2020 Super Rugby AU Round 4 Waratahs vs Melbourne Rebels

[Rebels3]

As mentioned earlier that the Rebels play a deformed version of Jakeball due to Wessels SA links and especially with Jake White. He was a significant influence on the Brumbies when they were playing Jakeball as an assistant. I get the strong impression he has stripped the Rebels right back to the basics, just like White did with the Brumbies in 2012/13, and is looking to slowly build the club from these foundations. Get the basics right, beat teams on pressure and effort, then every year build something on to the top of this. If people agree with the approach or not is another question, but it’s worked for the Brums over the last 7/8yrs and we are now seeing them producing more expansive rugby built on strong core basics that are culturally ingrained. Let’s be honest what they were attempting the previous two seasons under Wessels was only good enough for mid table results especially with players that lacked the rugby iq to complete the basics under an expansive game plan.

The Rebels have overtaken the Brumbies as the ugliest team to watch in Aus rugby and will continue to drag teams into a dog fight. It’s no coincidence that the 3 worst games of the new season have involved them.

 

[Mr Wobbly]

*snip

• I would estimate that the ball was actually in play for no more than 10 minutes in the first half, and not much more in the second. I do not want to watch teams having mini conferences at stoppages. It should be immediately penalised (long arm). Kickers should get 30 seconds to take a penalty from the time the whistle is blown. They'd immediately eliminate the 90 seconds it takes to get the tee to the kicker by having to kick without a tee. More rugby, less timewasting.

The tinkering that was done with the laws has done SFA insofar as making the game flow better. The only variation that has been worthwhile is the goal line drop-out when the defending team grounds the ball in goal.

They seem to have fixed a problem that never existed and ignored the glaring issue of time wasting at stoppages. I think a full arm penalty is maybe a bit OTT. In the case of line outs, if a team haven't formed their line out in 30 seconds, give the throw to the other side. Same with scrums, take the feed off the attacking team if they're wasting time. Penalties after that.

 

[Brumby Runner]

Gardiner did ruin it a bit, but at the end of the day the Tahs were shit and the Rebels played very well I thought. Waratahs probably threw everything at the Brumbies last week and now need that bye next week. Regroup and get back into it in a fortnight.

A bit like Scotland - beat the Wallabies one week, lose to Fiji the next.

Generally agree KOB, but to my eyes the most detrimental aspect of the Tahs game was an over emphasis on trying to outmuscle the Rebels, especially in the forwards exchanges. It looks like Swinton's hard game against the Reds, was it, has been taken as the blueprint to be followed by the whole pack. Unfortunately, not done with much effect last night. The Rebels pack up finished well on top.

 

[Mr Wobbly]

*snip

The Rebels have overtaken the Brumbies as the ugliest team to watch in Aus rugby and will continue to drag teams into a dog fight. It’s no coincidence that the 3 worst games of the new season have involved them.

I'll take an ugly win over a brave defeat any day

 

[Scooter]

I'll take an ugly win over a brave defeat any day

... particularly when we beat the Tahs, which we haven't done a lot of during the years.

 

[Rebels3]

I'll take an ugly win over a brave defeat any day

Any day of the week

 

[Rugbynutter39]

As mentioned earlier that the Rebels play a deformed version of Jakeball due to Wessels SA links and especially with Jake White. He was a significant influence on the Brumbies when they were playing Jakeball as an assistant. I get the strong impression he has stripped the Rebels right back to the basics, just like White did with the Brumbies in 2012/13, and is looking to slowly build the club from these foundations. Get the basics right, beat teams on pressure and effort, then every year build something on to the top of this. If people agree with the approach or not is another question, but it’s worked for the Brums over the last 7/8yrs and we are now seeing them producing more expansive rugby built on strong core basics that are culturally ingrained. Let’s be honest what they were attempting the previous two seasons under Wessels was only good enough for mid table results especially with players that lacked the rugby iq to complete the basics under an expansive game plan.

The Rebels have overtaken the Brumbies as the ugliest team to watch in Aus rugby and will continue to drag teams into a dog fight. It’s no coincidence that the 3 worst games of the new season have involved them.

As mentioned earlier that the Rebels play a deformed version of Jakeball due to Wessels SA links and especially with Jake White. He was a significant influence on the Brumbies when they were playing Jakeball as an assistant. I get the strong impression he has stripped the Rebels right back to the basics, just like White did with the Brumbies in 2012/13, and is looking to slowly build the club from these foundations. Get the basics right, beat teams on pressure and effort, then every year build something on to the top of this. If people agree with the approach or not is another question, but it’s worked for the Brums over the last 7/8yrs and we are now seeing them producing more expansive rugby built on strong core basics that are culturally ingrained. Let’s be honest what they were attempting the previous two seasons under Wessels was only good enough for mid table results especially with players that lacked the rugby iq to complete the basics under an expansive game plan.

