Australia 'A' / Aus Baabaas ?

[kiap]

So, we've got a new national coach and just three weeks of finals left in the Supe. It's a junction point for rugby in Australia, and there are some players emerging that could press for Wallaby selection in the next year or so.

Seems unlikely they will be rushed in though, with TRC only 31 days away and the EOYT being a grand slammer - where there'll be no time/money for dirt trackers.

Maybe we need a few matches for the Aus 'A'/Baabaas (whatever the latest name) at home next year. They haven't made an appearance for a while but IMO should have played the Lions.

It would be the players who are not Wallaby starters but could potentially make the step up soon and would benefit from the experience. Probably the 2nd/3rd guys on Link's "Top 3 in Each Position List" and maybe a few bolters.

.....
4. Hugh Pyle
5. Will Skelton
.....
9. Nic White
.....
Thoughts on players for a possible Aus Baabaa XXIII?

 

[Pfitzy]

Depending on who they're playing against

1 Cowan
2 Tessman/Hanson
3 Ryan
4 Pyle
5 Skelton
6 Quirk
7 Alcock
8 Schatz
9 Phipps (White should be a wallaby)
10 Foley
11 Tomane
12 EDIT Godwin - thank you light
13 Inman
14 Speight
15 Crawford


-----------------------
I hate autocorrect ...

 

[light]

Not a bad idea, should probably emphasis young players.

Would like to see Kyle Godwin and Chris F'Sautia somewhere in the backline or bench.

 

[Zander]

1. Scott Sio
2. James Hanson
3. Paddy Ryan
4. Sam Carter
5. Hugh Pyle
6. Ed Quirk
7. Chris Alcock
8. Ben McCalman
9. Nic White
10. Matt To'omua
11. Peter Betham
12. Kyle Godwin
13. Tevita Kuridrani
14. Henry Speight
15. Cam Crawford

 

[JSRF10]

Can't imagine the next time they get a game unless the French decide to play them when they tour next summer.

Sadly, as you've alluded to OP, money will probably prevent this side from appearing which is unfortunate as it is a very good development tool.

 

[kiap]

Can't imagine the next time they get a game unless the French decide to play them when they tour next summer.

Sadly, as you've alluded to OP, money will probably prevent this side from appearing which is unfortunate as it is a very good development tool.

True, but maybe we could get a PI side to visit here.

Would love to see a couple of Junior All Blacks or Maori All Blacks matches - or South Africa 'A'.

I'd even want to play a guy like Nic White because he has not played any international minutes.

 

[RoffsChoice]

1. Scott Sio
2. Saia Fainga'a
3. Paddy Ryan
4. Hugh Pyle (vc)
5. Sam Carter
6. Peter Kimlin (c)
7. Colby Fainga'a
8. Ben McCalman
9. Nic White
10. Matt To'omua
11. Luke Morahan
12. Kyle Godwin
13. Rob Horne
14. Cam Crawford
15. Jesse Mogg

16. Siliva Siliva
17. Albert Anae
18. Luke Jones
19. Will Skelton
20. Jake Schatz
21. Brendan McKibbon
22. Bernard Foley
23. Andrew Smith

Front row is strong around the park and, if Fainga'a practises throwing and learns to hook the ball, solid in the set piece.
Locks are both hard workers and good around the park.
Back row essentially allows for a specialised backup 8 on the bench, while also being extremely well rounded.
Nic White at 9 because imo he's on par with Phipps but won't overtake him until he gets some international game time. Couldn't split Foley and To'omua, so went with To'omua due to 9/10 partnership.
Kyle Godwin is the other well-rounded 12 in Australia so he gets the spot. Can't really play anyone at 13 over Horne for a baabaas squad.
Morahan and Crawford are great runners, tacklers and kickers. They'll end up in the Wallabies soon enough anyway.
Mogg is a very specialised fullback, we need a great kicker back there anyway.

Torn between Tessmann and Siliva for the bench. Went with Siliva because of partnership with Sio.
Anae and Manu should cover both sides of the scrum. Sio can swap anyway if it all goes downhill.
Jones is great off the bench and is also able to cover lock or 6. More allowance for specialist 8 on the bench.
McKibbon because he's 4th on the list, Foley because he and To'omua are even in my books and he missed out.
Andrew Smith because we have two people who can cover 10 as is and no OC cover.

