Great thread Blue and excellent timing (it's not a whinge if you get it in ahead of time... ). Also nicely argued so far all.
I'd noticed the 'taking up the space' call more in S15 this year and so my hopes had been raised.
I'm really not sure what you're disagreeing with here - just about everyone's point is that refs should be reffing it but aren't, which is what you've just said?
Nevertheless, a point to remember is just how little time you need to buy yourself for this tactic to be successful. Saying "they can go around" (if the refs let them) misses the point because the literal 0.5 seconds that might take is the difference between getting hands-on or counter-rucking, and arriving at a set ruck - which is partly what makes it such a cunning ruse.
Even worse is that stone wall can wrongly be seen to set the offside line for the now defending team at the ruck.
As I've said for a while this is one of the best ruses you can use at a ruck because refs are understandably so focused on what's going on with the ball, that anything more than a metre or two away from it is really unlikely to get pinged.
It's guilty as sin though.
I'd noticed the 'taking up the space' call more in S15 this year and so my hopes had been raised.
Here is where i disagree. If the players have advanced past the ball, so what? They are no longer part of the ruck so go around them. The ball is out. If the ref isnt allowing that to happen that is his fault, not the laws or the players pushing past the ball. Ref it properly and the advantage of going past the ball is not there. A non issue.
I'm really not sure what you're disagreeing with here - just about everyone's point is that refs should be reffing it but aren't, which is what you've just said?
Nevertheless, a point to remember is just how little time you need to buy yourself for this tactic to be successful. Saying "they can go around" (if the refs let them) misses the point because the literal 0.5 seconds that might take is the difference between getting hands-on or counter-rucking, and arriving at a set ruck - which is partly what makes it such a cunning ruse.
Even worse is that stone wall can wrongly be seen to set the offside line for the now defending team at the ruck.
As I've said for a while this is one of the best ruses you can use at a ruck because refs are understandably so focused on what's going on with the ball, that anything more than a metre or two away from it is really unlikely to get pinged.
It's guilty as sin though.