The Rebels have overtaken the Brumbies as the ugliest team to watch in Aus rugby and will continue to drag teams into a dog fight. It’s no coincidence that the 3 worst games of the new season have involved them.

Not attractive to the fans - but you provide food for thought....stripping back to basics does sorta make sense but whether this is true reflection or just your view of what Wessels moot point I guess.

 

[Brumby Runner]

At this stage I'd be tempted with a Lolesio 10, To'omua 12 with JOC (James O'Connor) and/or Harrison on the bench depending. Harrisons accuracy in kicking will be something that makes him well worth consideration. I'd love to see his play behind a strong forward pack. Both JOC (James O'Connor) and To'omua look better running and To'omua is a decent tackler so I'd like him in that 12 channel. Who you put at 13 I'm not sure. Kuridrani has been reliable/serviceable without being a standout of late, Paisami has moments where I love what he brings but there are elements of his game which are not up to scratch.


. anyway I'm starting to divert from what is a Waratahs/Rebels game thread.

MT's running game was excellent last night, but I do take your point that not enough ball gets out to the wings when he's at 10. Deegan's wide passing game and more accurate kicking game from hand are certainly attractive.

Harrison is in tremendous form kicking for goal but his game is very lacking still in most of the aspects of 10 play. Can't see him in contention for a Wallabies spot this year.

 

[Derpus]

MT's running game was excellent last night, but I do take your point that not enough ball gets out to the wings when he's at 10. Deegan's wide passing game and more accurate kicking game from hand are certainly attractive.

Harrison is in tremendous form kicking for goal but his game is very lacking still in most of the aspects of 10 play. Can't see him in contention for a Wallabies spot this year.

MT is a great 12, not 10. That said - i don't think the ball was dying with him at all. It's Meakes. I really don't see what Meakes brings. He's not a great distributor, he's not a particularly effective ball carrier. He's fine in defence but obviously not as good as To'omua.

Deegan looked a bit shaky when he came on but im sure he'd calm down with a bit of time on the field. Rebels would be a far better side with Deegan-To'omua as 10/12. Magnay or English at 13 and Hodge no-where near the field (until he sharpens up his act. What the hell is with his drop in form anyway?)

No point assessing Harrison on last night. 20% possession or something ridiculous and his forwards didn't win a ruck all night. Im pretty sure he still managed to create our only attacking play.

Rebels dominated the tight stuff - but butchered chance after chance after earning the right to go wide. You could see at about the 50 minute mark MK got fed up and just went looking for the ball wherever it was, culminating in a pick and go try (from a fucking winger). It really was hard on the eyeballs.

 

[Rebels3]

Not attractive to the fans - but you provide food for thought..stripping back to basics does sorta make sense but whether this is true reflection or just your view of what Wessels moot point I guess.

Just my thoughts.

 

[Stands]

Did anyone else see the blatant kick to Matt Philips head by Hanigan at the 20th minute?

 

[Tex]

Just logging on to register my delight at beating those east coast elitist flogs on their home turf. Ugly winning isn't the best but it's a shit load better than ugly losing.

 

[Blackadder]

Kick for territory Tahs
Kick to get yourself out of trouble
But for the Love of God Stop bloody kicking it for the bloody sake of it.
Run the ball.

The Game plan of aimless, pointless kicking does not work.

Time to go Whittaker.

 

[Blackadder]

Well done to the Rebels. Good confidence win for you.

Phillip was amazing, sad to see him go.

The last try by koroibete was amazing.

 

[Froggy]

Possibly seeing this slightly differently to a lot of people.
Firstly, the Tahs lost that match due to dreadful discipline. It was just penalty after penalty, plus two yellow cards, which gave the Rebels so much ball and territory they had to win. It was a disgrace, and it wasn't just the youngsters. This needs to be addressed by Penney in a big way, no team is ever going to win a match with 20% of the football, if he fixes nothing else over the bye, this must be priority number one.
The other big negatives for the Tahs were the lineout, which to this week had been very good. Both hookers just seemed to be overthrowing the ball, don't know what's going on there but it needs to be dealt with. The kicking at the end, you've had 20% of the ball, you finally get it on the oppositions half and Hunt, Harrison and Maddocks each decide to kick it away. Run the video, pause it there and say to each of them, 'wtf were you thinking?' Also, Maddocks, so good for the first two games, has completely lost confidence. Not sure how you deal with that, but unless you can he becomes a liability.
For the Rebels, some very good individual performances without question. Pone Fa'amausili is an exciting big unit, hope to see more of him. Philip was industrious, To'omua had a very sound game and Korobeiti was, as always, seriously dangerous. Looking forward to seeing him and Daugunu on the Wallaby wings. However, despite all the praise coming from some quarters (including the Fox commentary team), to have 80% possession and win by two tries to one against one of the weakest sides in the competition is hardly awe-inspiring. They are going to need to be a lot better.
Finally, and with reference to that, I thought it was an inspiring defensive effort by the Tahs, a side who were completely porous before the break. If defence demonstrates the character of a team, this very young side has it in spades. What they are seriously lacking, at this stage anyway is brains.