 

[The Red Baron]

Depending on who they're playing against

1 Cowan
2 Tessman/Hanson
3 Ryan
4 Pyle
5 Skelton
6 Quirk
7 Alcock
8 Schatz
9 Phipps (White should be a wallaby)
10 Foley
11 Tomane
12 EDIT Godwin - thank you light
13 Inman
14 Speight
15 Crawford


-----------------------
I hate autocorrect .

That is a pretty damn fine team right there.

 

[kiap]

My picks would be similar to most of the posts here except I am missing a No.8. and backup hooker.

McCalman and Schatz are the backrow contenders but I am hoping in vain for a bolter to emerge.

(Possible Wallabies are crossed out)

1. Scott Sio
2. James Hanson
3. Paddy Ryan
4. Hugh Pyle
5. Will Skelton (bolter)
6. Ed Quirk
7. Liam Gill (c) Chris Alcock
8. ?

9. Nic White
10. Matt To'omua | Bernard Foley
11. Joe Tomane
12. Kyle Godwin
13. Tevita Kuridrani
14. Henry Speight Cameron Crawford
15. Jesse Mogg Luke Morahan

16. ?
17. Albert Anae
18. Salesi Manu
19. Sam Carter
20. ?
21. Nick Frisby
22. Bernard Foley | Matt To'omua
23. Mitch Inman

 

[light]

1. Scott Sio
2. James Hanson
3. Paddy Ryan
4. Sam Carter
5. Hugh Pyle
6. Ed Quirk
7. Chris Alcock
8. Jake Schatz
9. Nic White
10. Matt To'omua
11. Chris F'Sautia
12. Kyle Godwin
13. Tevita Kuridrani
14. Henry Speight
15. Cam Crawford

16. Albert Anae
17. Paul Alo Emile
18. Will Skelton
19. Ben McCalman/ Curtis Browning / Jed Holloway
20. Nick Frisby
21. Bernard Foley
22. Junior Rosolea
23. Jono Lance/Ben Lucas

Fixed!

 

[Brumby Runner]

1. Scott Sio
2. James Hanson
3. Paddy Ryan
4. Sam Carter
5. Hugh Pyle
6. Ed Quirk
7. Chris Alcock
8. Ben McCalman
9. Nic White
10. Matt To'omua
11. Peter Betham
12. Kyle Godwin
13. Tevita Kuridrani
14. Henry Speight
15. Cam Crawford

This is a very strong lineup, but by 2014 I'd expect Sio, Pyle, White, To'omua and Speight to be in the Wallabies' squad. Does that affect their inclusion in the hypothetical Aust A team? Otherwise, I think Luke Jones is a must at 6, Colby at 7 in place of Alcock and would prefer Schatz as a long term prospect to McCalman at 8.

Siliva is the up and coming No 2 and would be good for consideration on the bench along with Manu, Neville, Cottrell, Stirzaker, Foley, F'Sautia and English.

 

[Brumby Runner]

Fixed!

Anae as reserve prop or hooker? Looks like you're one front rower short on the bench.

 

[kiap]

Yeah, I think Schatz is Super level only, at least for the next year or so.

 

[Hugh Jarse]

./...snip.../..
Maybe we need a few matches for the Aus 'A'/Baabaas (whatever the latest name) at home next year. They haven't made an appearance for a while but IMO should have played the Lions.
./...snip.../..

Barbarians is an English concept and a damn fine one at that.

Shouldn't we have our own Australian name for our equivalents?
Bandicoots, Eurekas, Mates, Bronzers, etc

 

[Hawko]

1. Scott Sio
2. Saia Fainga'a
3. Paddy Ryan
4. Hugh Pyle (vc)
5. Sam Carter Scott Fardy
6. Peter Kimlin (c) Dave Dennis (c)
7. Colby Fainga'a Liam Gill
8. Ben McCalman
9. Nic White
10. Matt To'omua
11. Luke Morahan Honey badger
12. Kyle Godwin Rob Horne
13. Rob Horne Tevita Kuridrani
14. Cam Crawford
15. Jesse Mogg

16. Siliva Siliva
17. Albert Anae
18. Luke Jones Salesi Manu
19. Will Skelton
20. Jake Schatz Luke Jones
21. Brendan McKibbon Luke Burgess
22. Bernard Foley
23. Andrew Smith Kyle Godwin

