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ARU fee structure change for 2015

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Inside Shoulder

Nathan Sharpe (72)
The ARU and the Super Rugby sides provide annual funding to the state unions.

The gap seems to be that no clubs whether they are village juniors or Shute Shield or subbies or whatever believe they are getting anything whatsoever because they get little or no direct funding.

Hold on - the Tahs were spun off from the NSWRU: the NSWRU own them. That's not funding its a license fee.
Not sure that the ARU money ever got lower than Shute Shield.
I don't think the people complaining on here are running SS clubs.
 

Braveheart81

Will Genia (78)
Staff member
Hold on - the Tahs were spun off from the NSWRU: the NSWRU own them. That's not funding its a license fee.
Not sure that the ARU money ever got lower than Shute Shield.
I don't think the people complaining on here are running SS clubs.

Yes, I know. But surely your comment is about semantics.

It is still the professional team that pays a set fee each year based on its revenue which funnels down to support the amateur side of the game in NSW.

The ARU provides direct funding to NSWRU as well and to community rugby programs.

Some people seem to be claiming that the funds have been going in the opposite direction which is not the case.
 

Brendan Hume

Charlie Fox (21)
Brendan Hume has posted a lot in this thread and is from a club in the seemingly very well run and growing Townville District Rugby Union organisation.

According to the TDRU annual report, they received 225k out of a total of 664k in 2012 in grants and subsidies and 74k out of 484k in 2013. How much of this money is from the QRU?

All that money from memory is State Govt grants - primarily for infrastructure, although some was for the QLD Govt Sports Coordinator grants I think.

The TDRU haven't received QRU funding since 2011 I believe.
 

RugbyReg

Rocky Elsom (76)
Staff member
that it is, when you consider everything else you pay for at this time of year (school fees, Christmas presents, we have a bucketload of family birthdays).
 

Strewthcobber

Simon Poidevin (60)
The ARU provides direct funding to NSWRU as well and to community rugby programs.

Some people seem to be claiming that the funds have been going in the opposite direction which is not the case.

Most of the funding for the ARU and state union community allocations goes to pay the salaries and expenses of development offices, in the various programs that they run. Not much goes directly to any club, and any grants in annual reports are usually from the government.

The 2012 annual report has 166,913 irregular school players. They are all dodgy numbers so take that as indicative but is that where the development officers spend a lot (most?) of their time? (eg "Try Rugby"). Is that where most of the pro funding is going?
 

Brendan Hume

Charlie Fox (21)
The ARU provides direct funding to NSWRU as well and to community rugby programs.

Some people seem to be claiming that the funds have been going in the opposite direction which is not the case.

I can't remember anyone claiming that the grassroots is directly paying for the professional game. The ARU and states have community rugby programs that will no longer be paid for by the professional game, and this will improve the bottom line of those organisations.

Any thinking that the grassroots props up the professional game in any direct capacity is misguided other than to say that in all likelihood, the vast majority of revenues from the sport of rugby come from the grassroots rugby community.

I think it is worthwhile reviewing again what is happening here - the national and state bodies are looking to withdraw their funding support of grassroots rugby - which, considering they're bleeding from every orifice, they are entitled to do - however they wish to keep control of those grassroots programs. It's my belief that this is what is upsetting to most opponents of the proposed changes to the funding model.

When you consider TWAS's analysis on The Roar of the progress of players to professionalism, which highlights that the majority come through recognised pathways, and the most significant pathway is through Schools football (I may be taking some licence with his report here), I think it's extremely arrogant of the ARU and states to think the grassroots would want to pay for any community rugby programs that we don't directly control. The vast majority of grassroots participants and volunteers just want to have a good, strong competition where, aside from some rep footy and cultural cross pollination with other regions through tours, etc, maximising participation in the sport which we all love, and whose code of ethics we all hold to most closely resemble our own is the end goal.
 

Quick Hands

David Wilson (68)
It is still the professional team that pays a set fee each year based on its revenue which funnels down to support the amateur side of the game in NSW.

The professional team, which is owned by the governing body and which has built up assets since 1874 based on work by volunteers.

