Argentina v Australia II @ 5.10am 14/08

[eastman]

Exactly right- I feel the criticism of Wright is completely over the top when you consider both his experience and the leeway given to so many other players who have played 15 over the years. Kurtley Beale has countless shockers over the years.

 

[eastman]

Tupou also needs to stop the habit of receiving the ball stationary every time. it might work in Super Rugby AU where he can use his strength and athleticism to dominate contact but it’s not working at this leve.

 

[dru]

Exactly right- I feel the criticism of Wright is completely over the top when you consider both his experience and the leeway given to so many other players who have played 15 over the years. Kurtley Beale has countless shockers over the years.

From my POV the criticism of Wright is about Wright at 15 in that game where the back three/four under the highball were hopeless. He certainly did not provide the organisation that is needed at 15. Nor the back three performance that is needed at 14. Is not that we should right the guy off, we just can't afford for that to happen again. Certainly not against the Springboks.

My other pet hate is our 9 and 10 being too precious at times to defend.

A lot there MST. Strange that you argue to temper concerns with Wright and follow with thoughts that have me feeling I need to say the same about JOC (James O'Connor). Let me stick to just that quote. Over on ESPN they have adjusted the stats for tackles and it looks more sensible. Still, In that last game JOC (James O'Connor) made 8 tackles, putting him up there with Swain, Tupou, McReight, Valetine on 9 (Lonergan workhorse on 14). Nor do I think White has been a slouch in previous games though with Argentina it was the 10 channel being attacked. Quite the opposite, I couldn't understand why the pack wasn't doing more to protect JOC (James O'Connor). Something that the coaches need to look at in the team structures. Likewise both White and JOC (James O'Connor) were left with little option but to run, because players weren't where they were expecting, not making the gain line, basically because the go-forward was being pushed back.

TLDR: The issue wasn't Wright per se, it was lack of organisation in the back 3 and Wright was not the answer to that issue. JOC (James O'Connor) was fine, exposed in front of a pack that should have been in front of him.

 

[DELETE ACCOUNT]

Oh you mean let them go play league, because they sure as shit aren't going to stop signing them young... should we not have signed Beale, JOC (James O'Connor) (James O'Connor), Tupou, AAA, Quade, Loeislo, Pastioa, Carter, Donaldson, Tate, Gits... The list goes on, they all would have been signed in league

Yep if thats what they want to do, plenty of more talent at 16-18 years old in rugby. Remember the RL is saturated and many of these names might not have even cracked the highest level.

and rugby needs to work on its contracting model so it is attractive instead of trying to go head to head in the same manner with mungoball.

 

[Tomthumb]

There are only 17 NRL teams, I hardly think that can fit all those players in.

If they want to play league, let them go. Develop the ones that want to play rugby. Our best ever 10 came from reserve grade club football. Two decades of chasing schoolboy stars hasn't won us anything

 

[Tomikin]

Yep if thats what they want to do, plenty of more talent at 16-18 years old in rugby. Remember the Rugby League is saturated and many of these names might not have even cracked the highest level.

and rugby needs to work on its contracting model so it is attractive instead of trying to go head to head in the same manner with mungoball.

nope, if there is no oppertunities for a contract to they are 24 - 25, they will end up in France, England, Japan or League. Your kidding yourself if you think this will work.

EDIT:- You didn't say 16 to 18 either you said let them go play senior rugby till their 24 - 25.

 

[Tomikin]

There are only 17 NRL teams, I hardly think that can fit all those players in.

If they want to play league, let them go. Develop the ones that want to play rugby. Our best ever 10 came from reserve grade club football. Two decades of chasing schoolboy stars hasn't won us anything

You seriously think kids are going to wait till their 24 -25 to earn a wage from sport... you guys are seriously living in the past.

Is that what you did ex all black trialist ?

 

[Tomthumb]

You seriously think kids are going to wait till their 24 -25 to earn a wage from sport... you guys are seriously living in the past.

Is that what you did ex all black trialist ?

All Black Trialist??

All I know is all these schoolboy stars haven't won anything, the last 20 years have been nothing but signing these guys and losing every year. Something needs to change

 

[LeCheese]

The Improving the State of Australian Rugby Master Plan™

 

[DELETE ACCOUNT]

nope, if there is no oppertunities for a contract to they are 24 - 25, they will end up in France, England, Japan or League. Your kidding yourself if you think this will work.

EDIT:- You didn't say 16 to 18 either you said let them go play senior rugby till their 24 - 25.

I said stop recruiting in the school yard

 

[DELETE ACCOUNT]

All Black Trialist??

All I know is all these schoolboy stars haven't won anything, the last 20 years have been nothing but signing these guys and losing every year. Something needs to change

Agree

Why are we so preoccupied with what mungoball does?
Why cant we build our own program that has clearly defined opportunities that is attractive for those players who are committed to rugby and all the better things the game has?

