AIC Rugby 2018

[Galloper]

Hi,
I'll go back an read my earlier comments however I do not think I ever attempted to justify the number that SPC got selected as being accurate, correct, fair or justified. I simply stated what I knew.

You are correct, I am not a selector, nor do I have a son at SPC. I am an old boy from long ago and do not have any active affiliation with the school. I remember getting belted 50+ by SLC & MCA and truely regretting my chosen sport after playing St Edmunds at Ipswich one particularly day. To get two players nominated on the reserves bench out my 1st XV team was a big deal. I now live in Toowoomba and have not seen an AIC game at all this year, I do have well placed sources at MCA, SLC & Villa.

I personally do not think it is healthy for the competition to have one school so heavily represented, no matter the school. I would like a little more acknowledgement that SPC is no longer the easy beats of the competition, though still lack depth in some age groups. I too struggle to believe that MCA did not get a better run at the selection table. I can only think that a number of players had declared themselves as unavailable? It is overly simplistic to say that MCA beat SPC at home so therefore they deserve more. The season as a whole needs to be reviewed and performances across all games considered. It needs to be remembered that three teams had great seasons, only losing one game each all season so a more balanced assessment should've been reached.

So enjoy dissecting the selections, but remember they are only boys, barely young men, so please measure your comments.

Thanks Thommo, that's a good and fair response.

However, I don't think I was being unreasonable or simplistic in suggesting that SPC has been massively over-represented on this occasion.

I happen to genuinely believe that MCA was the better of the two teams both individually and collectively, as borne out by the result of the game between them, but that's purely my opinion.

I will eventually find out what really happened with the AIC selections from own sources, but match day selections and results for the team in the interim will be extremely interesting.

It suffices to say that, ultimately, the selectors are going to be made to look either very good or very foolish by the team's performance at the upcoming trials.

 

[Ali Barber]

Thanks Thommo, that's a good and fair response.

However, I don't think I was being unreasonable or simplistic in suggesting that SPC has been massively over-represented on this occasion.

I happen to genuinely believe that MCA was the better of the two teams both individually and collectively, as borne out by the result of the game between them, but that's purely my opinion.

I will eventually find out what really happened with the AIC selections from own sources, but match day selections and results for the team in the interim will be extremely interesting.

It suffices to say that, ultimately, the selectors are going to be made to look either very good or very foolish by the team's performance at the upcoming trials.

Galloper and Thommo, it goes deeper than that gents. It sets the Players who deserve to be there at a distinct disadvantage not to be forming the best of AIC and having a fair chance to show their wears as representing all the AIC Schools as well as putting a good show on against the two GPS teams as well as a descent playing field for their own selections. It's not good for the GPS teams who have taken the time for a good selection base as it doesn't stretch them in their strengths or weaknesses.

 

[I play wing]

Thommo

I know, or at least assume, that you're not an AIC selector, but you're going to have a very hard time convincing anyone that SPC got 11 boys in this squad on merit.

Firstly, SPC were soundly beaten at home 30-14 by an under-strength MCA on Old Boys day.

Secondly, it can be argued that SPC got lucky with the scheduling of their game against Iona, coming after Iona played their "grand final" against MCA, although that was definitely a great performance by them and a well deserved victory.

Trying to put all bias aside though, whilst acknowledging my own, how many SPC boys do you think would make a side picked purely from MCA and SPC boys -maybe 6 at best?

I know that having guys like Heenan and Plath (presumably) unavailable skews the selections a bit, but I can't accept that this squad is anywhere near representative of the best 27 boys in the AIC. For example, as I've already said, the 3 guys from Villa are charity cases.

As for the meeting being short, rugby selection meetings are like political pre-selections in that often "the numbers are in" well beforehand. I'm very confident that the representatives of MCA and Iona aren't anywhere near as comfortable with the outcome as you clearly are.