 

[Rugbynutter39]

Ran into Joey Walton at the Force vs Brumbies game last night - not very big guy to be playing 13 in days of big power centres. But at same time his defensive skills have been very good - in attack not offering so much - which may also reflect he can't have the power a TK has to break tackles etc.

 

[Jimmy_Crouch]

At the beginning of the SRAu season I said we should look at changing the laws for short arm penalties to be taps only. Change some of the scrum laws to result in a short arm only. Refs more likely to to award and game gets moving.

I'd also go for a 10m short arm tap rather than a line drop out for held up over the line. Just get on with the game.

 

[Braveheart81]

Possibly seeing this slightly differently to a lot of people.
Firstly, the Tahs lost that match due to dreadful discipline. It was just penalty after penalty, plus two yellow cards, which gave the Rebels so much ball and territory they had to win. It was a disgrace, and it wasn't just the youngsters. This needs to be addressed by Penney in a big way, no team is ever going to win a match with 20% of the football, if he fixes nothing else over the bye, this must be priority number one.
The other big negatives for the Tahs were the lineout, which to this week had been very good. Both hookers just seemed to be overthrowing the ball, don't know what's going on there but it needs to be dealt with. The kicking at the end, you've had 20% of the ball, you finally get it on the oppositions half and Hunt, Harrison and Maddocks each decide to kick it away. Run the video, pause it there and say to each of them, 'wtf were you thinking?' Also, Maddocks, so good for the first two games, has completely lost confidence. Not sure how you deal with that, but unless you can he becomes a liability.
For the Rebels, some very good individual performances without question. Pone Fa'amausili is an exciting big unit, hope to see more of him. Philip was industrious, To'omua had a very sound game and Korobeiti was, as always, seriously dangerous. Looking forward to seeing him and Daugunu on the Wallaby wings. However, despite all the praise coming from some quarters (including the Fox commentary team), to have 80% possession and win by two tries to one against one of the weakest sides in the competition is hardly awe-inspiring. They are going to need to be a lot better.
Finally, and with reference to that, I thought it was an inspiring defensive effort by the Tahs, a side who were completely porous before the break. If defence demonstrates the character of a team, this very young side has it in spades. What they are seriously lacking, at this stage anyway is brains.

I agree with all of this. The Tahs discipline was just shocking. It wasn't just the penalties but also the dropped balls, overthrown lineouts etc. They had so little ball and basically just gave it away instantly through one of those three things every time they had an opportunity to possess the ball with some field position.

The Rebels were alright but I didn't think they were great. They should have put a lot more points on the Tahs with the amount of ball they had. Credit to the Tahs defence I guess.

Hugely disappointing as a Tahs fan. The team looked like they were substantially improve over the last few weeks and then they went back to square one with a totally listless performance.

 

[Rob42]

I agree with all of this. The Tahs discipline was just shocking. It wasn't just the penalties but also the dropped balls, overthrown lineouts etc. They had so little ball and basically just gave it away instantly through one of those three things every time they had an opportunity to possess the ball with some field position.

The Rebels were alright but I didn't think they were great. They should have put a lot more points on the Tahs with the amount of ball they had. Credit to the Tahs defence I guess.

Hugely disappointing as a Tahs fan. The team looked like they were substantially improve over the last few weeks and then they went back to square one with a totally listless performance.

Yes. The worst thing about being a Tahs fan is that when you're celebrating a great performance by the team, you know you're only a week or two away from a massive disappointment.

I'd like to think this was characteristic of a very young team, struggling to get back up after a Brumbies game that they clearly prepared very hard for, with a short turnaround. But - it's just been such a feature of the Tahs for years, that mind-boggling inconsistency.

 

[Mr Wobbly]

I agree with all of this. The Tahs discipline was just shocking. It wasn't just the penalties but also the dropped balls, overthrown lineouts etc. They had so little ball and basically just gave it away instantly through one of those three things every time they had an opportunity to possess the ball with some field position.

The Rebels were alright but I didn't think they were great. They should have put a lot more points on the Tahs with the amount of ball they had. Credit to the Tahs defence I guess.

Hugely disappointing as a Tahs fan. The team looked like they were substantially improve over the last few weeks and then they went back to square one with a totally listless performance.

The game stats on ESPN look so one-sided that you'd think the scoreline would have been closer to 59-10. Good scrambling defence by the Tahs and lack of finishing ability from the Rebels kept the score down.