Back row essentially allows for a specialised backup 8 on the bench, while also being extremely well rounded.
Can't really play anyone at 13 over Horne for a baabaas squad.
Morahan and Crawford are great runners, tacklers and kickers. They'll end up in the Wallabies soon enough anyway.
Mogg is a very specialised fullback, we need a great kicker back there anyway.
Anae and Manu should cover both sides of the scrum.
Jones is great off the bench and is also able to cover lock or 6. More allowance for specialist 8 on the bench.
McKibbon because he's 4th on the list, Foley because he and To'omua are even in my books and he missed out.
Andrew Smith because we have two people who can cover 10 as is and no OC cover.

While I agree with a lot of your selections, some of them are really problematic:

• Sam Carter has been outshone for most of this year by Scott Fardy and yesterday I thought was further evidence of the fact. I know he's late-20's but for tight five those are the golden years. With Pyle as the LHL, Fardy is a far better option for the tight stuff.
• Kimlin is off overseas and until he gives up that contract I see no point in selecting him. You've ignored Dennis, which most people do, but to their detriment.
• As soon as Pocock is back, one of Hooper and Gill has to drop out. Fainga'a is way behind both of those.
• Morahan is very inconsistent. There's a reason he's been on the outer at the Reds, brilliant one week, invisible the next. Cummins is better than Morahan's best and way more consistent. He also covers 13.
• If we learnt one thing this year it was that Horne is a much better 12 than a 13. Every time he played 13 he was invisible, but every time he played 12 he was very, very good. He can pass and he's very direct in the Nonu style, while his defence at 12 is exceptional.
• Mogg is starting to worry me. He was poor yesterday in a crunch game and in crunch games you expect your stars to fire. But, who else?
• A prop has to be 18 and I agree Manu is the next best.
• I much prefer Jones over Schatz and Cottrell must be a consideration too.
• We've got three really good 9's and then it all goes downhill fast. I'd bring back Burgess - McKibben is a favorite of mine but he's not a Wallaby contender.
• Smith has lost his Brumbies place to Kuridrani and CFS is pressing him hard for reserve reserve in my pecking order.

 

[kiap]

Barbarians is an English concept and a damn fine one at that.

Yep, Barbarian rugby is great. In the pro era it has struggled to attract the top players, even the original English club, but especially the variants in Aus, SA, France, and NZ.

IMO, the nomination of Aus Baabaas Club as the official 'A' team was both canny and cynical (no surprise there from the ARU). It's a bit of false marketing really but I suppose it keeps the Baabaa Ram's head logo and jersey alive.

Shouldn't we have our own Australian name for our equivalents?
Bandicoots, Eurekas, Mates, Bronzers, etc

On the wallaby with the Waltzing Matilda Swagmen? You may be interested in this from 57 years ago:

 

[Hugh Jarse]

That is a bloody good find kiap, and reinforces the place of Waltzing Matilda within the Australian Rugby cultural environment and heritage.

I like the idea of a "Pickup" Club known as the "Swagmen" or teh "Australian Swagmen" that plays exhibition matches for rugby related charities.

The wowsers and fun police will probably object.

 

[kiap]

That is a bloody good find kiap, and reinforces the place of Waltzing Matilda within the Australian Rugby cultural environment and heritage.

I like the idea of a "Pickup" Club known as the "Swagmen" or teh "Australian Swagmen" that plays exhibition matches for rugby related charities.

The wowsers and fun police will probably object.

Cheers, Hugh. I came across that a few months ago while trying to find out something about the history of the Australian Barbarians Club.

Wasn't able to find much as I don't have rugby books or old annual reports - although the Waltzing Matilda club looks like it might be the precursor to the Aus Baabaas which probably dates back to somewhere in the 60s.

<EDIT> 17 June 1957, Sydney: Australian Barbarians 6-23 New Zealand, North Sydney Oval. Tour match.

If anyone on GAGR has some info, I'd definitely be interested to read about it.

 

[Mr Doug]

Barbarians is an English concept and a damn fine one at that.

Shouldn't we have our own Australian name for our equivalents?
Bandicoots, Eurekas, Mates, Bronzers, etc

Why not employ racing parlance, "The (green and gold) Geldings"!!!