You're totally underselling what was a very good and somewhat groundbreaking win for St Pats here champ. To say that they 'got lucky' over Iona in a piss weak excuse. If Iona played St Pats the week after for sure you could make an argument for that but the match was played over a month later. Adding to the crap argument you've made is St Pats grinded out a very tough and physical loss against Ashgrove only a week prior. In this match only MCA properly drew away in the last 15 minutes. Please don't forget St Pats lead for most of that match. Yes I agree Ashgrove were the better team for the full 70 minutes but St Pats undoubtedly are as deserving as any college for this years shield.

In terms of player quality I think it would be very rich to suggest that St Pats was that far behind Ashgrove in any department. Kuhn in the front row would be the top prop in the competition having played QLD 2 last year. Most of the other forwards are not one trick ponies. In the backline you've got O'Reagan who would be the best defensive No. 9 in the comp comfortably, Scurr who had one of the strongest kicking games, Skelton who is a bloody hard ball runner, Alexander who runs with wheels, Smith at fullback who was probably the fastest player in the competition (this was evidenced well vs. Ashgrove) as well as Maritz who has been well documented already.

I'm happy to say that I support St Pats but I put this forward as somebody who saw Iona, Ashgrove, Padua, St Peters and St Pats play this year (not all against SPC either). Undoubtedly a number of the good players from Ash, Iona and Padua ruled themselves out of contention but all of these 11 players have either held their own or outplayed their opposite numbers against both the top and underperforming colleges this year and to suggest that they're only there only politics is unfairly degrading to them.

*Rant over*

 

[mbthommo]

Galloper and Thommo, it goes deeper than that gents. It sets the Players who deserve to be there at a distinct disadvantage not to be forming the best of AIC and having a fair chance to show their wears as representing all the AIC Schools as well as putting a good show on against the two GPS teams as well as a descent playing field for their own selections. It's not good for the GPS teams who have taken the time for a good selection base as it doesn't stretch them in their strengths or weaknesses.

Yeap I agree with that. QLD Rugby should also play a bigger part in the coordination of selections of all teams, i.e. methods. numbers etc.
The best players should have the opportunity to play in the best teams against the best teams, no matter their conference, GPS/AIC etc. Which I think had a part to play in the mixing of the players to even the field, so to speak

 

[Galloper]

You're totally underselling what was a very good and somewhat groundbreaking win for St Pats here champ. To say that they 'got lucky' over Iona in a piss weak excuse. If Iona played St Pats the week after for sure you could make an argument for that but the match was played over a month later. Adding to the crap argument you've made is St Pats grinded out a very tough and physical loss against Ashgrove only a week prior. In this match only MCA properly drew away in the last 15 minutes. Please don't forget St Pats lead for most of that match. Yes I agree Ashgrove were the better team for the full 70 minutes but St Pats undoubtedly are as deserving as any college for this years shield.

In terms of player quality I think it would be very rich to suggest that St Pats was that far behind Ashgrove in any department. Kuhn in the front row would be the top prop in the competition having played QLD 2 last year. Most of the other forwards are not one trick ponies. In the backline you've got O'Reagan who would be the best defensive No. 9 in the comp comfortably, Scurr who had one of the strongest kicking games, Skelton who is a bloody hard ball runner, Alexander who runs with wheels, Smith at fullback who was probably the fastest player in the competition (this was evidenced well vs. Ashgrove) as well as Maritz who has been well documented already.

I'm happy to say that I support St Pats but I put this forward as somebody who saw Iona, Ashgrove, Padua, St Peters and St Pats play this year (not all against SPC either). Undoubtedly a number of the good players from Ash, Iona and Padua ruled themselves out of contention but all of these 11 players have either held their own or outplayed their opposite numbers against both the top and underperforming colleges this year and to suggest that they're only there only politics is unfairly degrading to them.

*Rant over*

Geez “champ”, I think that, like your spelling, your comprehension skills need a fair bit of work.

If you take the time to dislodge that massive chip from your shoulder and read my post again you might realise that you’re not actually responding to my points, but I’m not going to waste my time reiterating them for you.

