aus front row

[jay-c]

having only played one game in the front row in the u8s i feel others are better placed to comment on the dark arts. Id like to know from those in the know who our best props are?
i care little for how flashy a prop can be around the park, there are faster, more skillful players that can perform this role. the fox guys claimed mafu was our best scrumager the other week but was found out against the tahs big time. people say palmer is the best but doesnt do enough round the park?
its claimed robinson 'was' the best in the world?
do we have the cattle to dominate test scrums? or are we contempt with just being equal to 'provide a platform'?
if robinson and kepu are our best does playing them with tpn bring enough from their regular combination to outweight having moore start? does a front rows weekly combination have that much of an influence?
now both are fit is tpn the better scrumager? and moore better in the line out?
the reds props get pushed around at scrum time? how can they be expected to hold up against a kiwi or saffa scrum? the force? the rebels? i understand their hookers are considerably weeker come scrum time compared to brumbies and tahs- what is the answer?

 

[Joe Mac]

TPN looks to be heading back to his old form which is promising. After watching the Tah's dominate all other Aussie scrums, I think the Tah's front row should definitely be the Wallabies front row...

Add to that Palu and Barnes and you have all of the Tah's players who should be in the Wallaby XV

 

[fatprop]

If they pick 4 front rowers for the series, I would pick

Robinson
Kepu or Palmer
Slipper
Alexander

I would start

Robinson
Moore
Palmer

with Slipper and Nau on the bench

 

[rugbysmartarse]

scrums are funny things - it's not always about the best front row, but often about the best second row as well, all 5 working together. Kane Douglas in this regard is a bit of an unsung hero of the tahs pack. that said, this is about front rows.

I like the way palmer scrums, but he is purely a tighthead. Kepu is probably the most flexible in playing either side. Alexander is handy enough and experienced at test level. Robbo is probably the second name you'd put on the wallabys team sheet (after the captain). Slipper is also a pretty good scrummager, and it's good to get him test exposure at a young age, but I'd only play him in lesser matches.

Given Full fitness I'd pick Benn, Moore, Alexander with Kepu and TPN on the bench in the big games, and benn/ben, TPN, Kepu with Slipper and Moore on the bench in lesser games. Eventually one will get a knock and Palmer can come into the group, but I'd have him training with the wallabies this year with a view on the future. Weekes would have been a good option too as he is really coming along, but he wont feature again this year.

 

[MrTimms]

scrums are funny things - it's not always about the best front row, but often about the best second row as well, all 5 working together. Kane Douglas in this regard is a bit of an unsung hero of the tahs pack. that said, this is about front rows.

I like the way palmer scrums, but he is purely a tighthead. Kepu is probably the most flexible in playing either side. Alexander is handy enough and experienced at test level. Robbo is probably the second name you'd put on the wallabys team sheet (after the captain). Slipper is also a pretty good scrummager, and it's good to get him test exposure at a young age, but I'd only play him in lesser matches.

Given Full fitness I'd pick Benn, Moore, Alexander with Kepu and TPN on the bench in the big games, and benn/ben, TPN, Kepu with Slipper and Moore on the bench in lesser games. Eventually one will get a knock and Palmer can come into the group, but I'd have him training with the wallabies this year with a view on the future. Weekes would have been a good option too as he is really coming along, but he wont feature again this year.

You had me till you put Alexander at tight head.

 

[rugbysmartarse]

You had me till you put Alexander at tight head.

You've got to have some gravy, otherwise it's just meat and potatoes

 

[MrTimms]

You've got to have some gravy, otherwise it's just meat and potatoes

True, but I think we don't see the best of Alexander at tight head, the tight work he needs to do takes away from the loose stuff he is capable of.

I think I would rather Kepu or Slipper there.

Though I am a big fan of Palmer, especially at scrum time.

 

[rugbysmartarse]

I guess I was thinking about getting the best players on the park, but concede we would lose nothing with Kepu instead. Actually, we may gain some breakdown strength.

 

[cyclopath]

As with other posters on other threads, the time is now for us to put together a rock solid front row, if possible, that primarily scrums bloody well. We have persisted too long with an average to occasionally good, but never great, scrum. With the BIL series next year, this has to be a priority.
For that reason I like what fatprop posted. Except Alexander gives me the heebie-jeebies still at scrums.

 

[Braveheart81]

I think Robbo at LHP and Moore at hooker are obvious picks. Almost no one is debating those positions.

The other selections are out of Kepu, Slipper, Palmer and Alexander. Alexander is the best in the loose and worst in the scrum whilst Palmer offers the flipside to this. Slipper and Kepu are somewhere in between. I'd say that Kepu slightly shades Slipper in the scrum and Slipper shades Kepu around the park. That makes it a very tough choice.

