged 26);
• Kevin Mealamu (2003 - Aged 24);
• Joe Rocococko (2007 - Aged 24);
• Luke McAllister (2007 - Aged 24);
• Situveni Sivivatu (2007 - Aged 25);
• Dan Carter (2007 - Aged 25);
• Ali Willams (2007 - Aged 26);
• Tony Woodcock (2007 - Aged 26);
• James O'Conner (2011 - Aged 21);
• Anthony Fainga'a (2011 - Aged 24);
• Pat McCabe (2011 - Aged 23);
• Digby Ioane (2011 - Aged 26);
• Quade Cooper (2011 - Aged 23);
• Will Genia (2011 - Aged 23);
• David Pocock (2011 - Aged 23);
• James Horwill (2011 - Aged 26);
• Sekope Kepu (2011 - Aged 25).

That's the teams that were disappointing knocked out of World Cup Semi/Quarter Finals where the starting XV was 26 or under. Each one of these teams were highly rated, lost disappointingly and had over a third of their starting team (Almost 2 thirds in 2011 and 2003) of players 26 or under.
Age is irrelevant. Form is relevant. End of fucking story.

 

[Scrubber2050]

TWAS - if you READ my posts all over this place THAT is all I have said - performance performance and performance nothing more nothing less.

But I do appreciate your efforts in researching the above - well done!

 

[Train Without a Station]

You've deviated my passionate friend and talked about how well they'd previously played, where you think they will go after 2015 because of their age, etc.

My point is none of these factors are relevant, it's just where they sit in the ranking of players in their position (and how they fit into the team dynamic of course). It doesn't matter if they're now half as good as they once were, as long as they are better than the next guy.

 

[BDA]

I think outside backs, more than other players, tend to reach an age where they don't have the speed and agility they once had. Bryan Habana seems to be an exception to the rule atm.

They tend to be the ones that head overseas first.

 

[A mutterer]

AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) should be offered a lifetime contract with permanent employment by the aru.

Phase 1 on the field. Phase 2 off teaching young *bucks* how to act as a wallaby.

 

[Train Without a Station]

I think outside backs, more than other players, tend to reach an age where they don't have the speed and agility they once had. Bryan Habana seems to be an exception to the rule atm.

They tend to be the ones that head overseas first.

Only the ones that don't develop to be smarter players.

Most players become smarter and use those smarts to make up for where speed is lacking as their athleticism declines.

 

[MarkJ]

AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) should be offered a lifetime contract with permanent employment by the aru.

Phase 1 on the field. Phase 2 off teaching young *bucks* how to act as a wallaby.

Wasn't AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) one of the 'Dublin Six'?

 

[KOB1987]

hard heads often play their best footy late in their careers too....the older they get, the tougher they get and speed and agility are less important than toughness for props, locks and blindsides..but still a good balance is required..

 

[KOB1987]

Wasn't AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) one of the 'Dublin Six'?

yeah but its a bit like the school captain that inevitably gets seen having a beer at the disco, no-one gives a fuck..

 

[Slim 293]

Speight, Tomane and Genia playing in the NRC this week shapes up nicely for the Wobs.............

 

[The_Brown_Hornet]

This was post #558


This is post 561 after JB ignored @The Brown Hornets advice in post #558


With a backflip like that, have you thought about going into politics @The Brown Hornet.

Do you reckon that there would be any use in getting Dan Palmer over to Perth to do some work on the scrum before the test?

You've lost me, HJ.

 

[Hugh Jarse]

^^^ You are not alone @TBH. I lose plenty of people, including myself at times.

Your post 558 says let's not talk about Poey, JOC (James O'Connor) etc anymore. #559 is from Oztimmay about JOC (James O'Connor). #560 is from Joe Blow was about forwards stuff. In #561 you agree with JB.

I mixed up your "agreement with JB" as agreeing with what Oztimmay wrote about JOC (James O'Connor).

I got myself all stuffed up, and have now delivered required uppercut to myself. Allegations of your gymnastic prowess and suitability for life in Politics are withdrawn, and my post suggesting such will be deleted.

 

[oztimmay]

Somehow I feel responsible for contributing to this confusion....

Oh well, hope you enjoyed the uppercut.

FWIW I've moved the JOC (James O'Connor) discussion over to the relevant JOC (James O'Connor) banter thread. Let our eyes roll at the media circus that is the brand...over there. Nothing to see here but TALK ABOUT HOW THE WALLABIES ARE GOING TO TO BEAT THE SAFFAS.

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