Having read your rundown of the SPC boys I have to say it’s a complete mystery how Ashgrove managed to beat them, and on their own deck, but anyway.......

As I have said, your boys will get the chance to prove to me and everyone else whether they in fact deserved selection, my sympathies are with the boys from other schools who have been denied that chance by politics and not form.

And by the way, I’m unaware of anyone from MCA who was unavailable for selection.

 

[George Magherkinsquirter]

Isn't this supposed to be a forum for adults. Not a bunch of spoilt brats that didn't get their own way. As someone mentioned earlier the team was picked by all the coaches. So if you have a problem about little Johnny not being selected maybe you should question the coaches from your school. Instead of pissing and moaning it's all about politics. Obviously they think as a whole they picked the right team

 

[Tall Paul]

Isn't this supposed to be a forum for adults. Not a bunch of spoilt brats that didn't get their own way. As someone mentioned earlier the team was picked by all the coaches. So if you have a problem about little Johnny not being selected maybe you should question the coaches from your school. Instead of pissing and moaning it's all about politics. Obviously they think as a whole they picked the right team

Pissing and moaning indeed.

Christ on a bike, how about a little less grandstanding about the politics of school sport.

Blah, blah, blah, this kid is better than that kid. We sound like the bloody GPS thread.

If a Padua coach has selected 11 St Pats boys then he has done so with the support of 7 other coaches and with the consent of the director of sports from all 8 schools. He sees something you don’t. Let it go.

It might come as a bit of a shock to you, but these guys know what they are doing. If they are unsure, I wouldn’t be holding my breath waiting for them to look here for your sage opinion and advice.

 

[Managreve]

Thou protest a little too loudly. By definition a forum is where ideas are challenged and contrary opinions voiced. From what I’ve read the majority is polite and often valid.

 

[I play wing]

Geez “champ”, I think that, like your spelling, your comprehension skills need a fair bit of work.

If you take the time to dislodge that massive chip from your shoulder and read my post again you might realise that you’re not actually responding to my points, but I’m not going to waste my time reiterating them for you.

Having read your rundown of the SPC boys I have to say it’s a complete mystery how Ashgrove managed to beat them, and on their own deck, but anyway...

As I have said, your boys will get the chance to prove to me and everyone else whether they in fact deserved selection, my sympathies are with the boys from other schools who have been denied that chance by politics and not form.

And by the way, I’m unaware of anyone from MCA who was unavailable for selection.

Thank you for your reply bud. As stated earlier Ashgrove where the better team for the full 70 minutes and this is why they won. St Pats were the better team for a large portion of the match but ultimately a game is decided only on the final result. theres no denying that. As expressed earlier, St Pats is full of players who deserve a shot at the trials as much as any other boy in the competition based on performance. Most won't make it, maybe none will, when put up against the best Queensland has to offer but the same would be said for any other player selected. In terms of the AIC, the side is as stated by George Magherkinsquirter amongst others, selected with all schools at the table. I highly doubt one coach would be able to convince seven others to select a large number of his boys if he couldn't justify it. Ultimately you're not hurting anybody on this forum but you certainly are belittling the achievements of the young men who've worked hard to be where they are.

 

[Getwithme]

Do they still select a chairman xv? Hopefully some of the boys mentioned in here along with some boys out side the regular pathways are included. I wish Queensland rugby came out with a clear understanding of what the process is for selection (who is eligble, what criteria) and what is going on with selection games as this years format has seemed to change.

 

[Galloper]

Thank you for your reply bud. As stated earlier Ashgrove where the better team for the full 70 minutes and this is why they won. St Pats were the better team for a large portion of the match but ultimately a game is decided only on the final result. theres no denying that. As expressed earlier, St Pats is full of players who deserve a shot at the trials as much as any other boy in the competition based on performance. Most won't make it, maybe none will, when put up against the best Queensland has to offer but the same would be said for any other player selected. In terms of the AIC, the side is as stated by George Magherkinsquirter amongst others, selected with all schools at the table. I highly doubt one coach would be able to convince seven others to select a large number of his boys if he couldn't justify it. Ultimately you're not hurting anybody on this forum but you certainly are belittling the achievements of the young men who've worked hard to be where they are.