It's like saying tenants are funding landlords. The Waratahs are paying a licence fee to their owners, funding implies that this is being done for altruistic reasons, but it's not, it's being done for contractual reasons.

That's more than semantics I'm afraid.
 

Brendan Hume

Charlie Fox (21)
QRU AGM this weekend. Wonder if there will be any drama at it.
There's certainly a lot of discontent from the people who hold voting entitlements.

It was interesting to re-read the Arbib report on governance in Australian Rugby (which was prompted by the Roar article posted here last week). The report discusses the issues that surround our organisations when compared with other sports domestically and internationally - from memory, Arbib couldn't cite another example where the grassroots and professional aspects of the sport were so strongly intertwined, which obviously creates tensions.

The hangover from the amateur days has lasted for an awfully long time. Maybe the suggestion a few weeks ago that the professional arm separate from the amateur arm will gain traction if the grassroots funding reform program isn't supported.
 

Braveheart81

Will Genia (78)
Staff member
The professional team, which is owned by the governing body and which has built up assets since 1874 based on work by volunteers.

It's like saying tenants are funding landlords. The Waratahs are paying a licence fee to their owners, funding implies that this is being done for altruistic reasons, but it's not, it's being done for contractual reasons.

That's more than semantics I'm afraid.

OK. Let's call the Waratahs the revenue generating arm of the NSWRU.

Funding doesn't imply they are doing it for altruistic reasons. It just describes the direction the money is flowing.
 

Quick Hands

David Wilson (68)
OK. Let's call the Waratahs the revenue generating arm of the NSWRU.

Funding doesn't imply they are doing it for altruistic reasons. It just describes the direction the money is flowing.

I've never heard funding described in that way before. To me funding implies that the payment is discretionary.

I might add that I haven't heard many people (if anyone) ask for ARU or NSWRU funding i.e. direct additional financial support for their junior club. What most of us want is for the governing body to provide an administrative framework for the whole game to be run, coaching and development resources and to be able to minimise costs by economies of scale wherever possible.

People aren't against being asked to pay a reasonable amount for these services, but what we all expect is: that the process is explained to us, our consent is asked for and given and there is transparency as to how the money is to be allocated and spent.

What we have been told is: you're going to have to pay what we tell you to pay, you have no say in it and we're not going to tell you where the money is going. And by the way, if you object we'll call you non-compliant and make various threats.
 

Inside Shoulder

Nathan Sharpe (72)
Yes, I know. But surely your comment is about semantics.

No its not about semantics: its about the idea of the people who play, have played, administer, volunteer, BBQ having ownership of the game which exists only because they and their predecessors for 100 years put in the hard yards to provide a platform so the current generation could be paid to play a game that until 1995 was played for nothing.
When the NSWRU go the right to play s15 and the ARU got big bucks from 1995 that was the realisation of effort put in over many many years by unpaid people: they hold the game on trust for its amateur participants.
 

Wheatman

Chris McKivat (8)
QRU AGM this weekend. Wonder if there will be any drama at it.

Hang on, let me think about this. The chair of QRU is up for re-election, is backing a very unpopular policy that is poorly explained and has its voting constituents openly unhappy with the organisation pushing it. Where have I seen this play out recently?!

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk
 

Brendan Hume

Charlie Fox (21)
One can only hope that if blood is spilled, the ARU and states look to implement a model for participation that is inclusive of all of the ways that people interact with the game. Continuation of the petty politics that have plagued the game for the best part of a century will continue to fail. A visionary leader that unites the game is what is needed.


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TSR

Andrew Slack (58)
I don't really know what to think about this. IMO Rod McCall & Jim Carmichael did a wonderful job in guiding the Reds back from a disastrous position when they came in.

However, I have been very disappointed in the handling of this entire issue, the apparent lack of understanding from the QRU of the impact of these changes and the lack of willingness to try and address the concerns of the sub unions and clubs below them.
 

nugget

Jimmy Flynn (14)
$300 reg fees for U6's is utter bullshit. Too bad I love the game too much to go to AFL,which is $65 and is actually organised properly.

Rugby once again relies on the goodwill of its fans, but my goodwill is running out. What they are doing to the junior clubs is pathetic.
 
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