I still think TPN is the best reserve hooker. He is arguably a better scrummaging hooker than Moore and as a player you are only going to require half an hour out of, he looks to be the best option to me. I think he is still a reasonable distance ahead of Hanson and Charles in this regard. His obvious weakness is his lineout throwing.

In terms of picking a THP and a reserve prop, I think Alexander's best position is as a reserve. His ability in the loose and to sniff out a try is surely at its best when oppositions are tiring. His best opportunity to hold his own in the scrum would also seemingly be when the opposition has brought on replacements or are tiring.

Whilst Palmer is an excellent scrummager and is improving around the field, I still think his general play is lacking, particularly at test level where we need all 8 of our forwards contributing strongly. Palmer must be a certainty to make his test debut against Scotland though when the team will predominantly be Force and Brumbies.

I really find it hard to choose between Kepu and Slipper for who should start. Kepu needs to assert himself more around the park. He is big and mobile and needs to run the ball more and put in some big tackles. Slipper is smaller but does both these things pretty well. At the moment I can't really make a decision. I think form over the next must decide who gets the nod (and who misses out entirely).

 

[Slim 293]

I'm not sure if Slipper's work around the park makes up for his scrummaging which I don't think is anywhere near as good as Kepu and Palmer....

Anyways, I'd have the 5 in the squad -

Robinson
Kepu
Palmer
Alexander
Slipper

I wouldn't think about anyone else...

If Palmer isn't starting at th then there's no use for him on the bench...

It should be noted that his workrate is improving though.

I would have to go for the 2 Tahs props though with Moore in the middle and then one of either Alexander or Slipper on the bench.

Palmer and Kepu can rotate at TH to share the workload.

 

[Bowside]

I'd have those 5 props as well as Moore, TPN and Hanson. Strongest looking front row in years.

 

[Richo]

While I'm annoyed that Tahs don't have Palmer anymore, it's been great for Australian rugby.

 

[fatprop]

While I'm annoyed that Tahs don't have Palmer anymore, it's been great for Australian rugby.

It came down to timing, Palmer went for the opportunity to get more game time, I think he made a very smart decision and the Tahs are doing OK without him.

The Tahs have a strong THP in Kepu who is 26(?) so he has 4-5 years left

 

[Gagger]

It's between Kepu and Palmer at THP for me. Slipper and moreso Alexander both have that penalty question mark hanging over them that's dogged us for years.

Likelihood of us seeing Mafood trot out in gold though......

 

[Penguin]

Is Greg Holmes rated by anybody here? The Reds scrum always looks a lot better when he's on the pitch & he does the tight work well. He can also pull off the odd wtf play ala Alexander. He's also getting to the age where props mature into canny bastards full of trickery & deciet.

 

[suckerforred]

Is Greg Holmes rated by anybody here? The Reds scrum always looks a lot better when he's on the pitch & he does the tight work well. He can also pull off the odd wtf play ala Alexander. He's also getting to the age where props mature into canny bastards full of trickery & deciet.

Agree Penguin, but I just don't think that he has it above the above mentioned. Cowan is another that is showing some good signs, but probably not good enough/consistant enough to force his way into the side.

The other thing that needs to be considered is the Deans factor. He is likely to read this and name the frount row of Eastwood 3's just to prove us all wrong.

 

[Richo]

It came down to timing, Palmer went for the opportunity to get more game time, I think he made a very smart decision and the Tahs are doing OK without him.

The Tahs have a strong THP in Kepu who is 26(?) so he has 4-5 years left

Yeah, I know. Just being greedy.

 

[TSR]

Penguin, I am a big fan of Holmes, but I think the other problem that he has is that he is still coming off the bench in most games. I know they rotate the props these days, but I think it still puts him at a disadvantage to props like Kepu, Slipper & Alexander. In saying that, I wish McKenzie would start him regularly because I think he is a worthy contender.

I still think our props have some way to go at scrum time, including Robinson who seems to be not hitting the heights he did before his injuries (but is still our best prop). Hope they will all prove me wrong, whoever is picked. I think Robinson & Moore should be straight forward selections (I can't understand why anyone would have Stephen Moore's spot in question). I would like to see them give Palmer a crack at THP, but doubt they will. Assuming they ignore Palmer then I hope Kepu starts with Slipper off the bench, simply because Kepu is a better scrummager. I think Holmes is a worthy contender for a spot in the squad.

 

[Paradox]

Kepu hasn't show he is up to international rugby. I'm not sure why he is rated at this stage. He had a very poor world cup both at the scrum and around the pitch and Bob Dwyer was scathing of him. He got targeted even more than Alexander.