“Belittling”?

Ok.

 

[Garry Owens]

Come come now gentlemen !

Marist only copped it for 2 spots tops , which , as I have sincerely acknowledged, sucks ass for those boys

You could take 2 spots away from Pats maybe if Heenan and Plath were available ( but they weren't )

Villa seem as though they robbed a couple of places but Lauries missed on Peter Lamin ( if he was available )

In the overall scheme of things ......it all balances out and we might only be talking about a redistribution of 4 spots

Hardly worthwhile to release the hounds and go baying for blood in a fervour pitch of injustice

But still good to see a bit of passion .......a bit of schtick ........a bit of salt following some selection pepper ........at the end of the AIC season

 

[Garry Owens]

My dear Thommo

You are going to have the opportunity for Inter-Conference thermo mixing next year in the Met /District format

As I have said I believe this will thin AIC numbers significantly in the "first round' of Open Rep

Across the 3 Brisbane x Districts that AIC resides in I'd be stunned if there are more than 15 AIC Reps in North , East and West

12 less than this year

In terms of this year - 27 to a Squad and 4 Squads where 50% of the participants were AIC or CSS , truthfully , was a bit fanciful

If, as you suggest , the GPS Devil Slavemasters agreed and then rolled over in what was proposed then :

A. I'm not surprised

and

B. They deserve to have their asses kicked in what would appear to be affirmative action tilting if GPS Schools were "capped" ( in effect ) and 50% of trial spots were mandated , automatically, for AIC and CSS boys

There is a responsibility for all in positions of authority or influence here , as pathway custodians , to maintain proper focus on the best and most meritorious Rugby outcomes - not be the tail that wags the dog

 

[Tall Paul]

My dear Thommo

You are going to have the opportunity for Inter-Conference thermo mixing next year in the Met /District format

As I have said I believe this will thin AIC numbers significantly in the "first round' of Open Rep

Across the 3 Brisbane x Districts that AIC resides in I'd be stunned if there are more than 15 AIC Reps in North , East and West

12 less than this year

In terms of this year - 27 to a Squad and 4 Squads where 50% of the participants were AIC or CSS , truthfully , was a bit fanciful

If, as you suggest , the GPS Devil Slavemasters agreed and then rolled over in what was proposed then :

A. I'm not surprised

and

B. They deserve to have their asses kicked in what would appear to be affirmative action tilting if GPS Schools were "capped" ( in effect ) and 50% of trial spots were mandated , automatically, for AIC and CSS boys

There is a responsibility for all in positions of authority or influence here , as pathway custodians , to maintain proper focus on the best and most meritorious Rugby outcomes - not be the tail that wags the dog

Hahahaha. GO you old stirrer. Back to the GPS thread with you now. We will have none of that sort of talk here.

 

[mbthommo]

My dear Thommo

You are going to have the opportunity for Inter-Conference thermo mixing next year in the Met /District format

As I have said I believe this will thin AIC numbers significantly in the "first round' of Open Rep

Across the 3 Brisbane x Districts that AIC resides in I'd be stunned if there are more than 15 AIC Reps in North , East and West

12 less than this year

In terms of this year - 27 to a Squad and 4 Squads where 50% of the participants were AIC or CSS , truthfully , was a bit fanciful

If, as you suggest , the GPS Devil Slavemasters agreed and then rolled over in what was proposed then :

A. I'm not surprised

and

B. They deserve to have their asses kicked in what would appear to be affirmative action tilting if GPS Schools were "capped" ( in effect ) and 50% of trial spots were mandated , automatically, for AIC and CSS boys

There is a responsibility for all in positions of authority or influence here , as pathway custodians , to maintain proper focus on the best and most meritorious Rugby outcomes - not be the tail that wags the dog

Morning,
I'm not really fussed either way. I simply passed on what I read. It did throw the AIC selction process out a bit, but personally I don't really mind.
As I said earlier, I live in Toowoomba now and I know that selection in the Darling Downs team, no matter the sport, is held in very high regard, and it is something a lot of the older rugby boys have missed out on due to GPS selection etc.