If you think filling the place with mercenaries is the way to go then I suggest the rusted on hard core engine room of the game will find other ways than support the professional wing of the game. OH WAIT that is what is already happening. Shute Shield and QPR has resurgence of support happening as we speak. Why? because it is a good product that is cost effective for the punter to follow.

 

[Braveheart81]

I said stop recruiting in the school yard

Pick us a Wallabies squad entirely of players who didn't have a Super Rugby contract by age 20 then.

I think you're living in the past. There is no option of thinking that our best young talent are going to play several years of amateur club rugby waiting for a professional contract in their early 20s.

 

[RugbyReg]

Tupou also needs to stop the habit of receiving the ball stationary every time. it might work in Super Rugby AU where he can use his strength and athleticism to dominate contact but it’s not working at this leve.

while his discipline has been poor I actually think his running game is as good as ever. Because he's doing it in tight. He's incredibly successful at not only getting over the advantage line but at getting quick ball back. I think he's vastly improved in this area.

 

[John S]

Pick us a Wallabies squad entirely of players who didn't have a Super Rugby contract by age 20 then.

I think you're living in the past. There is no option of thinking that our best young talent are going to play several years of amateur club rugby waiting for a professional contract in their early 20s.

That's what already happening - Union can't compete with the offers to school kids by Mungoball, and we're losing that talent before they've left school and got into senior rugby (I think I'm agreeing with you here BH)

 

[Tomikin]

Agree

Why are we so preoccupied with what mungoball does?
Why cant we build our own program that has clearly defined opportunities that is attractive for those players who are committed to rugby and all the better things the game has?

If you think filling the place with mercenaries is the way to go then I suggest the rusted on hard core engine room of the game will find other ways than support the professional wing of the game. OH WAIT that is what is already happening. Shute Shield and QPR has resurgence of support happening as we speak. Why? because it is a good product that is cost effective for the punter to follow.

We aren't but they do go after the same talent we do, you have to live with the reality that we are in a competitive market for talent with AFL and NRL, and if we don't provide a contract to these players they will go else were... No one is going to sit around and wait for Rugby to not pay them..

We currently have a great batch of young men who got contracted young (look at the 10's the forwards we have picked up from the last few under 20's. your idea of just letting them play senior mens would have seen alot of them gone to other places..

Pick us a Wallabies squad entirely of players who didn't have a Super Rugby contract by age 20 then.

I think you're living in the past. There is no option of thinking that our best young talent are going to play several years of amateur club rugby waiting for a professional contract in their early 20s.

This, I love rugby so much that I will play for free or play NRL for 80 k.... ridiculous. And the idea that what we doing isn't working so lets go back the other way and pay them nothing.... Maybe we just have to get better at providing paid pathways and talent identification for young men to stay in our game.

We are also hamstrung by only having 5 professional teams, image if we had the money and cash for 17 teams with the salary cap of the NRL. We would be laughing..

 

[Braveheart81]

It's the notion that we can somehow build a Wallabies team out of players like Conor Vest, Ryan Smith and Jock Campbell and it will be better than the one we currently have.

 

[DELETE ACCOUNT]

Pick us a Wallabies squad entirely of players who didn't have a Super Rugby contract by age 20 then.

I think you're living in the past. There is no option of thinking that our best young talent are going to play several years of amateur club rugby waiting for a professional contract in their early 20s.

even Michael Hooper played amateur colts rugby before he signed a contract.

Why sign them at 17/18 when we can let them develop and show their skills then sign at 20 ? recon we might sort a bit more wheat from the chaff.

 

[Braveheart81]

even Michael Hooper played amateur colts rugby before he signed a contract.

Why sign them at 17/18 when we can let them develop and show their skills then sign at 20 ? recon we might sort a bit more wheat from the chaff.

Hooper made his Super Rugby debut when he was 18 and had a pro contract the first year out of school. I'm not sure he's a good example to further your argument.

Very few players get substantial contracts at age 17/18. It's probably a couple per team each year. Most of the players that age in the the under 20 squad (Gen Blue for the Waratahs) where they are paid next to nothing (or actually nothing).

 

[Joe Blow]

Viking, correct me if I am reading the recent history incorrectly, but McReight had a clean sheet and one penalty in his two games against Argentina. In the three games against England, Hooper was responsible for 4 penalties with no clean sheets.

Is that right?

It is pretty usual for the role of the 7 to be in the eye of the whistle blower I would think.

He needs to pick his moments better. You cannot get isolated in test footy. All opposition players are on you like seagulls on a chip. Hes very good and will only get better.

 

[Serge]

Identify young talent, offer them some form of contract - but they don't go directly to a Super Rugby squad unless they are absolute freaks (and even then go back to Club Rugby if they are not up to it). Instead they have to go and prove themselves in QPR or Shute Shield level Rugby against men for at least one season, demonstrating that they have the skills and the physical attributes to play regularly in first grade against men (and dominate). Then, and only then, do they get a crack in the Super Rugby squad. This also helps grassroots Rugby.