It will be really interesting to see how it plays out over the next couple of years. With Darling Downs able to pick from Grammar/Downlands/Dalby/Goondiwindi it is a fair talent pool. Throw in the emerging Sudanese boys (who are huge, one young fella I saw running around recently looked like he had been carved from granite) and they may upset a few of the metropolitan teams. But with everything, selections, injuries and time to gel will tell the story in the end.

 

[Garry Owens]

We got Thommo ! Thommo ! He knows what Rugby is all about
( seemed like I had to post it )

 

[Confucius Say]

Iona College has won the AIC rugby point aggregate for the first time. Celebration in 60th anniversary.

Unofficial 1st XV table below.

AIC - 2018 FIRST XV
P W L D Pts PF PA
Ashgrove 7 6 1 0 12 351 88
St Pats 7 6 1 0 12 290 92
Iona 7 6 1 0 12 293 124
Villa 7 4 3 0 8 244 193
Padua 7 3 4 0 6 167 201
SPLC 7 3 4 0 6 176 269
SLC 7 1 6 0 2 99 293
SEC 7 0 7 0 0 72 472

 

[Kick and Chase]

Blake Roza has pulled out and has been replaced by Byrnes from MCA

 

[Garry Owens]

A shame for one but a good ( and deserved ) opportunity for another

He's an interesting player BB - at the start of this season some thought he might play the 2 spot before he ended up at 8. Anyway - good on him

 

[Prince Henry]

Associated Independent Colleges (AIC)​

1​

​

John Downes​

Marist College Ashgrove​

2​

​

Sam Finocchiaro​

Iona College​

3​

​

Brad Kuhn​

St Patrick’s College​

4​

​

Ben Geraghty​

Marist College Ashgrove​

5​

​

Harry Fox​

Padua College​

6​

​

KoTahi Hetaraka​

Iona College​

7​

​

Ethan Reese​

St Patrick’s College​

8​

​

Ben Byrne​

Marist College Ashgrove​

9​

​

Connor O’Regan​

St Patrick’s College​

10​

​

Zach Hogan​

Marist College Ashgrove​

11​

​

Louis Maritz​

St Patrick’s College​

12​

​

Conrad Skelton​

St Patrick’s College​

13​

​

Cruz Alexander​

St Patrick’s College​

14​

​

Lachlan Tenison-Woods​

Marist College Ashgrove​

15​

​

Shaquille McLeod​

Marist College Ashgrove​

16​

​

Morgan Prendergast​

St Patrick’s College​

17​

​

Tyreece Felu​

Villanova College​

18​

​

Baguio Johnson-Tiumalu​

St Peter’s Lutheran College​

19​

​

Bruce Tevaga​

Padua College​

20​

​

James Livingston​

Villanova College​

21​

​

Okaw Obonno​

St Patrick’s College​

22​

​

Tom Crowley​

Iona College​

23​

​

Connor Scurr​

St Patrick’s College​

24​

​

Zac Stannard​

St Laurence’s College​

25​

​

Jack Smith​

St Patrick’s College​

26​

​

Edan Zaupa​

St Peter’s Lutheran College​

​

​

Coach: Brendan Kiernan Marist College Ashgrove​

Coach: Josh Nielsen St Patrick’s College​

Coach: Andrew Carey St Peter’s Lutheran College​

​

Wednesday June 27th Ballymore​

GPS Gold vs GPS Navy - 5:45pm
AIC v CSS - 7:00pm
Thursday June 28th BallymoreGPS Gold vs CSS - 4.30pmGPS Navy vs AIC - 5.45pmFriday June 29th BallymoreGPS Navy vs CSS - 2:15pmAIC vs GPS Gold - 3:30pm​

​

If you can, get out there and support these boys. Looks like a good team and they will be ready.​